Carman Fox

Discussion - Lost another Regular to BBFS... WTF!

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lenny

girls just wanna have fu
May 20, 2004
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Wow, 19% amongst freelance sex workers.

Use a condom. Why take a chance?


Either way, condom or not, there's always "a chance" of HIV infection having sex with SP's,
or anyone else, whether in Thailand or Canada.

For insertive penile to vaginal intercourse:

1. Without a condom, maybe 1 in 50,000 chance each time.
2. Without a condom + circumcised, maybe 1 in 250,000 chance
3. With a condom + not circumcised, maybe 1 in 500,000 chance.
4. Without a condom + recently HIV (An/Ab) tested negative, maybe 1 in a million chance

5. Without a condom in a monogamous relationship with a "good TG", maybe 1 in 500,000 chance.
6. With a condom in a monogamous relationship with a "good TG", maybe 1 in 5 million chance.
7. Add recent HIV (An/Ab) testing to the above 2 & you're virtually like one who's immune to HIV
8. Wank off alone at home to porn, basicly no chance of HIV infection.

9. W/O condom + SP & client agree to not go without latex with anyone else, IOW BBFS monogamy, maybe a 1 in 250,000 chance.
10. Add recent negative HIV (An/Ab) testing to # 9 & it's maybe a 1 in 2 million chance.

Add anal sex, with & especially without a condom, to any of the above & risk goes way up.

Forgoe insertive genital intercourse & substitite HJ, CBJ, BBBJ, DATY, DFK, titty fuc_k, BLS, BBPS, anal licking, mutual masturbation, etc, instead & your safety level goes way up.
 

vancity_cowboy

hard riding member
Jan 27, 2008
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whew... dang it pardners, my head is spinning

there are three kinds of lies in this world...
lies, damn lies and statistics...

- Samuel Clemens
 

Pillowtalk

Banned
Feb 11, 2010
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It can be hard to know what meaning you can take from certain statistics. I think that statistics can be really helpful when looking at population level situations (large groups of people) but can sometimes be more of a problem when you get to the level of the individual person.

An example of this would be with HIV transmission where there are so many variables that change the HIV risk e.g. Is the person on HIV medication, did the person just get HIV a few months ago, does the person have an STI etc…

This means that someone could be receiving vaginal sex and be more at risk for HIV because their partner just got HIV a few months ago (Acute HIV infection when someone has a high viral load ) When compared to the rectal sex they had with someone who has been on the HIV medication for a long time. In this example the vaginal sex would be more risky than the rectal sex.

What I think people can take away is that unprotected vaginal and rectal sex gives a good chance that HIV could be passed to you over time and that condoms work really well at reducing this risk.

The statistics also tell us that the most common STI are chlamydia, herpes simplex virus and HPV.


HN

www.healthnurse.wordpress.com
www.stiresource.com
www.bccdc.ca

Maybe if this is repeated, no one will think lenny is quoting actual facts.
 

lenny

girls just wanna have fu
May 20, 2004
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76
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your GF's panties
Another case of very high infection percentage.

http://www.theprovince.com/news/convicted+assault+trial+loses+appeal/6844043/story.html


With 5 women, 3 contracted HIV. Sounds like the risk of HIV thru bbfs is 60%. A bit different from the 1 in 50,000 some would like us to believe.

If the risk was 60% instead of 1 in 50K, that would mean he only had sex with each lady on average 1 time only! But the article you posted says nothing about the frequency of BBFS with these ladies.

It does post a pic of a black guy. They have a rep for having big hot dogs. So how big were the cum loads full of HIV he was injecting into these females? And how many times a day was this happening? Over how many weeks, months, years? Also how long was each session, since the longer a session the bigger the load? Plus we should also know what his viral load was? Was he taking HIV meds? Were either he or they infected with any STI's? All of these questions and various other issues relate to the rate of transmission, as has already been detailed earlier in this thread.

Does the Health Nurse believe that scientific research [as distinct from Pillowtalk research] indicates the rate of HIV transmission is 60% per sex act with BBFS? I would hope not! LOL

BTW, if it were that high, 60%, it would also mean that transmission with condom use was also very high, since they are related by a factor of 5 to 20 from info i have read & already posted about.

p.s. add a few thousand more "views" to this thread, now that you bumped it, as from my observations BBFS topics usually generate much more interest than the vast majority of other threads.
 
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rider101

New member
Jul 10, 2012
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I have encountered this BBFS phenomenon myself. It really amazes me at how many SP's have tried to have BBFS with me! Many of the Asians on the first visit, but I've had a few caucasian girls try it on the second visit. This is not a racially motivated statement, just a personal factual observation. Obviously when this is attempted I do not revisit as it is tempting and god forbid one gets caught in a moment of weakness!
 
Aug 15, 2006
622
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Excellent point.
I think I would add to his point that if a SP does make the offer, to immediately leave and never revisit. If she's offering it to me, she's probably offered it to others, and not worth the risk IMO, especially when you include other things you may catch.
 

vancity_cowboy

hard riding member
Jan 27, 2008
5,491
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????? I don't follow you.

You wear a condom & practice safer sex for the explicit purpose of protecting yourself from the potential unsafe sexual history of your partner. So now, in this one case where you have stronger evidence of your potential sexual partner having a history of unsafe sexual activity versus no knowledge at all of the true safety of the sexual history of the other SPs you see, you think not seeing her for covered sex addresses a safety issue?

I assume that every SP that I have ever seen has had uncovered sex with their SO at least at some point in their relationship. I also assume that most women and men have more than one SO in their lifetime and thus have had uncovered sex with more than one person and that those partners also had uncovered sex with more than one partner. So whether they offer it to me or not, I assume that BBFS has been a part of their lives at some point & so the risks are the same regardless of any first hand knowledge I might have about any particular lady. If a condom & safe play is sufficient for an encounter with a SP I know nothing about, it's sufficient for one I expect is having frequent unsafe sex but is not showing any symptoms of infection.

Of course, for aesthetic reasons I may find the idea of the lady having frequent uncovered sex with multiple strangers off-putting to the point of losing any sexual desire for her, but this would be a matter of being disgusted & not a safety concern.
...finally some logical thinking - not fearful thinking! :high5:
 

mrdenise

New member
Aug 1, 2012
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Well,

Really helpful post you have shared here, thanks for the sharing that is appreciated by me.

Thanks
 
Sep 15, 2010
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Wow. What an interesting thread.

I have been pooning for a about 3-4 years now and reading this was very informative.

It concerns me to read about sps/clients having bbfs. Just too risky to think about doing. But I guess adults will be adults and each to their own. I personally would not risk my life no matter how exciting or fun it might be.

In my time pooning, I perosnally encountered 2 sps and know of 2 other sps who pretty much offered bbfs (no pms for names please). On one meetup, the sp tried to do me bb in reverse cowgirl. She was teasing me bopping up and down and after about 1 minute of this she was gonna slide my member right into her vag or analy (couldn't see as I was facing her back)I noticed what she was doing and sat up right away and stopped her as soon as I felt my penis being slid into place. Didnt say anything for fear of embarrassing her and requested a condom. This was a first time visit too and she never warned me about it!

On second occasion with another sp about 6 months ago, on only our second rendezvous, small talk/dirty talk/ kissing and heat of the moment activities led to the sp telling me how hot it would be to have skin on skin sex even though she mentioned doing so was "risky". I was shocked, my eyes widened and I was both sexually excited but also uneasy about what to say and do at the moment. She was hot, I'll admit and very healthy looking- for whatever that's worth. We continue to kiss/dirty talk but I think if I wanted to, bbfs was on the table that day. Thankfully temptation lost and logic prevailed and I gestured toward where the condom was and asked her to put it on.

I never again saw these sps.

I am aware of two other sps (have never met) who is offering bbfs in my region from others on this board.

So judging from these posts and from my own experience, bbfs is available out there. I wouldn't say it's rampant but it exists. I am a very health concious, clean and happy individual who enjoys everything life has to offer so bbfs is off the menu for me.

Happy pooning everyone.
EP
 

Georgieboy69

New member
Oct 2, 2008
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I can honestly say that I have never been offered BBFS, by any SP. I know I've been close a couple of times and just when I was going to say something she would stop and put the cover on. Now in never being offered BBFS and by the tone of this thread I am starting to wonder if I have been slighted lol, I guess I am not worthy enough to have even been offered lol.
 

Guardian Angel

Active member
Feb 26, 2006
1,383
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I can honestly say that I have never been offered BBFS, by any SP. Now in never being offered BBFS and by the tone of this thread I am starting to wonder if I have been slighted lol, I guess I am not worthy enough to have even been offered lol.
Consider yourself lucky.

G.A.
 

Hoops

Active member
Jul 17, 2005
1,044
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38
It just means you have good taste. I have NEVER offered it to anyone, and I've only had a few people ask. When they ask? Game over, you lose. Out the door, no envelope returned to you.
Do you do bbbj?
Do you kick the guy out and keep his money if a guy asks for bbbj?
 

lenny

girls just wanna have fu
May 20, 2004
4,101
76
48
your GF's panties
Someone posted this article in the Lounge:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200706/five-shocking-stats-about-men-and-sex

"In Africa alone, AIDS kills some 6,000 people every day. While treatment must be made available for all who need it, some elements of the AIDS epidemic are likely exaggerated. Remember when Surgeon General C. Everett Koop called AIDS "the biggest threat to health this nation has ever faced." (Presumably bigger than cancer, heart disease, obesity, and smoking.) And when Oprah told her viewers: "Research studies now project that one in five heterosexuals could be dead from AIDS..." It seemed as if no one was safe, not even non-drug users, straight men, or housewives.

"But the truth is that HIV isn't nearly as easy to spread through heterosexual sex as many people think. According to a study in the Journal of the American Medical Association, men almost never get HIV from women. A healthy man who has unprotected sex with a non drug-using woman has a one in 5 million chance of getting HIV. If he wears a condom, the odds drop to one in 50 million. And though it's easier for men to infect women, the odds that an HIV-positive man will transmit the virus to a woman through sex are less than one in 1,000.
 
B

BrokeBastard

Someone posted this article in the Lounge:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/articles/200706/five-shocking-stats-about-men-and-sex


"But the truth is that HIV isn't nearly as easy to spread through heterosexual sex as many people think. According to a study in the Journal of the American Medical Association, men almost never get HIV from women. A healthy man who has unprotected sex with a non drug-using woman has a one in 5 million chance of getting HIV. If he wears a condom, the odds drop to one in 50 million. And though it's easier for men to infect women, the odds that an HIV-positive man will transmit the virus to a woman through sex are less than one in 1,000.
There must be a ring of truth to it. With all the aunties offering BBFS at the micros, you'd think there would be an epidemic in Vancouver. And those clients still sleep with their wives, gfs, and other escorts.

Of course play safe and stay away from the aunties unless you like that type of sex.
 

Health Nurse

Supporting Member
Nov 24, 2004
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Thanks for the link to the article in psychology today.

I will be one of the first ones to agree with the article in that HIV did not spread across the world as first thought (lucky for us). When HIV was first discovered the cases were accelerating at an unbelievable rate and there was a real worry that this would continue.

As time has gone we have seen, that even though HIV passes through vaginal and rectal sex that its not super infectious which means you need a few exposures lets say 1 in 1000 for HIV to be passed to you. This means that you need a network of people that are having sex with each other on a frequent basis for HIV to take hold in a community.

I am not sure what statistics they were working on but for such large numbers I think they were just combining your one time chance of getting HIV with how common HIV is in western countries.

I think this way of calculating chances is not very helpful for people on an individual basis. Either you had sex with someone who had HIV or did not have HIV. If they don't have HIV there is no risk to HIV at all. If they have HIV there is a chance HIV could be passed to you depending on what type of sex you had as well as other factors e.g. is it a new HIV infection, are they taking HIV medication etc...

I can't believe they wrote “men almost never get HIV from women” , I guess they ignored the data that most of the men in the world had HIV passed to them from a woman and most woman had HIV passed to them from a man.

There are some countries where HIV has devastated the entire population but for most countries HIV has only hit networks of people were transmission can take place. A few examples of this is.

- people who inject drugs and share needles (and their sexual partners). (HIV passing from blood shared through shared needles or drug equipment)
- Sex workers and their customers. (HIV passing through unprotected vaginal and rectal sex)
- Men who have sex with men. (HIV passing from unprotected rectal sex)

What we have learnt from this is that it seems that HIV just stays in the high risk network and does not have a way of getting into the general population. For example in many Asian countries what you find is sex workers and their customers are having sex in a way which passes HIV which results in sex workers and their customers having high rates of HIV. This HIV then can pass to say the wives of the men who see sex workers but then stops there as it seems the wives are not having frequent risky sex with multiple partners.

To bring this back to a local level this is the same thing we are seeing in BC were HIV seems to be low in the general population but higher in networks of people were HIV is being passed on. Some examples of this are.

- In BC people who inject drugs and share needles (or drug using equipment) and their sexual partners are at higher risk. In Vancouver a study done in 2008 showed a 18.2% HIV prevalence rate in a group of people who were injecting drugs.
- In BC we are seeing a HIV prevalence rate approaching 20% for men who are having sex with men.

Now for the numbers you have all been waiting for what does HIV look like in BC for the people that do sex work indoors and their customers. There have been very little research on this so all I have to go off is the experience of our outreach program and one research study.

Just released is an article titled “Community-Based HIV and STI Prevention in Woman Working in Indoor Sex Markets” The research was carried out in massage parlours located in the lower mainland between 2006 and 2009 they recruited 129 participants and of this 113 agreed to get tested. No one tested positive to HIV. This has also been the experience of our outreach team who works at the bute street clinic and who also did outreach to the massage parlours. Within indoor sex work and their customers it appears HIV is very low.

I just would like to congratulate everyone on this fantastic achievement. It really shows that people can have sex with multiple partners and stop HIV from taking a hold in their community by either using condoms or having sex in a way that does not have a high chance of passing HIV.:clap2::clap2:

You just need to be careful how you think when you get this data. For example I have seen some people at the clinic who say they are not concerned about sex that could pass HIV because the HIV prevalence is so low. This may work for one individual but when more and more people do this the effect is lost.

We have seen this over the last few years with mumps and whooping cough in the lower mainland. People have decided not to get their kids vaccinated against mumps or whooping cough because we were not seeing any outbreaks of these. If just one person did not get vaccinated it would not be a problem but as more and more people did not get vaccinated we started seeing outbreaks again of whooping cough and mumps.



HN
www.smartsexresource.com
 

lenny

girls just wanna have fu
May 20, 2004
4,101
76
48
your GF's panties
I am not sure what statistics they were working on but for such large numbers I think they were just combining your one time chance of getting HIV with how common HIV is in western countries.
I would guess so, though i haven't seen the study referred to.

I can't believe they wrote “men almost never get HIV from women” , I guess they ignored the data that most of the men in the world had HIV passed to them from a woman and most woman had HIV passed to them from a man.
That's a good point. In other articles with the same statement, it is the United States that is meant, according to the context. For example:

http://biohealthinvestor.com/2007/12/hiv-outlook-and-prevalence.html
http://www.onemedplace.com/blog/archives/468
http://www.aliveandwell.org/html/risk_realities/whatever_happened.html

The first article indicated that through 2003 in the USA, the percentage of HIV cases were:

1. homosexual MSM, 45%
2. injecting drug users, 24%
3. both 1 & 2, 6%
4. unknown, 10%
5. heterosexual, 12%

Female to male transmission would be a fraction of the heterosexual percentage of 12% above. So while i wouldn't say female to male HIV infection "almost never" happens in the USA, it is far less common than MSM or IDU cases, especially when considered on a per capita or per sex act basis, since heterosexuals make up the vast majority (90%?) of the population.

"Men who have sex with men: At the beginning of the USA’s epidemic, AIDS primarily affected men who have sex with men (MSM). Today, MSM still account for around three-quarters of HIV diagnoses among male adults and adolescents and the rate of HIV diagnoses among MSM is more than 44 times that of other men.21 According to one study published by the CDC in 2010, one in five MSM in the 21 cities surveyed has HIV and almost half are unaware of their status.22 Gay and bisexual men of all races are the only group where new infections are rising every year...

Injecting drug users: Among those living with an AIDS diagnosis in the US in 2008, around 20 percent were infected with HIV through injecting drug use (IDU).28
http://www.avert.org/america.htm

It seems that Canada largely mirrors the USA in these matters:

http://www.avert.org/canada-hiv.htm
http://www.avert.org/canada-aids.htm
 

kazesora

Banned
Apr 15, 2011
75
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0
We have to die. Maybe tomorrow morning or 100 years later. Anyway..
we have to die.
bbfs... before die is not bed idea. there are More than 10.000 ways to die.
And One of them Is your's. And bbfs is much more safer than smoking cigarret.
its true...
 
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