Carman Fox

POLICE - Question

SUPERMONKEY

Banned
Jun 15, 2008
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Do you know if police actively post listing on CL to entice "johns" and then bust them?

Have you had any bad experiences with the authorities during your pooning adventures?
 

Bahumat

New member
Jan 4, 2010
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What I Have heard from some of the SP's is the opposite. The SP's answer ads posted online by police who set up busts in hotel rooms - unlicenced sps get a fine( 5000 or more) if she/he is not a licenced escort which is different than the licence sps at massage parlours have .As long as a licenced escort has not made a slip and solicited they are released with no questions asked. I personaly have never had a issue but I only see cl SP's that post a escort number, for the cops to put a ad up with a number would be entrapment and all charges would be thrown away . I knew this being a lawyer thing would pay off in the long run haha . Hope this sheds a small bit of light on the topic .

bahumat
 
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Pantherdash

Panther
Apr 2, 2007
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Downtown Vancouver
What I Have heard from some of the SP's is the opposite. The SP's answer ads posted online by police who set up busts in hotel rooms - unlicenced sps get a fine( 5000 or more) if she/he is not a licenced escort which is different than the licence sps at massage parlours have .As long as a licenced escort has not made a slip and solicited they are released with no questions asked. I personaly have never had a issue but I only see cl SP's that post a escort number, for the cops to put a ad up with a number would be entrapment and all charges would be thrown away . I knew this being a lawyer thing would pay off in the long run haha . Hope this sheds a small bit of light on the topic .

bahumat
Not much of a lawyer are you Bahumat? You get your degree from a cereal box? If you are, you're not a criminal one and watch WAYYYY too much American cop and lawyer shows.:rolleyes:

The police CAN entrap and lie all they want in Canada to get a conviction, because usually it's the dumbass criminal who falls for a trap too good to resist. There have been postings on CL trying to lure johns into underage prostitutes. As long as the john knows he's going to pay for sex with a girl under 18 that's all that counts. It's the intent that matters.

As far as any other luring in by police, police in Canada don't have the resources, manpower, or money to set up stings. They only do so when they hear of possible problem areas or concerns by citizens. They are in no way like the police in the US. I have not heard of the police in the Lower Mainland doing any checks on escorts to see if they have a license. I've only heard that happens in Alberta.

Supermonkey, you've got nothing to worry about with the police unless you go to Mun Mun's or you're into underage prostitutes or you like to openly solicit in public, including inside your car.

Maybe you and "Counsellor" Bahumat should stop watching Law and Order so much.;)

Panther
 

Bahumat

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Jan 4, 2010
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The police CAN entrap and lie all they want in Canada to get a conviction, because usually it's the dumbass criminal who falls for a trap too good to resist. There have been postings on CL trying to lure johns into underage prostitutes. As long as the john knows he's going to pay for sex with a girl under 18 that's all that counts. It's the intent that matters. Panther
You make a valid point , unfortunatly I was not talking about KNOWN illegal activities . In a situation such as a escort you are not soliciting ,It is a open agreement to pay for TIME with said provider who to have a escort licence must be of age . It is stated by most escorts paying for said time is not a promise or suggestion of sexual activity THERFORE if a police sting is designed to catch Johns by use of entrapment in a otherwise LEGAL activity The charges are thrown away . NOW in a ILLEGAL activity such as exploitation of a minor you bet your ass entrapment is a fair game and as you stated they only must beable to prove the intent was there .
As far as any other luring in by police, police in Canada don't have the resources, manpower, or money to set up stings. Panther
wrong.... Though many are for stopping a motor vehicle for the purpose of engaging in prostitution as well as communicating for the purpose of prostitution.
http://www.edmontonsun.com/news/edmonton/2009/05/29/9620281.html
http://www.theprovince.com/news/arr...titution+sting+John+School/2133101/story.html
http://www.winnipegsun.com/news/winnipeg/2009/11/18/11786596-sun.html

I've only heard that happens in Alberta. Panther
I am from Alberta
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/edmonton/story/2009/11/26/edmonton-escort-sting-fines.html


So panther i came up with the links via google in 2 minutes... Next time perhaps a small search would serve to enlighten you yes? As for the suggestion Captain Crunch was a prof of mine i completly agree ! He taught me how to curb my late night hunger pains while studying .

ALSO perhaps you should reread my original post before jumping down the throat of someone who was essentially agreeing with you . Infact I will post it here in bold for your rereading pleasure.

What I Have heard from some of the SP's is the opposite >>>>Meaning the cops dont set up stings online ...
for the cops to put a ad up with a number would be entrapment and all charges would be thrown away>>>> If they had a ad up online they COULD NOT post it with a escort number.
 
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Pantherdash

Panther
Apr 2, 2007
2,568
243
63
Downtown Vancouver
You make a valid point , unfortunatly I was not talking about KNOWN illegal activities . In a situation such as a escort you are not soliciting ,It is a open agreement to pay for TIME with said provider who to have a escort licence must be of age . It is stated by most escorts paying for said time is not a promise or suggestion of sexual activity THERFORE if a police sting is designed to catch Johns by use of entrapment in a otherwise LEGAL activity The charges are thrown away . NOW in a ILLEGAL activity such as exploitation of a minor you bet your ass entrapment is a fair game and as you stated they only must beable to prove the intent was there .

wrong.... Though many are for stopping a motor vehicle for the purpose of engaging in prostitution as well as communicating for the purpose of prostitution.
http://www.edmontonsun.com/news/edmonton/2009/05/29/9620281.html
http://www.theprovince.com/news/arr...titution+sting+John+School/2133101/story.html
http://www.winnipegsun.com/news/winnipeg/2009/11/18/11786596-sun.html


I am from Alberta
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/edmonton/story/2009/11/26/edmonton-escort-sting-fines.html


So panther i came up with the links via google in 2 minutes... Next time perhaps a small search would serve to enlighten you yes? As for the suggestion Captain Crunch was a prof of mine i completly agree ! He taught me how to curb my late night hunger pains while studying .

ALSO perhaps you should reread my original post before jumping down the throat of someone who was essentially agreeing with you . Infact i will post it here in bold for your rereading pleasure.
What I Have heard from some of the SP's is the oppositemeaning the cops dont set up stings online ...
for the cops to put a ad up with a number would be entrapment and all charges would be thrown away do i need to explain this one ?
You're right. I should have said they don't have the time to set up elaborate stings luring johns through CL. But I do know that they have been setting up stings on the streets for years. Why do you think there is almost no curbside activity on the streets any more like there was before 2003, when Vancouver got the bid for the Olympics? Alberta and Saskatchewan must've taught Vancouver Police how to sting johns on the streets!:D

As far as the exchange of money for time crap, they just wouldn't bother with that kind of charge in Vancouver which is what the OP was asking about. They may do that in Bible-thumping Calgary, with (as another pooner put it earlier tonight) a Baptist Church in every corner and they do seem to check escort licenses more. They know perfectly well that you're paying for pussy NOT for time, so if they want to bust you for it they will entrap you or lie to you (not sure for what, if anything at all). Doesn't matter if it's legal or illegal pussy you purchased. Not sure where you got THAT from...Cap'n Crunch? More like Fruit Loops!:D

Panther
 

Pantherdash

Panther
Apr 2, 2007
2,568
243
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Downtown Vancouver
for the cops to put a ad up with a number would be entrapment and all charges would be thrown away>>>> If they had a ad up online they COULD NOT post it with a escort number.
Not sure what you mean by this. Why would they use an escort's number. Why not use an anonymous number obtained by the police?

It doesn't matter though because entrapment by the police is NOT a legal defence in Canada. They can do all they have to do to lure your dumb ass in. If you fall for it, that's your problem.

Panther
 

Bahumat

New member
Jan 4, 2010
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Entrapment falls under Defence of Excuse or Justification it IS a legal defence bearing circumstances.. In anycase going back to the original topic - It would be VERY unlikly for police to post a ad on CL and get away with charging someone . If you are cautious like me just visit the CL ads with Escort numbers listed :)
 

Bahumat

New member
Jan 4, 2010
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Not sure what you mean by this. Why would they use an escort's number. Why not use an anonymous number obtained by the police?

Panther
Did you mean a phone number? I am speaking about a licence number.
 

Pantherdash

Panther
Apr 2, 2007
2,568
243
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Downtown Vancouver
Entrapment falls under Defence of Excuse or Justification it IS a legal defence bearing circumstances.. In anycase going back to the original topic - It would be VERY unlikly for police to post a ad on CL and get away with charging someone . If you are cautious like me just visit the CL ads with Escort numbers listed :)
Defence of Excuse? Are you sure you're talking about the Canadian Legal system?I don't think so.

**********************************************************************
The Police and Entrapment

...The basic rule was stated by Chief Justice Lamer SCC in 1991:

"The basic rule articulated ... is that the police may only present the opportunity to commit a particular crime to an individual who arouses a suspicion that he or she is already engaged in the particular criminal activity. An exception to this rule arises when the police undertake a bona fide investigation directed at an area where it is reasonably suspected that criminal activity is occurring. When such location is defined with sufficient precision, the police may present any person associated with the area with the opportunity to commit the particular offence. Such randomness is permissible within the scope of a bona fide inquiry.
Random virtue testing, conversely, only arises when a police officer presents a person with the opportunity to commit an offence without a reasonable suspicion that:
(a) The person is already engaged in the particular criminal activity, or
(b) The physical location with which the person is associated is a place where the particular criminal activity is likely occurring."

A local judge3, in a helpful way, set out the following:

"[16] It is clear from the relevant case law that the onus is on the defence, once the Crown has established each of the essential ingredients of the offence beyond a reasonable doubt, to prove on a balance of probabilities that entrapment occurred. The Supreme Court of Canada in the case of R. v. Mack, supra, made it clear that the defence of entrapment is recognized in only the clearest of cases. The following factors, although not exhaustive, may be of some assistance in considering whether the defence of entrapment has been made out:
1. The type of crime and the availability of detection techniques;
2. The reaction of an average person in the position of the accused;
3. The persistence by the police;
4. The type of inducement, if any, used;
5. The timing of police conduct;
6. The exploitation of human emotions
7. The particular vulnerability of the person exploited by the police;
8. The proportionality of the police involvement;
9. The existence of any threats;
1O. The undermining of other constitutional values.

________________

For more, see the following commentaries:
# The Police and A Citizen's Rights - October 4th, 1998
# The Police and The Search Warrant - October 11th, 1998
# The Police and Wire Taps - October 18th, 1998
# The Police and Police Checks - October 25th, 1998
# The Police and Entrapment - November 1st, 1998
 
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susi

Sassy Strumpette
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Jun 27, 2008
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panther, you nailed it! entrapment does not exist as a defense in canada.

Bahumat, check out www.tradesecretsguide.blogspot.com chapter 8- rights and responsibilities there is lots of info related to law included in the occupational health and safety training.

police in canada can lie cheat and steal to prove your guilt. when you are arrested they even give you a paper stating as much...it says something like "take no hope in any promises..." or something like that...it's been awhile since i was arrested...like 1991...

to the OP's question.

VPD Vice tell us they are focused on working on exploitation of youth. so i would say yes, they may be posting ads for under age girls and hoping to sting people interested in sex with a youth. there is a slow but steady shift at VPD moving away from punishment towards protection. they still do some pretty ridiculous stuff under the "protect us" banner but we are trying to keep them engaged. it's not easy. we are threatened by them and some times the meetings are emotional. they also feel threatened by our reactions to their activities- ie i freaked out after they described policies and procedures related to the raids on AMP's last year..rather fall 2008. this white guy police man talking about throwing workers on the floor, guns drawn, no interpreters....is this how we treat the victims of human trafficking?....which iswhat they were looking for...? but found none...zero...nada.....

weare going to try to creat ways for police to describe procedures and policies without being personally attacked. i mean it wasn't the policeman's fault....it was the failure of policy....know what i mean?

any hoo...IMHO, if you are looking to fuck a baby, you get what you deserve.

there is a ring of pimps working some underage girls, i met a survivor. she would not give me any info on them....lucky for them.... but described very young girls coming and going....$1500/ 3 hrs- minimum charge....

if you like younger women, stick with 19 an over...18 is a bit disputed and in vancouver according to city by laws you must be 19 to be an escort.

that's my 2 cents and 23 years of experience...soon to be 24 years....@ 25 years i am hoping to receive the coveted golden dildo award for long time service and being a master cock sucker...lol

love susie
 
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edmontonsubbie

Edmontonsubbie
Apr 22, 2006
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uh...Edmonton.
panther, you nailed it! entrapment does not exist as a defense in canada.

Bahumat, check out www.tradesecretsguide.blogspot.com chapter 8- rights and responsibilities there is lots of info related to law included in the occupational health and safety training.

police in canada can lie cheat and steal to prove your guilt. when you are arrested they even give you a paper stating as much...it says something like "take no hope in any promises..." or something like that...it's been awhile since i was arrested...like 1991...

to the OP's question.

VPD Vice tell us they are focused on working on exploitation of youth. so i would say yes, they may be posting ads for under age girls and hoping to sting people interested in sex with a youth. there is a slow but steady shift at VPD moving away from punishment towards protection. they still do some pretty ridiculous stuff under the "protect us" banner but we are trying to keep them engaged. it's not easy. we are threatened by them and some times the meetings are emotional. they also feel threatened by our reactions to their activities- ie i freaked out after they described policies and procedures related to the raids on AMP's last year..rather fall 2008. this white guy police man talking about throwing workers on the floor, guns drawn, no interpreters....is this how we treat the victims of human trafficking?....which iswhat they were looking for...? but found none...zero...nada.....

weare going to try to creat ways for police to describe procedures and policies without being personally attacked. i mean it wasn't the policeman's fault....it was the failure of policy....know what i mean?

any hoo...IMHO, if you are looking to fuck a baby, you get what you deserve.

there is a ring of pimps working some underage girls, i met a survivor. she would not give me any info on them....lucky for them.... but described very young girls coming and going....$1500/ 3 hrs- minimum charge....

if you like younger women, stick with 19 an over...18 is a bit disputed and in vancouver according to city by laws you must be 19 to be an escort.

that's my 2 cents and 23 years of experience...soon to be 24 years....@ 25 years i am hoping to receive the coveted golden dildo award for long time service and being a master cock sucker...lol

love susie
while it is likely gratuitously flattering to say this, i will say that i now drill down to certain posts by certain individuals....because they know things, they have lived it, or they have opened up completely about how they feel about something. Susi is one of those.

Sorry susi, but the golden dildo is no longer awarded to retirees nor cocksuckers. It is reserved for lifetime achievement awards and you will need an additional 15 years to qualify. In its stead, the organizing committee has agreed to substitute the silver dildo but...only under duress to have done so. Imagine their pain at bending those rules.

those that know you are lucky to do so, i have no higher words.

kindest,

eddie.
 
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