Reality of Micros

[yvrvisitor]

I write this with a mixed feeling and possibly with a feeling that as a pooner myself, i do not have a right to write what i am about to
Please do not get offended as i am not judging anybody. I just had this feeling for a long time, but last couple of night was another reminder.

We all know and been to a micro or two. It is relatively lower price and convenient. Some describe them as McD.

Even though i am a relatively a new member but i am not a new pooner. Hate to admit it has been 10+ years of this hobby.

Gone are good old days of quality SPs who provided not only great service but also great companionships, witty PERB personas, and the feeling of involvement, enjoyment and possibly relationships.

A few years ago, micros replaced agencies. Anybody remember those days of 5stars, mystique, and Broadway MP?
Way back when i had my fav. girl in one of those agencies. When i dropped by on one weekend night, she was busy with a customer and there were 4 guys waiting in the lounge area. When the girl was done with the customer at the time she came out to grab the next guy in line and saw me with what i recalled a some what of embarrassed face. I still remeber the some what tired look on her face with a bag under her eyes. She called me with inside of the room asking me to leave as she would not bear seeing me that night.

That event put a temp stop to my pooning. Other than a couple of girls i was seeing 'off the clock = outside'

Don't get me wrong. I like the convenience of micros. AlmoatAlmost never have to make an appointment. Just call and drive (and hope nobody showed up in between). And you could almost fuck 3 times for the price of 2 with independent SPs.

And i always wonder what these girls at Chinese aunty shops think or feel - given the lower price of servicing many guys (and girls usually make 50% of what we pay)

I am guilty as charged as i have gone to a micro where there're 6 or so girls in them. And to take a special pricing of $100 for 30 min or so. One night where i was very horny and just felt like fucking shit out of whatever was available ... i gone through 4 girls back to back at $100. Each and every girl provided naughty services and i was in action for the entire 30min. All with each girls making only $50 at a time.

Sure i left that place with feeling much better and my nuts totally drained, however the feeling of guilt took over not too long after.

This past weekend, somewhat late night, i felt an urge to go see somewhat younger girl and went to one of popular micro.
Found myself a pretty girl and enjoy my time quite a bit. Even though i left with a very satisfied JR and had the wonderful feeling of waking up this morning after a really good score the night before ... the event i witnessed it took over most of my busy monday at work.

When i walked in to the micro, i can hear one girl servicing a customer. She was making all the right sound but at the same time she was shouting something else in her native language. It was the girl's painful shouting wanting the customer to finish soon.

I saw another girl (without a customer) in lingerie resting on a mattress. She did half get up to show me her face but i can see 'i am so fucking tired, who is this now wanting to fuck me' look behind her pretty face.

I decided to go with another girl who was pretty and happy to see me. Everything was good until i wouldn't pop after 15 min of non stop action. She was complaining in a way that i was making her work too much for a such a small amount of money. Her attitude was changing to 'gosh, why can't you just finish and leave already'. It wasn't until the after shower that i saw a note she keeps. It was a running note of a number of customers she serviced each and every day. While i have heard that some girls say they do service an average of 7 guys a day and sometimes up to 12, i was very surprised to find out that my JR was #11 for her that night.

While i know these girls are in it to make money but i couldnt help this weird feeling i have from leaving the place.

That's all for my rambling.

 

[ziggyzoo]

Next

You really have to let go, these girls are literally slaves, so drop your load and get out

 

[patdragon]

I think the lady makes CAD 20,000 to 30,000 per month

50% of the total revenue, so averaging 10 clients each day is about right.

 

[girth-brooks]

I've never been to one and never plan to.

 

[VancityDivas]

Very doubtful girls at micros are making much money. There is a whole thing in developing countries and companies like Foxconn that is economic slavery, essentially the workers make a living but their wages are garnished for everything.. I often wonder of the girls in these micros or amps and think if the same ideology applies.

Or quite possibly they are just making very low wages because of a lack of other job opportunities.

In any case I think there's various levels of this industry and in the end you get what you pay for. If you want a really good experience then you need to find a low volume sp not an amp girl.

What a difference that'd be though from 4 girls back to back at the different price points :O

 

[Tugela]

I think the lady makes CAD 20,000 to 30,000 per month

50% of the total revenue, so averaging 10 clients each day is about right.

Your math is wrong. At $50 per client. To make $20k-30k each month she would have to see at least 40 clients a day. Obviously none see that many.

Also, 50% is what she gets from the house, but doesn't include what she has to pay to the people who arranged for her to come here. That costs a substantial amount of money, a debt owed to the sort of people who don't take kindly when you neglect to pay them. Her real take home cut of the fee is probably a lot less than $50 per client at the end of the day.

That is the reality for those trafficked girls. It may be better than whatever they might be able to scrape together in their home village, but they are still getting shit from the deal.

 

[yvrvisitor]

"Trafficked"
I do not deny this exist, but not to the extent of what media leads us to believe.

In case of Chinese aunties...
Most of them come willingly
They all have different reasons to come, butbit is rare that those girls are forced.

In case of all k girls, they all come by choices

Sure, they all have "agents" but the girls do not pay them. The shops pay. That's why you see girls moving from one shop to another after certain period of time.

Also, $100 per customer is, i think, the lowest price point. Many micros charge 140 to 200.
I have not done math to figure out the total mentioned above, but it is not all girls making $50 per customer.

 

[Larry Storch]

(snip)
When i walked in to the micro, i can hear one girl servicing a customer. She was making all the right sound but at the same time she was shouting something else in her native language. It was the girl's painful shouting wanting the customer to finish soon.

I saw another girl (without a customer) in lingerie resting on a mattress. She did half get up to show me her face but i can see 'i am so fucking tired, who is this now wanting to fuck me' look behind her pretty face.
(snip)
i was very surprised to find out that my JR was #11 for her that night.

While i know these girls are in it to make money but i couldnt help this weird feeling i have from leaving the place.

That's all for my rambling.

Do you really think they are making a choice to be there given their reactions? Why would you even consider going back?
When it's this obvious they don't want to be there, no wonder you are having pangs of guilt and "weird" feelings.

 

[patdragon]

Your math is wrong.

Sorry but my Math is correct.

200 an hour, 10 clients per day, 30 days per month, not counting a few day offs
200 x 10 x 30 = 60,000 and 50% of that is 30,000

Less popular girls will make less than that, maybe around 20,000.
The agencies will be resposible for other costs.
At least this is what I know of those Chinese/Korean Micros.
Not talking about those trafficked victims, they may as well get paid 'minimum wage' or nothing at all.

 

[Edward Lei]

^
You're skewing the numbers to prove your non-existent numbers. Only some, not even all, the k-girl micros charge 200/hr. And the vast majority of clients don't even opt for 1-hr appointments. The majority of them pay 160 for 45-mins or 140 for 30-mins. And this only applies for the Korean micros - the ones that can even ask these somewhat higher rates.

The Chinese micros typically charge 140, 120 and even 100 (for them really gross grandmas) for 45-min and 30-min sessions. Very few clients at these places will even consider a 1-hr session. It's called the McD's of pooning for a reason.

And yes, I poke fun and call them k-bots all the time but they're still human and can't work 30 days in a calendar month. It's just not physically possible.

 

[patdragon]

^
You're skewing the numbers to prove your non-existent numbers. Only some, not even all, the k-girl micros charge 200/hr. And the vast majority of clients don't even opt for 1-hr appointments. The majority of them pay 160 for 45-mins or 140 for 30-mins. And this only applies for the Korean micros - the ones that can even ask these somewhat higher rates.

The Chinese micros typically charge 140, 120 and even 100 (for them really gross grandmas) for 45-min and 30-min sessions. Very few clients at these places will even consider a 1-hr session. It's called the McD's of pooning for a reason.

And yes, I poke fun and call them k-bots all the time but they're still human and can't work 30 days in a calendar month. It's just not physically possible.

This really isn't rocket science, and I was only showing a general summary on how the range 20,000 - 30,000 can possibly be reached.
30,000 will be at the extreme side, obviously it implies SP with consistent busy schedules and also the motivation to handle them.
Usually students from China or Korea who are eager to earn some fast money and only able to stay for a few weeks to a few months.
(Don't forget those bloody rich international students who treat money like tissue papers and tip more than the donations)

100~140 for 30/45, well, the rates somewhat already indicate they are not new in the business and most likely they stay by choice.

 

[Tugela]

Sorry but my Math is correct.

200 an hour, 10 clients per day, 30 days per month, not counting a few day offs
200 x 10 x 30 = 60,000 and 50% of that is 30,000

Less popular girls will make less than that, maybe around 20,000.
The agencies will be resposible for other costs.
At least this is what I know of those Chinese/Korean Micros.
Not talking about those trafficked victims, they may as well get paid 'minimum wage' or nothing at all.

They don't see clients for an hour mostly though, usually it is a lot less than that at those places. 10+ clients a day is 10 quickies a day, those will be 15-30 minutes max, and they are not getting paid $200 for that. There is clean up time in between as well, so it isn't as though they are having sex non stop for 12 hours a day, 30 days a week, like you seem to believe.

They don't work every day either, even if you assume they don't get days off. Ever heard of the menstrual cycle?

The house will pay a fee to the traffickers to get the girls, but so do the girls (in order to arrange a position). The traffickers double dip on that. They are criminals remember, and those guys neither play nice nor do they play by fair rules.

There is absolutely no way in hell that those girls see anything remotely near $20k a month, other than in your imagination.

 

[VancityDivas]

I have to agree assuming that asian micro workers or amp girls clear 20k a month = 240k per year is ridiculous!
There are a lot of assumptions being made here but I believe that many of these girls are making no more than 40-60k a year reasonably. This is because there will be a dozen girls and many will only see a handful of guys that pick them then they must be making closer to 40% of that 100 dollars for half hour type thing.

Those kind of business are a whole different animal. And I am speaking of the non trafficked and somewhat chosen professions of these girls for whatever reason.

Also I have no clue what rich international students has to do with anything at all! Those are just students with well off families. I don't believe those are the clientele these places see :O

 

[susi]

the majority of AMP workers are NOT trafficked. we are in contact with them here and in other canadian cities...

in my opinion the prices they charge are a reflection of a fundamental difference in the culture of business between north america and asia...

here we are about quality over quantity - sp's here prefer 3 or 4 clients at a better wage -

where amp workers are about quantity over quality - charging a little less and increasing volume -

does that make sense?

 

[Tugela]

the majority of AMP workers are NOT trafficked. we are in contact with them here and in other canadian cities...

in my opinion the prices they charge are a reflection of a fundamental difference in the culture of business between north america and asia...

here we are about quality over quantity - sp's here prefer 3 or 4 clients at a better wage -

where amp workers are about quantity over quality - charging a little less and increasing volume -

does that make sense?

I don't think you understand what trafficked means. Or maybe you don't want to.

If they are here working illegally through some arrangement organized by someone else, they are trafficked. End of story. That is what trafficking is in the Canadian context. It isn't about people being forcibly stuffed into containers to be shipped here and worked as slaves or something like that.

 

[treveller]

Tugela, your definition of "trafficked" is what the prohibitionists whan everyone to use and believe because it makes for sensational press and politics. It makes a mockery of real human trafficking, at least as I understand it.

When a adult pays someone else to get them into a country where they believe they can do better for themselves, that is not trafficking. It is economic migration, possibly facilitated by organized crime because our government and our voters won't otherwise allow that migration.

The proof is in the response of police and immigration when the so called "trafficking victims" are found. They are not assisted and compensated as a real trafficking victim should be. They are quickly and forcibly deported.

 

[Tugela]

The prohibitionists are not using the term correctly either. They use the term to describe all sex work, which is also incorrect. The term has a clear legal meaning and that is not it. They are doing it because they are trying to evoke an emotive response to win the debate because they know their arguments are wrong, just as Susi is doing but from the other point of view. Both of them are wrong and are attempting to define the term to suit their own ends. It is a cheap debating trick - use emotive language and redefined semantics when you know that reason cannot win your argument.

The movement of sex workers into Canada is only economic migration if the person involved comes into Canada without any assistance at all from a third party. It simply does not work that way 99% of the time. Other than some relatively educated folk from western Europe and similar places, no one migrates to Canada like that through the back door. No one. Organized criminal elements arrange for these foreign girls to come here. Unless you somehow believe that some unsophisticated peasant girl who doesn't speak English and knows nothing about Canada is somehow organized enough to be coming here by herself and setting up business, just knowing exactly what to do and who to see - If you think that I have some mighty fine bridges you will probably be interested in buying.

As soon as someone is organizing it for them, it is trafficking. End. Of. Discussion.

Here is the problem. Any reasonable moderate Canadian is going to know what the term means, so when you use it incorrectly they are going to know that you are trying to fool them and will conclude that you have an ulterior malicious motive in doing so. When activists try to argue that these girls are NOT trafficked and include them in the broader industry, what they end up doing is painting the entire industry with the same brush as some sort of dubious criminal enterprise. If they would just pony up and admit that this sort of criminal activity is wrong and anathema to the Canadian industry, and that law enforcement should do something about it, then they would be able to argue that the indigenous sex enterprises are different and have a reasonable chance that Joe Public will accept it. It is critical that people IN the industry be the first to stand up and demand that the illegal side of the business be stopped. If they don't, their opponents will be sure to do it for them, except that those people will include the entire industry.

 

[susi]

migrant workers are not trafficking victims....are they here legally no.....

the organizing of sex work for sex workers does not mean all sex work is human trafficking....

by your definition, all sex work is trafficking when you work for some one else.....so all escort agencies, massage parlors, strip clubs....are dens of human trafficking.....if a madame flies me to halifax to work for her for a couple weeks...is she a trafficker? am i trafficked? technically yes...

i get that you are separating canadian sex workers from migrant or foreign sex workers and that the distinction you are making is in regard to them stealing our jobs, working illegally and and that those who help them arrive in canada are traffickers...yes by this definition, they are traffickers.....

the context in which abolitionists use trafficking....is to cast all sex work as trafficking or abuse and then to rescue us from our oppressors....

i think your reference to the immigrant peasant girl who doesn't speak english is actually a bit racist and anti immigrant.....they are not doe eyed peasants with no knowledge of the big bright world and who were duped into sex work with promises of stardom....also, you show that you feel they are different than "european" migrants....why? a strange way to view this issue for sure...

many were sex workers in their countries of origin or once here and in school needed a little extra cash for fun and fancy clothes....the majority are working to feed their families here and back home... what's different about that in terms of european or south asian migrants? nothing but your attitude...

for your information, we do fight illegal activity in the industry and stand up against exploitation, extortion and violence all the time...thanks though....i do know what trafficking means and feel maybe you don't want to understand the meaning....

the rationale for the non enforcement of the new laws by VPD is in part because we demonstrated how resources would be better used to fight actual illegal activity....than to broadly enforce against the industry....they have already had some success and arrested a guy pimping under aged girls

so while you think you might have some new idea here, we have been doing exactly that all along.

i still will stand up to people trying to say all of the asian migrant workers are exploited or some how forced via trafficking. they are not.

and while as a canadian worker whose job is impacted by migrants who take our jobs....i cannot in good conscience promote the idea that they are victims of organized crime somehow or that people should not use their services. they need to make money just like the rest of us.

that would be totally self serving on my part and unethical.

i work for the safety of all sex workers and people involved in the sex industry - from bro-brosan to pooners to workers on street to exotic dancers and so on....

migrant workers are in a particularly difficult position and as such the ideas for finding ways to allow them to be here legally, etc are on going and being defined and lead by the workers themselves...as it should be.

we are not arguing they are not trafficked....they are NOT trafficked...end of discussion. we will include them and we will not hide the truth about our community/ industry.....why would we tugela? why should we separate ourselves from them and jump on board the abolitionist train with the rest of the rescue industry? why in the hell would we ever do that?

where's your proof they are all trafficked? trafficked in the context of exploitation as is generally accepted as the definition when discussing sex work - where is the research you have done? show me a link to any legitimate data (no mellisa farely's, benjamin perrin's or raymond's please...they are not legitimate) please show me where it says it?

trafficked in the context of sex work is understood in a specific way and you know this. got any more advice for "canadian activists" and how we should divide our community and separate ourselves from each other? some sort of class separation experiment? regress to us and them?

how will this help?

sorry tug's.....maybe you should stick to pooning

love susie

 

[Tugela]

migrant workers are not trafficking victims....are they here legally no.....

the organizing of sex work for sex workers does not mean all sex work is human trafficking....

by your definition, all sex work is trafficking when you work for some one else.....so all escort agencies, massage parlors, strip clubs....are dens of human trafficking.....if a madame flies me to halifax to work for her for a couple weeks...is she a trafficker? am i trafficked? technically yes...

i get that you are separating canadian sex workers from migrant or foreign sex workers and that the distinction you are making is in regard to them stealing our jobs, working illegally and and that those who help them arrive in canada are traffickers...yes by this definition, they are traffickers.....

the context in which abolitionists use trafficking....is to cast all sex work as trafficking or abuse and then to rescue us from our oppressors....

i think your reference to the immigrant peasant girl who doesn't speak english is actually a bit racist and anti immigrant.....they are not doe eyed peasants with no knowledge of the big bright world and who were duped into sex work with promises of stardom....also, you show that you feel they are different than "european" migrants....why? a strange way to view this issue for sure...

many were sex workers in their countries of origin or once here and in school needed a little extra cash for fun and fancy clothes....the majority are working to feed their families here and back home... what's different about that in terms of european or south asian migrants? nothing but your attitude...

for your information, we do fight illegal activity in the industry and stand up against exploitation, extortion and violence all the time...thanks though....i do know what trafficking means and feel maybe you don't want to understand the meaning....

the rationale for the non enforcement of the new laws by VPD is in part because we demonstrated how resources would be better used to fight actual illegal activity....than to broadly enforce against the industry....they have already had some success and arrested a guy pimping under aged girls

so while you think you might have some new idea here, we have been doing exactly that all along.

i still will stand up to people trying to say all of the asian migrant workers are exploited or some how forced via trafficking. they are not.

and while as a canadian worker whose job is impacted by migrants who take our jobs....i cannot in good conscience promote the idea that they are victims of organized crime somehow or that people should not use their services. they need to make money just like the rest of us.

that would be totally self serving on my part and unethical.

i work for the safety of all sex workers and people involved in the sex industry - from bro-brosan to pooners to workers on street to exotic dancers and so on....

migrant workers are in a particularly difficult position and as such the ideas for finding ways to allow them to be here legally, etc are on going and being defined and lead by the workers themselves...as it should be.

we are not arguing they are not trafficked....they are NOT trafficked...end of discussion. we will include them and we will not hide the truth about our community/ industry.....why would we tugela? why should we separate ourselves from them and jump on board the abolitionist train with the rest of the rescue industry? why in the hell would we ever do that?

where's your proof they are all trafficked? trafficked in the context of exploitation as is generally accepted as the definition when discussing sex work - where is the research you have done? show me a link to any legitimate data (no mellisa farely's, benjamin perrin's or raymond's please...they are not legitimate) please show me where it says it?

trafficked in the context of sex work is understood in a specific way and you know this. got any more advice for "canadian activists" and how we should divide our community and separate ourselves from each other? some sort of class separation experiment? regress to us and them?

how will this help?

sorry tug's.....maybe you should stick to pooning

love susie

As I said before, if someone is arranging for them to come and work here illegally, it is trafficking. That is what trafficking is. You don't get to redefine the term because you don't like the meaning.

If a girl comes here completely independently, then she isn't being trafficked, although she may still be working illegally. Pay attention. The typical alien working in a MP does not come here without assistance for that purpose. A foreign girl who comes out here on her own and decides to make a bit of cash on the side will always be working independently using the internet, NOT in a MP.

Organized crime is crime that is organized as an enterprise. The people bringing these girls here illegally fall into that category. You don't need to be a Mafiosa or some sort of Biker to be involved in organized crime.

The people who do that need to be stopped, and the people that get trafficked need to be found and sent back to where ever they came from. They fact that they agreed to be trafficked is totally and completely irrelevant.

All of these foreign girls here doing sex work have entered the country either illegally or fraudulently. Canada does not issue visas for people to come here and do sex work. So, if they are here and doing it, they are here illegally. They need to go.

 

[Edward Lei]

^
Wow, just wow. So the micro/AMP aunties that get into Canada under the guise of a visitor visa are OK because they're here legally?

You're splitting hairs.