Who Wants an Industry Controlled Replacement for BackPage and LeoList?

[treveller]

It seems there are problems with both BackPage and LeoList. I have heard it would cost around $50,000 to design a replacement using open source code.

Would workers be willing to switch over and support a site that they designed and controlled through some sort of COOP?

Would workers and clients be willing to put up the cash on a loan or share basis for developing the system?

I don't know about LeoList but BackPage is making millions every year. It should be possible for an industry friendly non profit replacement to give better more reliable service at a lower cost, first paying back the investors then giving back to the community.

If nothing else, a credible threat of being replaced would help keep the existing services in line to some degree.

 

[Warl0ck]

It seems there are problems with both BackPage and LeoList. I have heard it would cost around $50,000 to design a replacement using open source code.

Would workers be willing to switch over and support a site that they designed and controlled through some sort of COOP?

Would workers and clients be willing to put up the cash on a loan or share basis for developing the system?

I don't know about LeoList but BackPage is making millions every year. It should be possible for an industry friendly non profit replacement to give better more reliable service at a lower cost, first paying back the investors then giving back to the community.

If nothing else, a credible threat of being replaced would help keep the existing services in line to some degree.

**WARNING, THIS POST WILL OFFEND**

Theoretically, it sounds like a good idea to have the "industry" develop and create a new medium for advertising sex work. The reality, I suspect, would be far different. First of all you need to understand that SP's don't always get along. In fact, some of them strongly dislike each other and make a very serious effort at destroying each other. Within 6 months you'd have this monumental cluster fuck of forum versus forum, each person raging against the other, etc. Toss in the agenda's of some SP's into the mix.

What would work best (I think) is if the review boards etc were managed by people outside of the industry. Kind if like how companies put people on their board of directors who have zero experience in the industry but are brought to the table to expand horizons. Problem is, who wants to do this? My job has a lot of headaches. A lot of them. When I think about being an escort review board owner I get more of a headache. I try to imagine waking up, opening my email to find a sea of email of people complaining about things and people flagging posts (because dear god they just can't not read them).

BP makes money on selling a lot of things. It's not focused on just selling pussy. Leolist is the same.

Who knows, we live in an era of innovation. Maybe someone will come up with a neat way of doing something new for this business. Be what Uber was to Taxi's. Me, I've got bigger plans. I plan to cartoonize Perb into a sort of cartoon TV show. Then I post, outrage ensues, death threats received and I make money. That good old American way. For example, I'm going to make the character of Papacito this guy, with a bull horn, standing on the corner with a giant sign telling the world of the misgivings and lies of sex sites. He'll jump in front of people and shout "These ASIAN massage ads, they're FAKE NEWS, they're evil, Perb Jesus is coming !. of course there is no Perb Jesus but if there was..he' wouldn't even wait for his Uber to arrive. He'd get the fuck out ASAP

 

[escapefromstress]

It seems there are problems with both BackPage and LeoList. I have heard it would cost around $50,000 to design a replacement using open source code.

Would workers be willing to switch over and support a site that they designed and controlled through some sort of COOP?

Would workers and clients be willing to put up the cash on a loan or share basis for developing the system?

I don't know about LeoList but BackPage is making millions every year. It should be possible for an industry friendly non profit replacement to give better more reliable service at a lower cost, first paying back the investors then giving back to the community.

If nothing else, a credible threat of being replaced would help keep the existing services in line to some degree.

This has already been done several times by SP's (some of them from Vancouver) and the websites are a failure, no one has heard of them or used them after years of them being online.

There's also a couple new review boards that are owned and operated by SP's, and I doubt they'll be successful either.

I'm not saying you should stop trying to come up with something better, but you'd need a lot of money, perseverance, and good connections in the industry to make it happen.

 

[sybian]

You also need someone to provide quality control............I will need a case of Viagra in my tool belt, and a company spending account.

 

[UhOh]

What does "Industry Controlled" mean? SP's and pooners have different interests to look out for. You may wish to think they're both on the same side of the issues but they're not.

 

[lenny]

What does "Industry Controlled" mean? SP's and pooners have different interests to look out for. You may wish to think they're both on the same side of the issues but they're not.

Who controls PERB, TERB, MERB & other similar sites? The owners, mods & paying advertisers? The non paying members/clients?

Would the latter have more control if they had the option of paying an annual fee in exchange for special privileges?

Why do people place ads on BP & LL instead of PERB?

 

[johnA27]

Who controls PERB, TERB, MERB & other similar sites? The owners, mods & paying advertisers? The non paying members/clients?

Would the latter have more control if they had the option of paying an annual fee in exchange for special privileges?

Why do people place ads on BP & LL instead of PERB?

Unfortunately paying a fee online usually involves a credit card (discretion?), or something complicated like setting up bitcoin transactions. Its not as simple as handing over a 20 dollar bill. It'd deter a lot of pooners.

 

[lenny]

Unfortunately paying a fee online usually involves a credit card (discretion?), or something complicated like setting up bitcoin transactions. Its not as simple as handing over a 20 dollar bill. It'd deter a lot of pooners.

Good point. I'm sure that would be a concern.

I wonder if an unsigned bank draft/money order would work, with the PERB username written on it. Or some kind of anonymous gift card or credit card. Maybe twenty dollars could be sent through snail mail or dropped off in an envelope somewhere? Or one's favorite SP could take care of it for you, using your member handle, not your real name.

I'm not sure what privileges could be obtained for 20 loonies. Maybe 200 per year would get something significant. What do advertisers pay & what special privileges do they get?

I'm looking forward to changing my colour from blue to hot pink ;

Perhaps if a new mod position was added and auctioned up it would go for a tidy sum ;

 

[Damaged]

Listen not to the naysayers. If you feel strongly about doing this then pursue it, you only live once. Most wonderful inventions would have never happened if they had listened to all the people who said "Don't do it", "It can't be done", "It's been done before", " You'll fail".

 

[escapefromstress]

Fiddy has some great ideas and the skills to make it happen. You should connect with him. I think he's a member here.

 

[Emmy_St_Claire]

Why do people place ads on BP & LL instead of PERB?

A Leolist ad is $1.99 ($0.00 on the Island)
A Perb ad is minimum $50.00

 

[Emmy_St_Claire]

^^regular price of LL companion section ad is 2.49USD per bump.

Perb ad minimum is now $56.50CAD for 10 days

I was comparing the two cheapest possible prices for each site (1.99 for a verified ad)

Perb price has risen again??!!! This is getting crazy. I don't think I'm going to continue advertising here anymore

In the Vancouver Island section, your ad is immediately buried beneath Class Choice agency postings. They post multiple times a day sometimes, which frankly makes the whole section look like spam (typically 70-90% of the ads on each page will be by CCE). Very annoying. The only way to not be lost in a sea of Class Choice ads is to post super frequently, which I personally think looks desperate and would probably lead to guys trying to low-ball you in the belief that you're hard up for business.

I think the rising cost of advertising has created a feedback loop. As the price rose, girls posted fewer ads, which means that the advertisers who remain are now constantly buried by Class Choice, which means even FEWER girls think it’s even worth it to pay to advertise here.

There used to be SO MANY indies posting ads in the Vancouver Island section, now there are maybe 5 of us, plus visiting girl ads.

 

[johnA27]

I was comparing the two cheapest possible prices for each site (1.99 for a verified ad)

Perb price has risen again??!!! This is getting crazy. I don't think I'm going to continue advertising here anymore
In the Vancouver Island section, your ad is immediately buried beneath Class Choice agency postings. They post multiple times a day sometimes, which frankly makes the whole section look like spam. Very annoying. The only way to not be lost in a sea of Class Choice ads is to post super frequently, which I personally think looks desperate and would probably lead to guys trying to low-ball you in the belief that you're hard up for business.

end rant

Agreed on how annoying Class Choice's spam is, sometimes you just get the impression that there are no new ads in that section because they post so much. Not to mention they're not even that great of an agency, think most people can agree on that one.

Unfortunately though, I seek providers at a pretty low amount myself, and only do use perb to find legitimate, high quality providers. I am sure there are plenty of gems that dont advertise here, I dont know if there's other forums to look at instead of sifting through the sea that is LL.

 

[Emmy_St_Claire]

I would love it if perb switched to a "pay per ad" system. Would really cut down on the spamming, and they'd probably make more money in the long run because girls would actually want to advertise here again.

 

[escapefromstress]

I would love it if perb switched to a "pay per ad" system. Would really cut down on the spamming, and they'd probably make more money in the long run because girls would actually want to advertise here again.

Posted recently on terb:

The moderation team is reviewing the guidelines for advertisers. Please forward your input to Fred Zed or Mark Service.

Now might be a good time to present your ideas.

 

[Emmy_St_Claire]

^awesome thanks!! I will do

 

[Warl0ck]

Pay per post might work. When you increase the complexity of the options for payment/features, you add overhead and that requires well paid IT guys who design, develop and keep things working. Of course it's likely that individual costs per advertising would be higher.

As for the option to pay with bitcoin, etc, again that adds complexity. I actually inquired about advertising and I felt that PERB could use more options for payment. The problem is that increases costs & the owners of the site may not understand things like Bitcoin, etc. I think Prepaid credit card is the best option for those seeking to be a bit on the anonymous side.

Now as to how to increase the number of women advertising here. I'm speaking strictly from years ago when I was in regular touch with some SP's. The general feeling I got is that they left escort review forums because they didn't feel there was value & the granular & sometimes harsh nature of reviews got to them. I recall one of them saying "I'm tired of being picked apart like some piece of meat". That goes back maybe 3-4 years, but the woman in question still works in the industry.

Perb is a very different advertising platform than Leolist. Leolist is pretty 'static' as an advertising platform. The ads are carbon copies of each other (pretty much). Perb goes a little deeper. Aside from the women being reviewed, it allows the women to participate and engage others. I've always felt this humanizes the sex worker. She becomes more than a "doll"; she becomes a thinking human being. Unfortunately the nature of sharing opinions online often erupts into disagreement. I'm speaking personally now but an SP's presence on the forum (especially if it demonstrates a thoughtful intelligent female) would play a major part in my decision on whether I'd consider purchasing sex from her. Unfortunately it can be very risk for a female to share her opinions on this forum.

 

[Fred Zed]

I was comparing the two cheapest possible prices for each site (1.99 for a verified ad)

Perb price has risen again??!!! This is getting crazy. I don't think I'm going to continue advertising here anymore

In the Vancouver Island section, your ad is immediately buried beneath Class Choice agency postings. They post multiple times a day sometimes, which frankly makes the whole section look like spam (typically 70-90% of the ads on each page will be by CCE). Very annoying. The only way to not be lost in a sea of Class Choice ads is to post super frequently, which I personally think looks desperate and would probably lead to guys trying to low-ball you in the belief that you're hard up for business.

I think the rising cost of advertising has created a feedback loop. As the price rose, girls posted fewer ads, which means that the advertisers who remain are now constantly buried by Class Choice, which means even FEWER girls think it’s even worth it to pay to advertise here.

There used to be SO MANY indies posting ads in the Vancouver Island section, now there are maybe 5 of us, plus visiting girl ads.

I heard that for $ 100 plus HST = $113 a month, ( which is a tax deductible write off ) comes out to $ 3.77 per day is quite reasonable for advertising here. Remember, unlike backpages, etc, this is a community, one that allows you to socialize and interact with not only your fellow workers, but your prospective clients as well. The backpage client is a very different client than the PERBite. As the new administrator on all 3 boards, we are looking at making quite a few improvements to the boards. For example on TERB and MERB, we only allow one ad per day, this eliminates annoying spamming. Changes coming, all in good time. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Jess

 

[Emmy_St_Claire]

I heard that for $ 100 plus HST = $113 a month, ( which is a tax deductible write off ) comes out to $ 3.77 per day is quite reasonable for advertising here. Remember, unlike backpages, etc, this is a community, one that allows you to socialize and interact with not only your fellow workers, but your prospective clients as well. The backpage client is a very different client than the PERBite. As the new administrator on all 3 boards, we are looking at making quite a few improvements to the boards. For example on TERB and MERB, we only allow one ad per day, this eliminates annoying spamming. Changes coming, all in good time. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Jess

I appreciate the effort you guys are putting in!

I agree that $133 is theoretically a good deal (especially if that 113 now gets a full month of advertising, rather than the current ~23.5), but I can tell you for certain that many indies I know in Victoria simply don't think it's worth it because of how spammy our Vancouver Island sections looks.
If you're open to suggestions, I think a great way to reduce the spam in the Victoria section would be implementing a rule like "no one account can have more than two ads posted IN A ROW", which would get rid of the problem of Class Choice flooding the pages with 9 or 10 consecutive ads. Or maybe separating the indy and agency ads into two sub forums. Massage providers could be combined with the indies since we don't have a big massage parlour scene on the Island.

Looking forward to seeing whatever changes you guys make, keep up the good work

 

[Fred Zed]

then lets do something about that Vancouver island section you are referring to and make it more user friendly for all (There is nothing more I hate than spamming), and maybe come up with some ideas or incentives to encourage more traffic. . To be perfectly honest with you, since we took over about a month ago, I haven't really been spending a lot of time here on the west coast forum but that is now gonna change. I will definitely do my best to make this one of the best communities possible. Once again, any suggestions that you may have, wont go on deaf ears I promise.

Jess