Pitbull discussion

athaire

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After reading a thread regarding pitbull ownership that has been locked down by the original poster I thought that perhaps further discussions about this particular breed of dog and the pros and cons of ownership of this dog type warranted further discussion.

I found several of the comments interesting and so have tried to find further info online. I have not had huge amounts of success with some but did find some interesting info......


I found this site easy to navigate and, to me at least, to be fair and balanced when discussing the breed and the issues surrounding it.



http://www.pitbulllovers.com/american-pit-bull-terrier-myths.html

MYTH: All Pit Bulls are mean and vicious.

It is reported on temperament tests conducted by the American Temperament Test Society that Pit Bulls had a passing rate of 82% or better -- compared to only 77% of the general dog population.

These temperament tests consist of putting a dog through a series of unexpected situations, some involving strangers.

Any signs of unprovoked aggression or panic in these situations result in failure of the test. The achievement of Pit Bulls in this study disproves that they are inherently aggressive to people. (Please visit ATTS.org)

MYTH: If a Pit Bull was never trained to fight, it will be safe with other dogs.

Pit Bulls can live peacefully with other dogs and animals. However, the Pit Bull has historically been bred to take down large animals. Early and continual socialization can help a Pit Bull be more animal friendly. Genetics, however, play an important role in how the dog will respond to other dogs and animals.

A Pit Bull that will fight another dog if unattended is a normal Pit Bull. Even if a Pit Bull does not start the fight, it has the potential to seriously injure or kill a dog once in the fight.

The Pit Bull has been bred to not back down and withstand pain until the goal is met. This quality does not carry true in all Pit Bulls, but it is safe to assume it is a potential in any Pit Bull in order to avoid unnecessary problems.

Pit Bulls have a late maturity, and a Pit Bull that was dog friendly at 7 months old may suddenly show signs of intolerance of unfamiliar dogs around two years old. Spaying and neutering the dog may help to prevent "turning on" the genetic urge to fight another dog.

All dog fights are preventable, however. Socialize a Pit Bull slowly with new dogs, and never let them play unattended. Remove items such as toys and food bowls to avoid stress.

Pit Bulls can live happily with other pets; if not left unattended. Even the "best of friends" can fight, and the outcome may be tragic. This can be true for dogs that have been together for years. Often, after the first serious fight, relations between the dogs are never the same.

Keeping that first fight from happening is a great way to ensure peaceful relations for the long run. If there is a multiple-dog household, it is important to separate the dogs when there is no one home.

Many people use crates for short times, put dogs into separate rooms, use kennels, or have outdoor areas set up for separation that are safe and secure. Pit Bulls can get along wonderfully with animals like cats, rabbits, and ferrets, but for safety's sake, never leave them alone together.

http://www.pitbulllovers.com/responsible-pit-bull-owners.html

10 Easy to Remember Tips for Responsible Pit Bull Owners

1. Exercise your dog everyday. Pit Bulls are high energy dogs that need some way of burning off that pent up energy. Even a short 10-15 minute walk or game of fetch in the backyard will help burn off energy that can lead to behavior problems.

2. Never leave pit bulls alone with other dogs (or any animal). Even if you're dog gets along great 99.9% of the time with other animals the Pit Bull is known for animal aggression and it is possible something will happen. A good piece of advice I received a long time ago was, Never trust your Pit Bull not to fight.

3. Always have your dog on a leash in public. Most if not all towns, cities and states have leash laws. Obey these laws. This will help people see your dog in a positive light and keep accidents like getting hit by passing cars from occuring.

4. Always supervise your dogs and never allow them to roam free. Loose dogs are often hurt by cruel people and accidents can happen as well. Always know where your dog is.

5. Supervise your dog with small children. This is a must. Small children are often hurt by dogs not out of angry, but because dogs can scratch them, step on them, and otherwise injure them.

6. Spay or Neuter your dog. Unless you plan on doing something where the dog can not be spayed or neutered get it done. This will reduce accidental breedings and stop roaming males from getting loose.

7. Train your dog. Take your dog to obedience classes or hire a private trainer to help you train your dog. This is very important for Pit Bull owners. If you can not control your dog bad things will eventually happen. Get your dog into training as soon as possible.

8. Avoid dog parks. Dog parks are a breeding ground for disaster. Young dogs have been killed in dog parks by bigger dogs and taking your dog to a dog park is simply not a good idea at all. A better choice is to enroll your puppy into puppy socalization classes. If you have a rescue dog I would also recommend these types of classes as well. Some trainers do have them for older dogs. Your dog will have a far better chance at proper socialization in one of these classes than at a dog park.

9. Socialize your dog. Take your dog to as many places as you can, meet new people and while they are young meet as many other dogs as possible. Socializing your Pit Bull will help curb any future problems that might occur.

10. Keep your dog properly confined. Pit Bulls are known to be great escape artist. Make sure you have the means to keep them in your yard and properly confined. Installing a six foot privacy fence is not a bad idea either.

Responsible ownership starts from the time your Pit Bull comes to live with you. Irresponsible owner's are one of the major causes for all the problems the breed faces today. It's our hope here at Pit Bull Lovers we can spread the word and educate more owners to take responsibility for their dogs actions.

In order for things to change, we must change the way we look at our own actions and how they effect the world around us. Until we do that, things will simply stay the way they are right now.
I find it very interesting that while the owners of these dogs defend them with zeal and compassion everything that I have read acknowledges the inherent dangers with the breed regarding aggression and the need for "responsible" ownership......
 

athaire

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http://www.globalpaw.com/forum/global-paw/3469-dog-aggression-pit-bull.html
Dog Aggression in the Pit Bull
Dog aggression in the pit bull is something very misunderstood by people unfamiliar with typically dog-aggressive breeds. Dog aggression is not, per se, a bad thing. It does not in any way make the dog a bad dog. It is simply a part of the temperament, and an aspect of the breed which needs to be recognized for what it is and managed in a responsible manner.

Pit bulls-- and here I lump together both the American Pit Bull Terrier (UKC) and the American Staffordshire Terrier (AKC) because they are, in my eyes, the same breed-- were developed originally for bull and bear baiting. When this "sport" was outlawed, they were moved into the dog fighting pit. They were bred for generations, and, unfortunately still are, to be aggressive toward other dogs, and to be strong enough, determined enough, and to have the stamina to fight to the death, either their death or that of the other dog. All of these characteristics are often lumped together under the term "game" (ie the "game-bred pit bull"). Because of their history in the pit, they were selectively bred for these characteristics. This is no different than how other working and sporting breeds were developed- dogs who excelled in their jobs were allowed to reproduce. This is how pit bulls became the breed that we have today.

Dog aggression has a full spectrum, like any other characteristic. There are pit bulls who get along with every other dog they see and can go their entire lives never showing aggression. There are pit bulls who are off-the-wall aggressive toward every other dog they see and cannot safely be allowed around other dogs. The vast majority fall somewhere in the middle, however most pit bulls do have some propensity for inter-dog aggression. They may not actively aggress, however if challenged, they will also not back down. Because of their body type, drive, and determination, most pit bulls if challenged by another breed, will win a fight.

It is not possible to socialize dog-aggression out of the pit bull. A pit bull can be very well socialized as a pup and still reach sexual maturity and become aggressive toward other dogs. This is often referred to as "turning on". Pit bulls do not fight other dogs because they are insecure around them or fearful of them. They fight other dogs because it is instinct. It is what they were bred to do. It is the same as a Border Collie's instinct to herd or a Labrador Retriever's instinct to retrieve. We do not expect to be able to socialize out those characteristics from those breeds, do we? It is no different with dog-aggression in the pit bull.

This is not to say that socialization of pups is not necessary, or that dog-dog aggression cannot be controlled, or that pit bulls should never be allowed to be around other dogs. Socialization as a pup is just as important, perhaps even moreso, as with any other breed. Pit bulls need to learn to behave appropriately with other dogs just as much as the rest of the dog population. However, it is dangerous to fall into the trap of thinking that because the pit bull interacts well with other dogs as a pup, it will always do so. Obedience training is also important. There is no reason a pit bull should not be able to control itself on leash around other dogs. That is a training matter. No matter how badly a dog wants to do something, it can be trained not to in a controlled environment. But training is not going to take away the instinct or the desire to fight.

What does this mean? It means never trust your pit bull not to fight. It means never leave a pit bull alone with another dog. It means that allowing a pit bull to run in an uncontrolled environment with other unfamiliar dogs is irresponsible and an accident waiting to happen. What does this not mean? It does not mean that a pit bull should ever show aggression toward humans. Human aggression and dog aggression are absolutely different things (do we look at a hound who would happily kill a small fuzzy in the backyard and fear for our children? Of course not. Dogs know the difference between dogs and humans. It is humans who seem to have the problem with that). It does not mean that most pit bulls need to be socially isolated- many pit bulls enjoy playing with familiar dogs in controlled environments.

Another caveat to this issue is the increasing trend toward breed specific legislation (or BSL). Pit bulls are being banned from cities, states, and even entire countries all over this world. They are the center of a media frenzy right now, fed by the "if it bleeds it leads" mindset. If a pit bull is involved in an incident, you can be sure it will make the news. If it's a Lab involved, chances are it will either be called a pit bull or never make the news at all. People don't want to hear about "good old-fashioned family dogs" who get into trouble, but those pit bulls, they're downright dangerous. If a pit bull gets in trouble in a dog park, whether the pit bull started it or not (and in some cases, the pit bull wasn't even involved!), they will be on the news, and in some cases, this is enough to spark the start of legislation to ban them outright.

The key to all of this is responsible ownership. Pit bulls are a lot of dog to handle, and they are not the breed for everyone. But they do not need to be- that's why there are over a hundred breeds for people to chose from! Pit bulls need to be closely supervised and watched around other dogs. Owners need to know their dogs, and be aware of subtle signs of aggression that could lead to a problem. These dogs need training and consistant leadership. They are wonderful dogs in their own right, but they are what they are, and as owners we need to accept that dog-aggression is part of what makes them pit bulls.
I have looked for and have yet to find any studies to indicate that this type of dog seems to attract irresponsible people due to the notoriety of the breed. Any that know of such articles, studies, discussions etc. could you please supply a link?

My personal opinion is that these dogs should indeed be regulated as they seem to be a very very large responsibility for the owners. I think that any prospective owners of such animals should have to pass an interview at the very least to assure the public in general will know that they are fully aware of all the issues with this breed.
 

Oldfart

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I don't trust pitbull owners

I would look very much askance at anyone who would own a pitbull. Call me prejudiced, 'cause that's what I am on this topic.
 

athaire

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http://www.atts.org/temperament.html

What is temperament?

W. Handel, German Police Dog Trainer, in his article, "The Psychological Basis of Temperament Testing," defines temperament as:

"the sum total of all inborn and acquired physical and mental traits and talents which determines, forms and regulates behavior in the environment"

The ATTS test focuses on and measures different aspects of temperament such as stability, shyness, aggressiveness, and friendliness as well as the dog's instinct for protectiveness towards its handler and/or self-preservation in the face of a threat. The test is designed for the betterment of all breeds of dogs and takes into consideration each breed's inherent tendencies.

The test simulates a casual walk through the park or neighborhood where everyday life situations are encountered. During this walk, the dog experiences visual, auditory and tactile stimuli. Neutral, friendly and threatening situations are encountered, calling into play the dog's ability to distinguish between non-threatening situations and those calling for watchful and protective reactions.

I checked this site as it is referenced in regard to the temperament testing and found this quote.
 

DQ Guy

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In my experiance, its not the dog.. Its the owner.
It doesn't matter what type of dog, from the small yappers
to larger breeds, If the owner doesn't train them right they can all cause problems.
So IMO I don't feel that any breed is trouble. but some owners shouldn't
have a dog to begin with. maybe stick with a hamster:rolleyes:
 

athaire

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And I am sure you would agree that certain personality types have a preference for dogs like pitbulls...and jack russells and labs and retrievers...etc...etc

If we know nothing about a person except for the breed of dog they own, we can draw some conclusions about them. All the opinions I would have of a pit bull owner who I have never met have actually been reinforced by those who I personally know who own a dog of that breed or american bull dog, presa canario, etc.

But to each their own.
I haven't had much experience with Pitbull owners but I would agree that certain personality types seem to be drawn to certain breeds. I base this on my experience with smaller dog owners.....I myself had a lab cross for a time and soon realized that I wasn't a dog owner at that point in my life. The dog would escape from the yard all the time and not come back etc. I ended up giving it to a local farm family....

I find myself now with 2 smaller dogs and I am finding that to be a very rewarding experience. I am guessing that the smaller more indoor type dog along with myself having changed in the years since owning being a large part of this.
 

CODe333

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The size, body-type and temperament of a dog tells you a lot about the purpose for which it was designed. No secret there. Pitbulls were not designed to be lap dogs. Local drug dealers, latin american death squads and people who train dogs for pit fighting prefer pitbulls because their breeding makes them superb attack animals and killers. Others may own them for gentler, nobler purposes but that does not change what is in a pitbull's genes. In a world where animals are often little more than fashion statements for fickle consumers, a pitbull is an especially bad choice for most people. The few pitbull owners I know are exceptionally well educated about dogs and expend an enormous amount of time, care and money in keeping them. The choice to keep pitbulls was not one they made without due consideration of the commitment they were making. Having potential owners take a mandatory training course seems wise where animals of this type are concerned. Anyone who is unwilling to assume total responsibility for an animal throughout its natural lifespan has no business getting the animal in the first place.
 

A.U.D.R.E.Y

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Speaking from my own experience.

As the proud owner of 2 small dogs:

-a kick ass 15lb Boston Terrier, who has no quams standing her ground defending her ball in the local dog park :p.

-and a sweet but very sucky 13lb Pug, who loves to run around like an idiot :eek:.

The only problems I have had at 1 of the local "off leash areas" has been with Pitbulls. And yes, I verified with the owners that they were Pitbulls, so as not to jump to conclusions & just further add to the warranted or unwarranted stigma associated with these dogs.

Anyways, on 4 separate occasions in 2008 I have had these dogs try to engage my dogs in a very aggressive manner, to the point where as a very concerned owner, I had to step in & pick them up & leave the off leash area.

Only to have these dogs follow me, circle me & try to jump up & bite my dogs :eek:.

These dogs didn't look at me, they looked through me & IMO only saw my babies as things to be killed.

In the event that either of them were attacked, I doubt either of them would make it :(.

And guarenteed, I would go down defending them in the process.

I have had Animal Control on speed dial, since the last incident :cool:.
 

athaire

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My mother has owned Rottweilers for some time. I think she is on her third one now. She had the middle one put down as it bite her husband. That said she stands by the breed as one of the best dogs around.

Myself with her latest dog I felt very comfortable and at ease. With the first two though I was very wary, both exhibited a strong territorial dominance and were certainly watching my every move being a stranger in the house. I didn't visit her much during those years so they never had a chance to become accustomed to me.

She always had control of the dogs, was always vigilant in public keeping them muzzled etc. The only time there was a problem was while she was at work and the dog and the hubby were at home alone. That particular dog seemed to dislike men in particular, I always assumed it was because of previous abuse at the hands of men while in other homes. That rotty was the only one rescued from the pound. The others were picked up as pups from breeders......
 

CODe333

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The temperament of the dog is really immaterial in this debate.

The problem isn't the dog, it's who owns the dog. For some people, dogs are companions & best friends. Others by them for protection or as a watch dog. Others by them as fashion accessories.

But there are too many pitbull owners that are these macho, low brow assholes that buy the dogs simply as another "tough guy fashion accessory or weapon" The ones that say "my dog would have never hurt anyone" after the cop puts a round in the dogs skull after it tears the face off some kid.

No, it's not the dog, it IS the owner. Sorta like how handguns aren't the problem, the people that pull the trigger are. And there are lots of good gun owners, but we put limits on your ability to keep an 9mm in your jeans.

I would agree that people are the chief source of the problem but I don't see how that rules out temperament as a significant aspect of the issues related to pitbulls. Pitbulls, unlike firearms, have a central nervous system fired by genes to produce a specific set of behaviours. The humans can only train or abuse the pitbull based on its inherent characteristics and their potentials. Try as one might, a hamster or a pekingese simply doesn't pose the same potential for inflicting damage or the disposition to pursue it so keenly (though I've known a couple of mean hamsters in my day). To follow up using the vocabulary you used, it is because of the dog's temperament that it can become a weapon, so to speak. I agree that it is the human who must take responsibility for the negative outcome. The dog, which may be as bright as a dog can be, simply doesn't have the capacity to assess its own behaviour or the outcomes of that behaviour the way a person does. Oh, and I want to assure you I have much more than an 9mm in my jeans! :D
 

visiting

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right behind you!
I love all sorts of pets, and generally they love me too, as I keep them pretty busy!

I am not the kind of guy to be afraid of a dog, barking or not, but agree the owner has a great deal to do with how the dog reacts, they have to be trained from an early age. My only fear with Pitbulls which have been banned in some provinces, is they can be very aggressive towards anyone, so they should not be around young kids... or some poor mailman it seems...

Heck I mean we also have to watch out for some people, as it's not only dogs that bite!!!!!!:D

I once had a friends boxer bite me, (not very hard) so I bite it back......(not very hard) you should have seen the dogs reaction..... priceless... he was like WTF is that!


here is something on dangerous dogs..
http://www.dogsbite.org/dangerous-dogs.htm
 

athaire

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Surely there must be at least a couple of Pitbull owners on the board? I would be interested in hearing from that side of this issue. The media has indeed shown through the many sensationalized stories that this breed of animal has a harsh nature, I would luv to hear some stories of the good nature of the Pitbull.
I mean all the stories certainly can't end with tragedy and sadness right?
 

stryker

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I have a girlfriend who has a Shepard and a Pit that were rescued,one from the SPCA,the other from a moron who couldn't look after it:rolleyes:
The later,being the Pit was bought buy someone who just wanted a tough /status dog,,not realising how much love,devotion and attention goes into looking after,and training a dog.
Long story short,these two dogs would intimidate anyone,but just happen to be the most loving creatures you could imagin and are like family and in tern treat her friendsand family as such.
The only cave'et,,they are possesive,and protect their master,,,why,,,,,because she took the time to train them,spend time with them as one should just like it was one of your children,,because pets are forever,not a fashion statement!
 

FortunateOne

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This, to me, says it all. Is it a pet or is it a weapon? Why is it necessary to have "Fluffy" muzzled and controlled in public? The pets I've had are affectionate, friendly, and sociable. They didn't threaten, intimidate or injure anyone. The owners of these breeds tend see themselves as bigger, better & stronger than the average pet owner, and therefore worthy of taming the aggressive beast -- and so often proven wrong.


Posted by athaire.
She always had control of the dogs, was always vigilant in public keeping them muzzled etc.
 

mimi

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Regardless of the breed you choose, the "breeding" is extremely important!
German Shepherds, Airdales, Rough Collies and many others have suffered from incorrect breeding, as in, not choosing sensibly when selecting mates. Mental case animals should not be allowed to produce young...the 'mental' gene seems to be dominant...the cranial size of some dogs has been reduced to the point of not housing enough room for decent brains.

I have watched a badly bred Shepherd walk casually up to a small poodle and rip it's stomach open and then waddle back to me (the owner was wimpy) apologetically. My Shepherd never trusted this bitch and kept several feet away at all times.

My Shepherd had a playmate who was a pit bull. This pit bull, smaller and slimmer than most, had adopted some kittens and curled up around them when the mother was away. He played hockey with the neighbourhood kids, he was in love with my Shepherd (we thought them both rather gay) and they used to run together, the pit bull holding the loose scruff of the Shepherd's neck in his teeth, it looked like they were holding hands metaphorically. Incidentally, a Shepherd can take down a pit bull easily when the pit bull fastens on this loose scruff, the Shepherd reaches under and disembowels the pit bull...as I witnessed with the Shepherd who destroyed that miniature poodle. The owner of the aforementioned pit bull was a lovely woman and her mate was a rather effeminate man.

I adopted a Rotweiller, very mature bitch, and she was so gentle and sweet, yet, everywhere I took her young, tough looking guys would stroll over to make comments like "Bitching dog man" and make aggressive gestures, which would confuse the dog...I adopted her out to a single mother who had been burgled...

As DQ and many have stated before, and I reiterate, the owner's lack of experience handling a strong willed dog eg: Shepherd's, Akita's, Chijuaua's (scariest dogs, and most closely related to wolves...seriously) Rotty's, Pitbulls, to name a few, and their reluctance to train properly and socialize the dog and create a loving atmosphere, contribute greatly to ruining the animal. I have met pit bulls who are 'lap dog' gentle and also those who have nothing in their eyes when they stare at you...

Boxer's are such clowns!
 

CaraClementine

Gentlemen Prefer Blondes
Regardless of the breed you choose, the "breeding" is extremely important!
German Shepherds, Airdales, Rough Collies and many others have suffered from incorrect breeding, as in, not choosing sensibly when selecting mates. Mental case animals should not be allowed to produce young...the 'mental' gene seems to be dominant...the cranial size of some dogs has been reduced to the point of not housing enough room for decent brains.

I have watched a badly bred Shepherd walk casually up to a small poodle and rip it's stomach open and then waddle back to me (the owner was wimpy) apologetically. My Shepherd never trusted this bitch and kept several feet away at all times.

My Shepherd had a playmate who was a pit bull. This pit bull, smaller and slimmer than most, had adopted some kittens and curled up around them when the mother was away. He played hockey with the neighbourhood kids, he was in love with my Shepherd (we thought them both rather gay) and they used to run together, the pit bull holding the loose scruff of the Shepherd's neck in his teeth, it looked like they were holding hands metaphorically. Incidentally, a Shepherd can take down a pit bull easily when the pit bull fastens on this loose scruff, the Shepherd reaches under and disembowels the pit bull...as I witnessed with the Shepherd who destroyed that miniature poodle. The owner of the aforementioned pit bull was a lovely woman and her mate was a rather effeminate man.

I adopted a Rotweiller, very mature bitch, and she was so gentle and sweet, yet, everywhere I took her young, tough looking guys would stroll over to make comments like "Bitching dog man" and make aggressive gestures, which would confuse the dog...I adopted her out to a single mother who had been burgled...

As DQ and many have stated before, and I reiterate, the owner's lack of experience handling a strong willed dog eg: Shepherd's, Akita's, Chijuaua's (scariest dogs, and most closely related to wolves...seriously) Rotty's, Pitbulls, to name a few, and their reluctance to train properly and socialize the dog and create a loving atmosphere, contribute greatly to ruining the animal. I have met pit bulls who are 'lap dog' gentle and also those who have nothing in their eyes when they stare at you...

Boxer's are such clowns!
Strong willed Chihuhuas.... yes.. they are. lol Not a novices dog.. I just got one, and am having issues! She is well socialised with people, however she has aggression issues with me. (biting,snarling when she is having a temper tantrum) I have hired a top dog trainer to help.

Even "lap dogs" can have aggression issues. Sometimes it's down to the owner, and sometimes it's in the genes.

Pitbulls are not for everyone. You have to be an experienced large dog owner, have the maturity, and strong personality to be able to handle a pitbull and get it's respect. When you take on a dog... especially strong breeds, you ought to be settled in life.
 

athaire

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This, to me, says it all. Is it a pet or is it a weapon? Why is it necessary to have "Fluffy" muzzled and controlled in public? The pets I've had are affectionate, friendly, and sociable. They didn't threaten, intimidate or injure anyone. The owners of these breeds tend see themselves as bigger, better & stronger than the average pet owner, and therefore worthy of taming the aggressive beast -- and so often proven wrong.
I hope I haven't painted a bad picture of her relationships with the animals she owns.....her taking the precautions was more in an attempt to prevent anything from happening and causing the animal distress. Her reasoning was that while her animals were good, caring creatures they were indeed strong willed and would defend her and the property. In public it was a "just in case" thing. Not a need to feel powerful or be stronger etc......not her thing at all.
 

hunsperger

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Mar 6, 2007
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Regardless of the breed you choose, the "breeding" is extremely important!
German Shepherds, Airdales, Rough Collies and many others have suffered from incorrect breeding, as in, not choosing sensibly when selecting mates. Mental case animals should not be allowed to produce young...the 'mental' gene seems to be dominant...the cranial size of some dogs has been reduced to the point of not housing enough room for decent brains.

I have watched a badly bred Shepherd walk casually up to a small poodle and rip it's stomach open and then waddle back to me (the owner was wimpy) apologetically. My Shepherd never trusted this bitch and kept several feet away at all times.

My Shepherd had a playmate who was a pit bull. This pit bull, smaller and slimmer than most, had adopted some kittens and curled up around them when the mother was away. He played hockey with the neighbourhood kids, he was in love with my Shepherd (we thought them both rather gay) and they used to run together, the pit bull holding the loose scruff of the Shepherd's neck in his teeth, it looked like they were holding hands metaphorically. Incidentally, a Shepherd can take down a pit bull easily when the pit bull fastens on this loose scruff, the Shepherd reaches under and disembowels the pit bull...as I witnessed with the Shepherd who destroyed that miniature poodle. The owner of the aforementioned pit bull was a lovely woman and her mate was a rather effeminate man.

I adopted a Rotweiller, very mature bitch, and she was so gentle and sweet, yet, everywhere I took her young, tough looking guys would stroll over to make comments like "Bitching dog man" and make aggressive gestures, which would confuse the dog...I adopted her out to a single mother who had been burgled...

As DQ and many have stated before, and I reiterate, the owner's lack of experience handling a strong willed dog eg: Shepherd's, Akita's, Chijuaua's (scariest dogs, and most closely related to wolves...seriously) Rotty's, Pitbulls, to name a few, and their reluctance to train properly and socialize the dog and create a loving atmosphere, contribute greatly to ruining the animal. I have met pit bulls who are 'lap dog' gentle and also those who have nothing in their eyes when they stare at you...

Boxer's are such clowns!
interesting...

mental case animals, mental genes, cranial cavities, ripped open stomachs, wimpy (gay???) owners, a gay pit bull that adopted kittens, played hockey and held hands (metaphorically) with a gay shepherd that could disembowel a pit bull, like another that had disemboweled a minature poodle who was owned by a lovely women and for the life of me another effeminate man (gay???), a sweet adopted Rottweiller referred to as a "bitching dog man" by tough looking guys, subsequently readopted by a burgled single mother, to be joined by the scariest dog of them all a wolf-like Chijuaua and a clownish Boxer...

have a nice day...
 
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Thatotherguy

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OK, people who say "the problem isn't the breed, it's the owner" are somewhat naive. So are people who say "the problem is the breed." As with most things in life, the problem is a combination of the breed and the owner. Pitbulls have a natural predisposition towards aggressive behavior. It's what they were bred for, and it's in their nature. That's part of the problem.

That being said, an owner who truly understands canine psychology (and yes, there certainly is such a thing - dogs are pack animals with a pack psychology, and should not be treated like humans since they have completely different psychology) should be able to make any dog well-behaved, regardless of the breed or any trauma that the dog may have gone through in the past.

Of course, the vast majority of dog owners don't understand canine psychology well enough to be successful with dogs with extreme behavior problems, and pitbulls are more likely to have extreme behavior problems than most breeds.

Some people advocate banning pitbulls and other aggressive breeds. I think that's going too far. It would be much better if you had to go through a test to see if you're a suitable owner before you could get a pitbull. Where's Cesar Milan when you need him?
 

FortunateOne

Banned
Jan 29, 2008
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I hope I haven't painted a bad picture of her relationships with the animals she owns.....her taking the precautions was more in an attempt to prevent anything from happening and causing the animal distress. Her reasoning was that while her animals were good, caring creatures they were indeed strong willed and would defend her and the property. In public it was a "just in case" thing. Not a need to feel powerful or be stronger etc......not her thing at all.
No, I just used the quote as a jumping in place, because it seemed like an excellent point. I wish all aggressive dog owners would muzzle these animals in public too, but they seem to think that not leashing and muzzling them shows the world that they can control the dog and are therefore big strong powerful people. Time after time they are proven wrong, of course, and their animals are put down, shot, confiscated. If you wanted a pet, wouldn't it be better to choose one that can just be a pet?

While Cara's chihuahua is still a puppy, who often snap and bite until they mature, I highly doubt it is capable of savagely mauling a child.
 
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