WTF?? Exactly what business do you think states are in, anyway? A state without the power of life and death lacks ultimate jurisdiction, and is not a state. It can stay it's own hand, by choice, but it's got to have it.Boss50 said:
Death Penalty Poll
- Thread starter IceG
- Start date
State = Government. You mean the Government should have ultimate jurisdiction regarding who lives and who dies. Who is the Government representing and who makes the Government?rollerboy said:
For some strange reason I thought the Government was made by the people and for the people. On the other hand you might be talking about a totalitarian State rather than a democracy.
Grrr... dude, read what I read, think about it, then read it again.Sunset said:
I'm not saying that the power of life and death is to be wielded capriciously. I'm not talking about the mechanisms by which it chooses to exert this power. I am saying that a government without power of life and death is not capable of effecting law. Ergo, it must possess capable armed forces, and it must possess police presence capable of maintaining civil order.
If simply put the government, "shouldn't being in the business of killing people," then it wouldn't need lethal arms of any sort. No need for guns, SWAT teams, snipers, national guard, army, no need for missiles, combat aircraft. Oh, you say, but that's for defense. Yes, gosh, that's for sure. Duh. I'd love to see how long a government would last that lacked either guns or the ability to effectively marshall violence when required.
The law isn't maintained by pleading with criminals to "please, please pretty please obey the law." How do you think you get a criminal to go into a jail cell in the first place? Or keep them there. And for that matter, throwing someone in jail for life is a life and death matter. It is the ultimate statement of control over your citizens, the ability to indefinitely confine them. This is in many ways far more difficult to enforce and more sweeping than the mere power to kill.
Rollerboy,
Your use of silly punk language (Duh, Dude, etc.) does little to compensate for your misunderstanding of the subject matter, lack of intellectual expression and incorrect use of terms.
First, the discussion is about states having laws that allow them to conduct the death penalty relative to specific crimes. This is a much different subject than states having a military, their use of military power or military weapons.
Second, governments vary from state to state. Some are democracies, some are theocracies, some are social democracies and some are totalitarian. The meaning of totalitarian is as follows: Of, relating to, being, or imposing a form of government in which the political authority exercises absolute and centralized control over all aspects of life, the individual is subordinated to the state. There are only a few first world states that conduct the death penalty and based on what you've written in the past on perb you happen to live in one; the United States.
You need to learn to properly check your premises before making an argument or run the risk of someone with a greater intellectual capacity destroying your thesis.
Your use of silly punk language (Duh, Dude, etc.) does little to compensate for your misunderstanding of the subject matter, lack of intellectual expression and incorrect use of terms.
First, the discussion is about states having laws that allow them to conduct the death penalty relative to specific crimes. This is a much different subject than states having a military, their use of military power or military weapons.
Second, governments vary from state to state. Some are democracies, some are theocracies, some are social democracies and some are totalitarian. The meaning of totalitarian is as follows: Of, relating to, being, or imposing a form of government in which the political authority exercises absolute and centralized control over all aspects of life, the individual is subordinated to the state. There are only a few first world states that conduct the death penalty and based on what you've written in the past on perb you happen to live in one; the United States.
You need to learn to properly check your premises before making an argument or run the risk of someone with a greater intellectual capacity destroying your thesis.
Okay, been away for awhile..travel is a bitch.
Way to trivialize hundreds of years of oppression. Sure there was a clear case of police brutality but maybe King should not have led police on a high speed car chase, should not have resisted arrest, and should not have been doing all of that drunk or high on PCP. No crime...no beating.
Ya right and it's people like me who have nothing to worry about. I don't deal drugs, steal cars, lead police on high speed chases, accost people and police with weapons, assault or kill people. Anybody who thinks the average law abiding citizen needs to worry about being a victim of widespread police corruption or brutality is a moron. Ironically, with today's crime rate, they're more likely to be a victim of some scumbag who deserves a stroll in the park.
Actually, it's called a condo and a very expensive one. If you save your pennies and allowance maybe some day you'll be able to afford my strata fees.
If you're going to jump on somebody, you need to get your facts right. After leading police on a high speed chase,(and the other two people in the car had been cuffed and placed in the backs of police cars, they were watching the whole thing), King was dancing around, barking and grabbing his ass and shaking it at the cop who was pointing a handgun at him. The 4 LAPD officers then arrived, told King to lie down on the ground, then "swarmed" him(a technique where an officer grabs each limb and bears him to the ground by body mass). King fought loose, was swarmed a second time and fought loose again. He was then tasered(two wires were shot by compressed air into him and then 50,000 volts fired along the wires), King staggered around for a bit but did not go down, then he was tasered a second time. This time he went down to one knee, then got back up. This is when the infamous video started. King had his head down when he took a step toward the one cop(if you see the video, it's a tossup whether King was charging the cop to tackle him or he was just staggering from the 2 50,000 volt jolts.) This is the point that most network news started actually playing the tape(a later study found that although the the tape was played over 40 times on network TV, only twice was the first few seconds played.) According to LAPD procedure, at this point using a baton two handed to deliver "power blows" was the thing to do, which was done. The "kick" one officer delivered at this time was King still was trying to get to his feet, with the Taser wires still attached(in the video you can see one officer moving the wires out of the way) when the officer put his boot on King and pushed him back down. In the ambulance afterwards, King was still laughing and giggling, and told one of the officers involved that he loved him.The Lizard King said:Way to trivialize hundreds of years of oppression. Sure there was a clear case of police brutality but maybe King should not have led police on a high speed car chase, should not have resisted arrest, and should not have been doing all of that drunk or high on PCP. No crime...no beating.
The senior officer on the scene, a former LAPD instructor, when told there was a video, thought it would be a good training tool as it showed a gradual escalation of force. As a matter of fact, most court approved experts in the use of police force all agreed the officers involved followed procedure properly.
So if this was a "police brutality", what should the officers have done? Used Harsh language?
Journalist: in Texas, that state had 2 to 3 times the number of people executed than any other state while you were governor. As well, you personally fast-tracked a number of those on death row to be executed. How does this conflict with your anti-abortion stance, your stance against euthenizing Terry Schiavo, where you espouse a "Culture of Life" that protects all life?
George Bush: the death penalty does not conflict with a "Culture of Life". You see, with these criminals put to death, others will live.
The Average Human Brain Thinks to Self: "... 1) but people in jail with life sentences don't get out to kill again...", "... 2) lots of capital punishment in Texas hasn't stemmed the number of homicides..."
Perb Brain: "... I am spreading a Culture of Love when I fuck SPs... "
George Bush: the death penalty does not conflict with a "Culture of Life". You see, with these criminals put to death, others will live.
The Average Human Brain Thinks to Self: "... 1) but people in jail with life sentences don't get out to kill again...", "... 2) lots of capital punishment in Texas hasn't stemmed the number of homicides..."
Perb Brain: "... I am spreading a Culture of Love when I fuck SPs... "
