The Israel vs Hamas

[80watts]

It a big thing in the news these days.
The IDF is softening up targets for land invasion of Gaza. I hope the IDF takes down Hamas for good. No more rocket attacks. No more will the Hamas leaders operate/hide under hospitals. The US isa sending aircraft carrier to say to the other countries in the region, don't even think about attacking Israel.

I know alot of people don't like the idea of bombing hospitals, or innocent bystanders. But here is the case; Hamas is the elected government of Gaza (ok only 1 election in 2005/6), It constantly fires rockets into Israel, and it hides in the civilian population, hoping the killing of its innocent population will gather support against Israel. Or the population is too scared to remove/vote out Hamas. I look at the situation now as the IDF is going in and taking out Hamas, and alot of innocents will get killed. The people of Gaza should of removed Hamas years ago if they wanted peace. Now they pay the price of inaction against Hamas. It really sucks for them, but they have chosen their side by inaction. Look at the history of rocket attacks, a rocket is fired into Israel, and Israel bombs where the rocket came from or a higher level target.

As to one of the main root cause of the Palestinians against Israel, it was the creation of Israel in 1948. There is hardly any one left alive from 1948 that lives in Gaza, Israel and the West Bank today. There is alot more shit/crap and other grieviences.
I will say that historically, if you conquer a land and can hang on to that land, it is yours. Something like possession is 9/10 the law....

 

[overdone]

It a big thing in the news these days.
The IDF is softening up targets for land invasion of Gaza. I hope the IDF takes down Hamas for good. No more rocket attacks. No more will the Hamas leaders operate/hide under hospitals. The US isa sending aircraft carrier to say to the other countries in the region, don't even think about attacking Israel.

I know alot of people don't like the idea of bombing hospitals, or innocent bystanders. But here is the case; Hamas is the elected government of Gaza (ok only 1 election in 2005/6), It constantly fires rockets into Israel, and it hides in the civilian population, hoping the killing of its innocent population will gather support against Israel. Or the population is too scared to remove/vote out Hamas. I look at the situation now as the IDF is going in and taking out Hamas, and alot of innocents will get killed. The people of Gaza should of removed Hamas years ago if they wanted peace. Now they pay the price of inaction against Hamas. It really sucks for them, but they have chosen their side by inaction. Look at the history of rocket attacks, a rocket is fired into Israel, and Israel bombs where the rocket came from or a higher level target.

As to one of the main root cause of the Palestinians against Israel, it was the creation of Israel in 1948. There is hardly any one left alive from 1948 that lives in Gaza, Israel and the West Bank today. There is alot more shit/crap and other grieviences.
I will say that historically, if you conquer a land and can hang on to that land, it is yours. Something like possession is 9/10 the law....

too scared?

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/ja...tilities-isnt-collective-punishment-by-israel

just like the Afgans

who our media keeps trying to portray as innocents

it's the opposite

the majority aren't opposed to Hamas or the Taliban's ideology, values

you can't rule a people/nation/country without the populous' willingness

the Children might be innocent, not for long though

there are plenty of documentations of the indoctrination in the UN run schools, which the Turd restored funding to

of teaching them to hate Jews

the Population knows where Hamas is hiding, how do you think the Israels know where to bomb

do you see any in the Arab world telling them to snitch on them?

go, the men, confront them, there are far more of them than Hamas, get the hostages, return them

then let the IDF come in and destroy Hamas

then negotiate peace

that's as likely as Gazans being against Hamas, a majority of them

 

[MikeyLikey99]

I wonder what you’re trying to achieve posting on this topic. There’s a very complicated history involved and it’s involving all sorts of shades of gray. Whichever side people support, I would hope everybody thinks it’s appalling to be targeting and killing civilians.

 

[Bridge]

It a big thing in the news these days.
The IDF is softening up targets for land invasion of Gaza. I hope the IDF takes down Hamas for good. No more rocket attacks. No more will the Hamas leaders operate/hide under hospitals. The US isa sending aircraft carrier to say to the other countries in the region, don't even think about attacking Israel.

I know alot of people don't like the idea of bombing hospitals, or innocent bystanders. But here is the case; Hamas is the elected government of Gaza (ok only 1 election in 2005/6), It constantly fires rockets into Israel, and it hides in the civilian population, hoping the killing of its innocent population will gather support against Israel. Or the population is too scared to remove/vote out Hamas. I look at the situation now as the IDF is going in and taking out Hamas, and alot of innocents will get killed. The people of Gaza should of removed Hamas years ago if they wanted peace. Now they pay the price of inaction against Hamas. It really sucks for them, but they have chosen their side by inaction. Look at the history of rocket attacks, a rocket is fired into Israel, and Israel bombs where the rocket came from or a higher level target.

As to one of the main root cause of the Palestinians against Israel, it was the creation of Israel in 1948. There is hardly any one left alive from 1948 that lives in Gaza, Israel and the West Bank today. There is alot more shit/crap and other grieviences.
I will say that historically, if you conquer a land and can hang on to that land, it is yours. Something like possession is 9/10 the law....

Actually the story goes further back to the Balfour Declaration in 1917.

 

[MikeyLikey99]

It’s just seems like a really divisive and polarizing topic to bring up here in our community at the moment.
We are all about free speech though, so let’s keep it classy at least.

 

[westwoody]

Balfour was typical of the attitudes of the great powers of the day.
They carved up chunks of land for each other with total disregard for the residents. This resulted in hostility between groups that had previously had their own territory but were forced together.
Israelis vs Palestinians is small potatoes compared to the Tutsi vs Hutu. I’d bet more have died ( over the same time frame) in Shia vs Shiite conflict than the entire Israeli existence.

 

[80watts]

I wonder what you’re trying to achieve posting on this topic. There’s a very complicated history involved and it’s involving all sorts of shades of gray. Whichever side people support, I would hope everybody thinks it’s appalling to be targeting and killing civilians.

Discussion. Where people stand. A way to further understand the situation.
Its not as simple as Abraham spanking his 2 kids and telling them they have to share.

 

[lukom]

the Children might be innocent, not for long though

By those standards you're saying Hamas is warranted to target civilians, as all Israeli citizens are obliged to be militarily trained and prepared for war.

 

[lukom]

As to one of the main root cause of the Palestinians against Israel, it was the creation of Israel in 1948. There is hardly any one left alive from 1948 that lives in Gaza, Israel and the West Bank today. There is alot more shit/crap and other grieviences.
I will say that historically, if you conquer a land and can hang on to that land, it is yours.

There's hardly still anyone left who survived the holocaust, but we still talk about it and speak up against its reoccurrence. Furthermore, we can't forget the children and grandchildren who came to be impacted by thr ptsd that followed for those people on both sides.
If historically you conquer a land it's yours, then historically the occupier was also fair game to all sorts of resistance and potential brutality from the conquered side. Time will tell who will be left.

 

[Lo-ki]

I can’t wait for China vs Taiwan……

 

[blondeluver]

I can’t wait for China vs Taiwan……

If that day does come, it will be finished in 48 hours! Firstly, send all 3 Flattops to encircle the island from all sides... loaded with DF-17 & DF-27 to sink others who may try to interfere. Secondly, Bombard the island's defensive positions using massive long range Artillery from Fujian province & flattops. Then send in Type 055 destroyers & Type 075 amphibious assault ships with troops and armors under the artillery cover and land at Taichung & Tainan area as well as Taitung. Mean while, DF-26 will target the Presidential palace & neutralize the PAC-3 in Taipei. SU-35, J-20, J-16, J-15, KJ-600 & KJ-500 will control the island's air space and destroy the old F-16's & Mirage 2000's. GJ-2 & GJ-11 will patrol Taipei sky and destroy the runway's at airports... By the time the Japanese has a chance to react and help, it is almost all over already. But I am sure they want to retake the island using peaceful means because that saves money for reconstructions afterward and also, the people of the island will not resist or hate them as much! hahaha...

 

[Lo-ki]

Point taken….
On the same token…..if Russia really wanted Ukraine….. they could have done it in a week.

 

[zippy45]

If that day does come, it will be finished in 48 hours! Firstly, send all 3 Flattops to encircle the island from all sides... loaded with DF-17 & DF-27 to sink others who may try to interfere. Secondly, Bombard the island's defensive positions using massive long range Artillery from Fujian province & flattops. Then send in Type 055 destroyers & Type 075 amphibious assault ships with troops and armors under the artillery cover and land at Taichung & Tainan area as well as Taitung. Mean while, DF-26 will target the Presidential palace & neutralize the PAC-3 in Taipei. SU-35, J-20, J-16, J-15, KJ-600 & KJ-500 will control the island's air space and destroy the old F-16's & Mirage 2000's. GJ-2 & GJ-11 will patrol Taipei sky and destroy the runway's at airports... By the time the Japanese has a chance to react and help, it is almost all over already. But I am sure they want to retake the island using peaceful means because that saves money for reconstructions afterward and also, the people of the island will not resist or hate them as much! hahaha...

wtf? does china even have flattops? (carriers)

 

[zippy45]

Point taken….
On the same token…..if Russia really wanted Ukraine….. they could have done it in a week.

Russia has been proven to be a paper tiger, without nukes they are nothing, which we should have learned from Afghanistan

 

[blondeluver]

wtf? does china even have flattops? (carriers)

They have 3

 

[Sonny69]

This topic is very complex. One thing is certain both sides are guilty. I feel for the innocent lives taken, in particular the innocent women and children killed by both the Israelis and Palestinians. Both sides have committed war crimes and should be held accountable.

 

[westwoody]

Tell me this bullshit is not organized

 

[Once you go black]

I wonder what you’re trying to achieve posting on this topic. There’s a very complicated history involved and it’s involving all sorts of shades of gray. Whichever side people support, I would hope everybody thinks it’s appalling to be targeting and killing civilians.

Agreed

 

[80watts]

If that day does come, it will be finished in 48 hours! Firstly, send all 3 Flattops to encircle the island from all sides... loaded with DF-17 & DF-27 to sink others who may try to interfere. Secondly, Bombard the island's defensive positions using massive long range Artillery from Fujian province & flattops. Then send in Type 055 destroyers & Type 075 amphibious assault ships with troops and armors under the artillery cover and land at Taichung & Tainan area as well as Taitung. Mean while, DF-26 will target the Presidential palace & neutralize the PAC-3 in Taipei. SU-35, J-20, J-16, J-15, KJ-600 & KJ-500 will control the island's air space and destroy the old F-16's & Mirage 2000's. GJ-2 & GJ-11 will patrol Taipei sky and destroy the runway's at airports... By the time the Japanese has a chance to react and help, it is almost all over already. But I am sure they want to retake the island using peaceful means because that saves money for reconstructions afterward and also, the people of the island will not resist or hate them as much! hahaha...

1. Foremost in any invasion of country is air superiority.
During WW2 and the D-Day landings the allies had air superiority and they needed it because the invasion fleet they had would be sitting duck to German airplanes. Russia did not get air superiority in the Ukraine invasion and are still suffering for not achieving that, even though they launched a surprise attack on Ukraine. Today radar controlled surface to air missiles are very deadly. Add in Close in weapon defense to protect missile sites.
I think it would be very hard to take out Taiwan' air defense systems and Airforce.
So to invade Taiwan, China needs to knock out the Taiwanese Airforce and all missile batteries for surface to air missiles. Taiwan would need also to be able to counter mass drone attacks as this would be the only sure way of success for China. Meanwhile Taiwan could have a large number of drones to hit air transports or ships near the shore.
2. The distance between China and Taiwan is over 100 miles. China would need a large number of ships to transport troops to Taiwan and would need to protect them as most would be unable to defend themselves against air attack/torpedo attack. Land artillery of 155mm can go out to 21 km and can be very effective against any modern warship let alone a troop transport.
3. Next is supply lines. Any invasion force will need to supply/resupply the troops. A supply line across water is very easily interrupted.
4. Western trade with China will cease as sanctions for invading Taiwan.
5. Taiwan will have defense in depth. Have various ways to counter Chinese warplanes (planes, anti-air systems, drones, and hand held anti-air missiles)

 

[westwoody]

Companies that contract Chinese fabricators are moving to other countries.
Almost every shoe I bought used to be made in China ( except for Trickers) now they are all Vietnam or Malaysia.
If enough leave China it will be a big problem.
This is why China wants Taiwan. China doesn’t care about unification or culture. China wants Taiwan chip making facilities and Taiwan carbon and metal working factories.

If China has a big unemployment problem they might solve it the Putin way. Create a foreign enemy to unify the domestic population and start a war to keep everyone busy and agitated.