Why would you refuse basic screening with a reputable provider?

[kelcaine]

I’m really genuinely curious why some gents out there refuse to provide their actual phone numbers, when contacting us on texting apps, or even giving us their names, which is part of very basic screening for a client. This is more in particular for someone who is a reputable provider in the industry at least a couple of years, usually well reviewed, usually has a professional website, usually has a nice incall in a safe neighbourhood, and never known to have done anything to a client to compromise their privacy or safety.

Quite often I get inquires from people using texting apps, but I won’t book through them anymore as they are unreliable (they won’t send or always receive messages or won’t work unless on wifi), plus they are anonymous so I have no idea who is on the other end. I have had most of my no shows and fake bookings by texting apps as well, so a year ago I made a rule not to book through texting apps unless they verify on a legit phone line or here on PERB.

The other thing that perplexes me is when people refuse to give their name or give me acronyms. It’s often “I don’t know your real name so why should I give you mine?”. Or it’s because of their “privacy”.

But why would a reputable provider do anything nefarious with someone’s personal information like their phone number and name? Why would we do anything with it? First messing with the wrong person could compromise our safety. Second, it would be a horrible business move as word would spread and we could lose thousands of dollars and years of building our reputation in the industry. Third, it would be morally wrong to do this. Sure you don’t know me, but I can speak for myself I would never do anything to purposely hurt someone, or put them in danger in any way.

I can see not giving this information to an unknown provider, but booking with someone unknown is all over risky a lot of the time… and you gents have PEEB and its tools to look up providers names, and maybe some experience being burned to see ted flags in an ad or a provider. So really what’s to lose giving your name and actual phone number to a reputable provider? I’m genuinely curious on this.

 

[LLLurkJ2]

Some perberts trust only goes one way, you should trust them but they cant trust you even though you'd have a lot more to loose.

Generally guys are scared you'll try to blackmail them somehow.

 

[kelcaine]

Some perberts trust only goes one way, you should trust them but they cant trust you even though you'd have a lot more to loose.

Generally guys are scared you'll try to blackmail them somehow.

I get that but as a provider with a good reputation, we would have so much to lose. Blackmail is illegal and could follow up with criminal charges. Blackmailing the wrong person could compromise our safety. Blackmailing a client could have a bad review that could lead to losing thousands of dollars and our reputation. It’s also morally wrong, but of course no one would be able to maybe know if one has morals to not do this.

So for someone like myself I would have a lot to lose. I have invested many thousands of dollars into myself and my business as a provider. I would have so much to lose to even try to mess with a client or compromise their privacy in any way. I would hope that potential clients out there would at least see this.

 

[wincity23]

I'm not arguing anything you say but a lot of your post can go both ways. For the record, i've always submitted to screening. The repercussions you face would be of little solace to someone whom lost hundreds of thousands or millions in a divorce, not to mention other issues with family/reputation etc-whether or not we agree that anyone should be lose face because they chose to visit a SW. Providing one's personal info is a risk in todays day and age. A real risk to all involved. ID theft etc. You may be reputable now, but what about 5 years from now? What about your digital security? What happens if your email is hacked? Again, i fully understand your position, and in your shoes would feel exactly the same way but there is another side. At the end of the day, i think that most people being difficult with screening likely don't need to be and probably aren't people you want to see anyways.

 

[OF_manager]

I'm not arguing anything you say but a lot of your post can go both ways. For the record, i've always submitted to screening. The repercussions you face would be of little solace to someone whom lost hundreds of thousands or millions in a divorce, not to mention other issues with family/reputation etc-whether or not we agree that anyone should be lose face because they chose to visit a SW. Providing one's personal info is a risk in todays day and age. A real risk to all involved. ID theft etc. You may be reputable now, but what about 5 years from now? What about your digital security? What happens if your email is hacked? Again, i fully understand your position, and in your shoes would feel exactly the same way but there is another side. At the end of the day, i think that most people being difficult with screening likely don't need to be and probably aren't people you want to see anyways.

I want to clarify that the only type of screening I avoid is sharing a photo of my ID or very personal information. Most providers don't ask for these, so I rarely have screening problems.

BUT

What do we mean by a "reputable provider"? Many aren't as good at protecting privacy as they claim to be. this goes for agencies also.

 

[maniacalone]

Some perberts trust only goes one way, you should trust them but they cant trust you even though you'd have a lot more to loose.

Generally guys are scared you'll try to blackmail them somehow.

Much like the pricing threads that get closed down, this topic has been done to death.

Women have the right to all and any screening procedures they desire. Men have the right to move on with their cash to providers who don’t have as many or any at all.

Accept it or adapt.

 

[kelcaine]

I'm not arguing anything you say but a lot of your post can go both ways. For the record, i've always submitted to screening. The repercussions you face would be of little solace to someone whom lost hundreds of thousands or millions in a divorce, not to mention other issues with family/reputation etc-whether or not we agree that anyone should be lose face because they chose to visit a SW. Providing one's personal info is a risk in todays day and age. A real risk to all involved. ID theft etc. You may be reputable now, but what about 5 years from now? What about your digital security? What happens if your email is hacked? Again, i fully understand your position, and in your shoes would feel exactly the same way but there is another side. At the end of the day, i think that most people being difficult with screening likely don't need to be and probably aren't people you want to see anyways.

But if it’s your name and phone number that isn’t much to ask. Sure if you’re in a relationship seeing a provider can be risky if you got caught, but one’s privacy and loss of money doesn’t compare to our safety and our lives, which is why many of us do some kind of screening to some level. I hear about fellow colleagues being assaulted and murdered every week.

Once again doing anything nefarious with someone’s name and phone number isn’t worth the risk, for those of us who have built a good reputation. I also think if you watch a provider for a while and do some research you can get a feel for the kind of person they are. If they thrive on drama, lie, seem materialistic, are connected to criminal activity etc along with other red flags then one would think it to not be safe to book with them, at all.

Unfortunately there are people who hack into accounts, steal ID, commit identity theft etc, but this happens far more often outside of SW. I also used to work in IT a few years where I saw this being very common especially for larger companies. I was an office administrator for an IT company where part of that business entailed web security. We had many clients who were law firms, golf clubs and large corporations. These companies were high targets for fraud, hacking etc. So much illegal activity exists in the corporate world, opposed to SW, I would say.

You are right with anyone being difficult with screening probably aren’t clients I would want anyways, and I don’t heavily screen either. Thank you for your input.

 

[kelcaine]

Much like the pricing threads that get closed down, this topic has been done to death.

Women have the right to all and any screening procedures they desire. Men have the right to move on with their cash to providers who don’t have as many or any at all.

Accept it or adapt.

I’m sure you’re right. I have been doing this for 2 years now, so I’m still newish to the industry overall. My apologies if this topic has been discussed many times before. I was just genuinely curious about this. Thank you.

 

[Americanboy]

Choose whatever screening method you would like.

Just remember that if you screen clients more heavily, you might end up with fewer clients, especially if you start asking for personal information.

Many men hire escorts for privacy. If you are less discreet than an ordinary girl or a sugar baby, you may lose a lot of potential clients.

In any business, there will be people who are willing to take more risks. These individuals may gain more clients as a result of their risk-taking.

 

[Cock Throppled]

I can't see how knowing a client''s name and phone number would do anything but offer a false sense of safety. How could it possiby protect an SP from assault, or worse?

Surely common sense things make SP's safer, like not doing private home outcalls, not doing car dates, not advertising between midnight and 5AM, having a nearby security contact, talking on phone with potential clients to get a feel for their demeanor or whether they might be using or drunk.

 

[blakealridge]

Thread locked in 3…

 

[wincity23]

But if it’s your name and phone number that isn’t much to ask. Sure if you’re in a relationship seeing a provider can be risky if you got caught, but one’s privacy and loss of money doesn’t compare to our safety and our lives, which is why many of us do some kind of screening to some level. I hear about fellow colleagues being assaulted and murdered every week.

Once again doing anything nefarious with someone’s name and phone number isn’t worth the risk, for those of us who have built a good reputation. I also think if you watch a provider for a while and do some research you can get a feel for the kind of person they are. If they thrive on drama, lie, seem materialistic, are connected to criminal activity etc along with other red flags then one would think it to not be safe to book with them, at all.

Unfortunately there are people who hack into accounts, steal ID, commit identity theft etc, but this happens far more often outside of SW. I also used to work in IT a few years where I saw this being very common especially for larger companies. I was an office administrator for an IT company where part of that business entailed web security. We had many clients who were law firms, golf clubs and large corporations. These companies were high targets for fraud, hacking etc. So much illegal activity exists in the corporate world, opposed to SW, I would say.

You are right with anyone being difficult with screening probably aren’t clients I would want anyways, and I don’t heavily screen either. Thank you for your input.

There's no doubt the provider is the one carrying the bulk of the risk. I agree with you-money is not equal to one's life. However, the question posed was why and it comes down to perception and reality and one's perception is their reality. The first time i submitted to screening i was awfully paranoid and worried. The provider was very reputable-as much as i could ascertain anyways. Still-i was so uncomfortable. We've all had credit cards compromised simply by doing business with reputable companies. One's mind can wander to many places. "Hey-i'm a nice guy, i'm going to be super sweet and we're just going to have a nice time-what's the big deal?" This is my reality. Not all of us take the time to put ourselves in someone else's shoes. This is why a client isn't thinking about your safety necessarily, only themselves. In their mind, you are safe, it is them at risk with their info. I can imagine a SW perception is vastly different. "Is this guy going to jekyll/hyde me? Am i risking my safety/health/life taking this appointment? It was the act of trying to put myself in someone's shoes that allowed me to get over my paranoia and screen properly. Now, i would still be very selective about what level of screening and to whom it's provided but you can't have it both ways. One cannot expect to visit any lady they would like without assuming some risk because the lady's are.

 

[RedDragon64]

Both providers and clients need to find an arrangement that suits their needs. While they may not understand or agree with those needs; if they can't come to an agreement then they should politely move on.

For myself, I am willing to pay a deposit and provide some screening details to a provider that has already passed my screening (reliable reviews, and social media screening). I try offer some latitude in what screening I will provide such as references, and links to my own social media or LinkedIn. However until now I have not provided a photo-ID because of security concerns. Regardless of how much I trust the provider with that information, I cannot trust that the provider is able to reliably keep that information secure. This is really not a reflection on the provider, because most people (and even many companies) are incapable of keeping information secure.

 

[$Mansion]

Too add on,

Many providers are only "reputable" until you leave an even slightly negative review, then they will start threatening you, trying to doxx you, and try using their "provider only forums" to leak your personal info.

I can see why many guys are wary of giving their personal info to providers if thats how "reputable providers" are acting

 

[Illuminated]

I don't believe someone providing you their real number and name will keep you safe. If someone had bad intentions whether they gave you their real number or not you will still be in danger.
Sometimes six sense / feelings help. If you open the door and you feel something is off, it is best to just say no.
The problem I see from a client's perspective of providing personal info is when the provider actually gets hurt by someone else. When the police investigate, they will have many names and numbers. Do you want to be a witness? A provider may seem reputable, built a decent online profile, but that profile relates to this business. You do not know what the provider in her personal life hangs with or side hustle is. And if their personal life business is not legit and they get their phone seized.... you can guess what happens....

 

[kelcaine]

I don't believe someone providing you their real number and name will keep you safe. If someone had bad intentions whether they gave you their real number or not you will still be in danger.
Sometimes six sense / feelings help. If you open the door and you feel something is off, it is best to just say no.
The problem I see from a client's perspective of providing personal info is when the provider actually gets hurt by someone else. When the police investigate, they will have many names and numbers. Do you want to be a witness? A provider may seem reputable, built a decent online profile, but that profile relates to this business. You do not know what the provider in her personal life hangs with or side hustle is. And if their personal life business is not legit and they get their phone seized.... you can guess what happens....

I agree with this, which is why it’s important for clients to do some research on providers as well. I do see red flags talked about a lot with ads & social media where if there is any possible connection to criminal activity then it’s smart to avoid that provider. I also use my intuition when booking my clients, which is why I don’t do intense screening personally. I have not booked many clients because something felt off or cancelled appointments. Unfortunately I have had some of these people try to book me through texting apps, which is one reason I don’t book through them. Same for clients I saw I don’t want to see again because I didn’t feel safe or other reasons.

I do appreciate the answers here to see the other side of clients and their concerns when booking providers and screening methods we have. I really was genuinely curious and appreciative of everyone’s time who contributed here.

If this thread gets locked down, so be it, as my questions were pretty much answered here. I appreciate understanding clients perspectives on things, not just my own. So thank you.

 

[lukom]

Being reputable doesn't mean that a person will always be reputable. It doesn't mean that a person who's presently sober won't relapse. I'll add an even more personal story here.


An sp I used to see a lot pre-covid who was
not face out, we even knew eachother by our real names. During sumer 2020 she posted a bunch of new pics of herself being face out on LL. The way she did it seemed completely out of character and I messaged her from my phone, which was a legit number, but from a burner phone. I only asked her how she was doing and if I could send her anything like an Doordash or etransfer. She never got back to me. Days later I had a bunch of missed calls. It was VPD. She was found dead and they were hoping to find out more info. It turned out she had OD'd. I was never aware she fell into using again, after being sober. This tragedy still haunts me as this was someone I befriended prior to all this and wished I could have helped her. Being called by police though about this girl after she was found deceased was an eye opener for me.

Further to that I'm very private on this forum and don't give details that can get me doxxed.
I've had a couple of newly advertising ladies hoping to get a review DM me even offering a generous discount for a session and i has to decline as circumstances at the times wouldnt allow, it wouldnt be a genuine review (as the service would have come with comditions), and it would be outing who i am. I had an SP later in 2020 who was an ATF, and who later retired text me telling me that there was an SP on PERB trying to get the personal info of some members and that my handle had come up in this private whatsapp group that some SP's were/are using at the time.

Bottom line is there is nothing to protect me from being blackmailed, threatened, or anything and while sex workers are vulnerable and at high risk... they're allowed to continue operating in their profession where in my case as a client, I'm doing something illegal. For the SP's who have screening methods that requires my personal info, good for them, I stick to similarly reputable providers who don't require that info.

I hope a day comes where decriminalization can change that for all parties to have a certain guarantee of safety and privacy. For now, I'll stick to what I do.

 

[westwoody]

But if it’s your name and phone number that isn’t much to ask

Name and phone number can be googled and will often reveal a surprising amount of information.

 

[kelcaine]

Being reputable doesn't mean that a person will always be reputable. It doesn't mean that a person who's presently sober won't relapse. I'll add an even more personal story here.


An sp I used to see a lot pre-covid who was
not face out, we even knew eachother by our real names. During sumer 2020 she posted a bunch of new pics of herself being face out on LL. The way she did it seemed completely out of character and I messaged her from my phone, which was a legit number, but from a burner phone. I only asked her how she was doing and if I could send her anything like an Doordash or etransfer. She never got back to me. Days later I had a bunch of missed calls. It was VPD. She was found dead and they were hoping to find out more info. It turned out she had OD'd. I was never aware she fell into using again, after being sober. This tragedy still haunts me as this was someone I befriended prior to all this and wished I could have helped her. Being called by police though about this girl after she was found deceased was an eye opener for me.

Further to that I'm very private on this forum and don't give details that can get me doxxed.
I've had a couple of newly advertising ladies hoping to get a review DM me even offering a generous discount for a session and i has to decline as circumstances at the times wouldnt allow, it wouldnt be a genuine review (as the service would have come with comditions), and it would be outing who i am. I had an SP later in 2020 who was an ATF, and who later retired text me telling me that there was an SP on PERB trying to get the personal info of some members and that my handle had come up in this private whatsapp group that some SP's were/are using at the time.

Bottom line is there is nothing to protect me from being blackmailed, threatened, or anything and while sex workers are vulnerable and at high risk... they're allowed to continue operating in their profession where in my case as a client, I'm doing something illegal. For the SP's who have screening methods that requires my personal info, good for them, I stick to similarly reputable providers who don't require that info.

I hope a day comes where decriminalization can change that for all parties to have a certain guarantee of safety and privacy. For now, I'll stick to what I do.

Thank you for sharing. I’m sorry this happened to you with the provider, that must have been really overwhelming to experience her passing and the police being involved. You make some overall great points and I appreciate your experience and perspective.

I do also agree seeing decriminalization would be so beneficial not just for us, but for everyone who sees providers where it would give more rights and protection for us all, and see a decrease in the infiltration of criminal activity in this industry. Thank you for your comment.

 

[westwoody]

As lukom said people can change.
I have seen providers who were unbeknownst to me married or in a relationship. The guy has access to all the info you give to the lady. He may even be doing all her texts.
Then one day they have a nasty break up and he decides to fuck her up by messing up her customers.