Canada and First nations people going to War??

[ReluctantPooner]

IMO, what really needs to happen:

1) An investigation into EVERY band council across the country. Any band council that is ripping off its members for their own families benefit, should be locked up.

2) Help the natives develop industries in their communities to provide jobs. Whether it is ecotourism, forestry, high tech, whatever.

3) A move away from the reserve system. Maybe divvy up the land amongst band members, and turn it into private property that can be bought and sold like any other.

4) Drug and alcohol counselling for the communities that need it.

5) Stop giving cash to natives just for the fact they are native (I'm talking about monthly cheques, etc.). We need to teach them to provide for themselves. Only then will they have the confidence and self worth to truly be free from poverty.

 

[LaCreme]

IMO, what really needs to happen:

1) An investigation into EVERY band council across the country. Any band council that is ripping off its members for their own families benefit, should be locked up.

2) Help the natives develop industries in their communities to provide jobs. Whether it is ecotourism, forestry, high tech, whatever.

3) A move away from the reserve system. Maybe divvy up the land amongst band members, and turn it into private property that can be bought and sold like any other.

4) Drug and alcohol counselling for the communities that need it.

5) Stop giving cash to natives just for the fact they are native (I'm talking about monthly cheques, etc.). We need to teach them to provide for themselves. Only then will they have the confidence and self worth to truly be free from poverty.

they need cash to develop industry "hello"

 

[he_loves_fat]

they need cash to develop industry "hello"

They first need to feel a sense of pride in themselves or they'll always need handouts.

 

[1shiningstar]

Responsibility

Help up and a hand out are different things. It is ours responsibility as CANADIANS to help other CANADIANS (FN or otherwise) progress and create a better situation for themselves. With regards to things like addiction, yes, it is self inflicted. Yes also, it is our responsibility to help people overcome their struggles. We need to help the groups of FN that are impoverished integrate into the workforce so they are capable of helping themselves. I think every person deserves to be treated with dignity and respect and given an opportunity to better their situation.

 

[he_loves_fat]

Help up and a hand out are different things. It is ours responsibility as CANADIANS to help other CANADIANS (FN or otherwise) progress and create a better situation for themselves. With regards to things like addiction, yes, it is self inflicted. Yes also, it is our responsibility to help people overcome their struggles. We need to help the groups of FN that are impoverished integrate into the workforce so they are capable of helping themselves. I think every person deserves to be treated with dignity and respect and given an opportunity to better their situation.

Why is "it is our responsibility to help people overcome their struggles"?

Are we their moms and dads? Are their lives any concern of ours? When did it become my "responsibility" to help bums when they’ve gotten so much for so long?

 

[LaCreme]

god open those door

They first need to feel a sense of pride in themselves or they'll always need handouts.

so you are telling me you don't appreciate handouts sometime?
simply for a boost keep your self going " like don't cry i am going to help you to get what you want" ?
if they don't know better somebody out there must be paid to teach them.

i never had help from "fed" i had to sell my butt to be able to write this
i have no pride for what i did but sure thing i am much more wiser.


+only those who have good faith will successed one day i will be able to go to the USA again. please god open those door. even if i did crazy thing in the past forgive me..

 

[he_loves_fat]

so you are telling me you don't appreciate handouts sometime?
simply for a boost keep your self going " like don't cry i am going to help you to get what you want" ?
if they don't know better somebody out there must be paid to teach them.

i never had help from "fed" i had to sell my butt to be able to write this
i have no pride for what i did but sure thing i am much more wiser.


+only those who have good faith will successed one day i will be able to go to the USA again. please god open those door. even if i did crazy thing in the past forgive me..

Handouts don't do anything but create the expectation of more handouts.

 

[jjinvan]

sorry - Canadians were side-tracked with your "brown envelopes" nonsense and had a momentary lapse in judgment... otherwise, the Kelowna Accord would be implemented.

yes yes and if the liberals hadn't been caught with their hand in the cookie jar we'd also have met our Kyoto targets by now, I'm sure.

I'm glad you feel that stealing money and taking kickbacks is 'nonsense' I guess it explains part of why you back the lefties.

 

[jjinvan]

IMO, what really needs to happen:

1) An investigation into EVERY band council across the country. Any band council that is ripping off its members for their own families benefit, should be locked up.

2) Help the natives develop industries in their communities to provide jobs. Whether it is ecotourism, forestry, high tech, whatever.

3) A move away from the reserve system. Maybe divvy up the land amongst band members, and turn it into private property that can be bought and sold like any other.

4) Drug and alcohol counselling for the communities that need it.

5) Stop giving cash to natives just for the fact they are native (I'm talking about monthly cheques, etc.). We need to teach them to provide for themselves. Only then will they have the confidence and self worth to truly be free from poverty.

Good luck with #1. After that, the rest is comparitively easy

 

[he_loves_fat]

Good luck with #1. After that, the rest is comparitively easy

LOL - too funny!

 

[LaCreme]

Why is "it is our responsibility to help people overcome their struggles"?

Are we their moms and dads? Are their lives any concern of ours? When did it become my "responsibility" to help bums when they’ve gotten so much for so long?

i found out in live by helping other is like you are helping your self.
everything i own i did work for it. gotten so much for so long maybe in the past they had nothing maybe the motivation is from there..

many time i had charisma's with no body and new year alone.**that my explanation as been material girl today.. i am more into material
now..

 

[jjinvan]

Help up and a hand out are different things. It is ours responsibility as CANADIANS to help other CANADIANS (FN or otherwise) progress and create a better situation for themselves. With regards to things like addiction, yes, it is self inflicted. Yes also, it is our responsibility to help people overcome their struggles. We need to help the groups of FN that are impoverished integrate into the workforce so they are capable of helping themselves. I think every person deserves to be treated with dignity and respect and given an opportunity to better their situation.

Therein lies the biggest part of the problem.

Their leaders don't want 'programs' or anything else developed or run by the government. They want CASH and they say that if they get the cash they will put in place their own programs and fix all the problems themselves.

They've been playing that tune for a while, what almost always happens is that the leader gets a new wing on his house or more money in his bank account and his 'company' puts in place a sub-standard solution and then the federal government gets blamed for not doing enough.

With self-governance comes the responsibility for self-reliance.

If they want to join the rest of society, and get out from under the corruption, then I say welcome them with open arms as soon as they sign individual agreements to forego any rights other than those given to every non FN citizen of the country.

 

[LaCreme]

Handouts don't do anything but create the expectation of more handouts.

ha ha ha handout are gifts or angels send from god.. if you are not Donald Thrump i dont see how you could be expectation of more handouts. is a suprize!

 

[he_loves_fat]

ha ha ha handout are gifts or angels send from god.. if you are not Donald Thrump i dont see how you could be expectation of more handouts. is a suprize!

Handouts are great for the short term but they don't build character.

 

[LaCreme]

Handouts are great for the short term but they don't build character.

Ah la la what do you now about my character?
sometime yes and some time no..
i see handouts like reward

 

[he_loves_fat]

Ah la la what do you now about my character?
sometime yes and some time no..
i see handouts like reward

Handouts are the opposite of a reward because logically, a reward is earned, whereas a handout is not.

 

[LaCreme]

Handouts are the opposite of a reward because logically, a reward is earned, whereas a handout is not.

you right. what happen if some one give you tip?
do you call it handout? that why i did say reward..
well i handout to my mom a lots giving her stuffs free, money without asking anything in return

 

[maxxx24]

jjinvan-boy do you hate Native leadership-you got some deep issues there man. Let it go...It is possible to do a review on band councils and their spending habbits, you should know that based on how much you refer to the leaders and how corrupt they all are. Its a very time consuming and looong process, the govt doesnt like to do them, and obviously, neither do the bands. But they can be done.

The only hand out that Natives get as far as I know is $5 once a year per Treaty-and everyone here would take it. Let it build up and that would be $50every 10 years-sweet 1shiningstar-dont know specifically which band you are talking about but yeah some are more well to do than others. then again, some look like ghettos. But overall all most are poor and in need. Seats are saved at post secondary institutions-the objective is to encourage enrollment for FN, but thoses numbers are not a capacity accross the country. But Im not crazy about that either-should be based on mainly marks. But that doesnt stop the well to do families with hook ups in the registrars office or directors-they get in with garbage marks. Or other immigrants who give large donations to institutions. And everyone who refers to the handouts, what are they? I sure as hell dont know. Please let me know which bands hand out free money, maybe I can get in on that, anyone else?

For such a free ride, carefree, luxurious lifestyle Natives are living, why all the complaints? I guess they realy arent poor and bums after all. Kings and Queens as its portrayed by some here. Oh yeah, great anology to compare it to a free market system-fits perfectly. If things were that good most of Canada would be complaining about that too. They have too much-oh wait- isnt that the complaint already? And why hasnt anyone addressded any of the questions I posed earlier? Good on the few who have provided constructive anylisys though-its not a simple problem with a simple answer. Hell its not fair that so many Dutch and German immigrants in the prairies got sweet heart deals on land purchses from the govt back in the day-but hey no problem there.

Nothing is fair anywhere, that does not exist in the world in which we live. We can all try though to make things as fair as possible, for everyone.

 

[LaCreme]

jjinvan-boy do you hate Native leadership-you

Nothing is fair anywhere, that does not exist in the world in which we live. We can all try though to make things as fair as possible, for everyone.

yeah, if every body do is part i believe is will be a better world..

i help him. him help you and you help a nother then so on..
it make a difference..you just made my day

 

[geewhiz]

Adhere, reject or amend the Treaties

I would have to agree, First Nations need to be treated equally. Way back when (in my original argument), descendants of immigrants who own property are holders of stolen property. Should be a) forget about it and just treat ALL Canadians equally, b) undo the injustice and enforce the treaty (in the start the thread, it would be giving back most of Winnipeg area to the local Native Nation), or c) sincerely negotiate what is best for First Nations and Canada.

I know a lot of you are republicans on this website (citizens of Canada first), but our main document does not begin, "We the People". our consitution starts with : And whereas such a Union would conduce to the Welfare of the Provinces
and promote the Interests of the British Empire, also the newer includes Whereas Canada is founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God and the rule of law. Constitution arrangements are made under the Supremacy of the Crown: that being the Crown of Canada (1), and the Crown of each province (10). NOT the people, but the continuation of Canada and the provinces. What I am saying is that First Nations needs seats at the table and the participants are willing to do what is best for the respective Crowns/Nations. Unfortunately, there are over 600 First Nations in Canada. And yes, this does not count the Metis and Inuit which has its own set of problems.

Away from constitutional affair, a super-municipality is a DUMB idea. Why, because a municipality in Canada is basically a committee created by the province. For example, Quebec basically said goodbye to Westmount and made it join Montreal. Each province controls (directly or indirectly) each municipality. What First Nations are asking for is equal status as provinces, as provinces are sovereign to each other and to Canada. Canada cannot tell BC how to distribute business licences. Of course that would be fairly complicated.

Finally, about the money. I agree, and ALL people agree that audits, oversight, judiciary are important to native bands. But I am sorry, yeah, that $25 million handout, well that is over a twenty-five year period, and natives have no right to prioritize, we, the Federal Government will decide, and if we are Tories this year, then it will go to Tory ridings, and next year, if we are Liberals, then it will go to Liberal ridings. Basically, control should not be with Indian Affairs, but with the First Nations. More importantly, if they had money, then they could afford auditors. An Indian Band with control of their oil resources receives royalties from the extractors. They can then hire auditors to see if their government is efficient. An Indian Band that has no land, cannot control their resources, is not going to spend half their budget for auditors.

Once upon a time, First Nations were a proud people. They had it going. Not quite as well as China or the Ottoman Empires, but they had it going. Then things changed, but many had agreements. Either all of us live up to the agreements, scrap it or figure out a new way.