C36 Merged thread, everything goes here

[vanperb]

Can someone explain what that bar thing they use is for?

http://ww2.nationalpost.com/m/wp/blog.html?b=fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/12/15/canadas-new-prostitution-law-explained-with-lego-video

 

[bigbreastlover]

This is consistent with what I was told by a prominent Winnipeg Judge a few weeks ago at a benefit function. We were sharing a scotch when I asked his opinion. He told me that he sees a few areas in the new legislation that he would certainly doubt would survive as challenge before the Supreme Court.
The problem is, to get there, requires the laying of a charge, the person fighting it, several appeals all of which would take many years and a lot of money. He said the Bedford decision actually got done relatively quickly by legal standards because the government was overconfident they would win and let it go without a lot of delay. This time he's certain the government lawyers would use every legal devise at their disposal to drag any appeals, etc. along (heck its not their money) and make sure it took years and hundreds of thousands of dollars to fight it all the way to the Supreme Court.
I think we're stuck with this new law for several years to come. I don't see a government of a different political stripe changing it. Sure they can stand in front of a bunch of cameras right now saying they would but they wouldn't. That's the beauty of opposition. You can say whatever you want and never have to stand by it.
We all just have to play safe. Visit only ladies you know are not LE and you'll be fine.

Cheers

We are all making assumptions here, but I think it is sadly a pretty realistic point of view. Especially if we have a minority government which is quite likely. However, a liberal minority or majority government could be a little bit helpful. It will be clear for every LE that prosecution under Bill C-36 will be the last priority and the law will not be applied. Furthermore, in case of litigation, the goverment may not appeal to a decision of a first instance judge which may become a precedent for a long time.

I think we are going to see a split in the country: some conservative provinces such as Alberta will try to make use of this law to get rid of prostitution as much as they can, and some like BC and in ,Vancouver, will become safe heaven. Internal "sex tourism" may appear like it is in the US. One of the stupid thing about those conservative laws is that they encourage sex tourism abroad where women are almost enslaved. Those who make these laws are selfish and do not take into consideration the rest of the world.

 

[Little Turtle]

So how many people got arrested so far?

 

[Lo-ki]

Probably

0

 

[maximus]

I think eventually they make an example of someone and that will put a scare into use pooners.

 

[wetnose]

One more rant for the day,
What really makes no sense to me is throughout the bill they try to make it seem like it was written to protect against human trafficking and child trafficking but it seems to me this new law is actually PROTECTING those crimes by making it less likely clients will report suspected cases to the police because now they will be putting themselves at risk of outing themselves as buyers and being charged

Forgive me if this has already been mentioned somewhere in the 42 pages of this thread....

If I came across a situation of human trafficking, then I'd drop an anonymous tip (handwritten, via mail) with details to the cops. Would also warn perbites to steer clear.

No way no how can I stand for it, in good conscience. If some hobbyist gets nailed when they bust in, well he asked for it.

 

[Alabama Blaze]

Since Dec 6th I've been getting a huge increase in calls from blocked numbers and bizarre area codes that look like they should be from outer space (google numbers?) My phones ringing all day but I've been ignoring close to 9 out of 10 calls because of this. Soooo annoying.

My lil rant for the day.

I'm sorry to hear that you have goofy guys doing silly stuff like that Miss Tanya.

There's apps that can create fake numbers on jail broken cell phones. Skype also can generate wierd random numbers unless you link a cell phone to the account.

Good on you for not taking those blocked calls. The guys whom are using fake numbers have their tin foil hats tied on too tight.

Having your number show-up on an Escorts cell phone doesn't mean much unless the LE catches you doing the deed. Calling an escort wouldn't prove an appointment was booked or sexual services were exchanged.

Buying a hobby phone from a 7-11 or Max Store is good enough as long as it's done with all cash transactions.

 

[dace]

Yes our freedom of speech ..Our freedom of chose to associate with who we want to
Our freedom of thought. And our freedom to give our money to who ever we want for legal services

This is about our constitutional right and freedoms being eroded away ..and no one gives a fuck
Why should we be made afraid to speak our mind on sex. On the girl that we see and enjoy... why can't people advertise legal services or offer a place for others to advertise legal services.. ?
Because the goverment have passed unconstitutional laws contrary to a SP ruling .. and no one will stand up against them .. With any attempt to over turn this attack on the right of all ..because it only about perverts and margilized women that are supposedly coursed ...abusser and trafficted in to working by perverts and pimps.

None of us are force g any one to do sex work.. but we can no longer talk about it on this site or any because we may incriminat our selves by addmiting we pay a person for sex.. A service they are legally allowed to sell... How can such a fucked up law every be ruled on let alone be allowed to be passed by supposedly intelligent member of Parliament that we voted in.

Did we realize how fucken ignorant and stupid these people real were...
And does any of our fellow Canadian realize how ambiguous the wording in this law is ..that for tye mist part it can not be in forced in a fair and constitutional manner

But instead we live in fear.. unfairly having our freedoms curtailed. . Because now something that we could do and talk a out for over 300 yrs is suddenly a crime in canada ..

If your not angry about it ..Then maybe we don't deserve a democratic society. Where do you think it will lead if this is allowed to stand .. All sex being regulated.. All beliefs needing to be sanctioned be laws..
I shake my fist in contempt .

Well said!

 

[johnsmit]

Whether I am on crack or not I think most people und erstand that it no democratic for the majority to force there will on the minority. .. and in Canada this generally is not the case .. Minorities opinion is given quit a bit of latitude in the decision making process of goverment.
Of course we are talking about when we have a govermin that is democratic and believes in right of it citizen set out in the governing constitution. . When the elected official fail to recognize that is the most important part of their mandate..then democracy fails.. and autocracy prevails to the detriment of all people's democratic rights..

I can never hale a democracy that rules for the majority. . Let alone rule for party ideadeology

 

[Man Mountain]

What happened to the stickied mega thread about all of the ongoing articles relating to C-36?

Edit: It would seem that the handle of the member who started that thread has been deleted from the forum either by request or by the admin for other reasons, which of course then has the effect of wiping out that individuals entire posting history as well. I know that means any thread started by that member would therefore be erased but I would ask the mods and the admin if there is any way to salvage that particular thread as there was so much valuable information within it? Perhaps the original thread could be credited to reverdy somehow since he put so much effort into finding and posting the vast majority of the articles within it? It just seems like a real shame to lose that thread completely.

 

[lenny]

What happened to the stickied mega thread about all of the ongoing articles relating to C-36?

Edit: It would seem that the handle of the member who started that thread has been deleted from the forum either by request or by the admin for other reasons, which of course then has the effect of wiping out that individuals entire posting history as well. I know that means any thread started by that member would therefore be erased but I would ask the mods and the admin if there is any way to salvage that particular thread as there was so much valuable information within it? Perhaps the original thread could be credited to reverdy somehow since he put so much effort into finding and posting the vast majority of the articles within it? It just seems like a real shame to lose that thread completely.

It seems many, if not all, of the same articles are being posted by her/him on TERB and or MERB:


https://merb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?118900-Bill-C-36-Media-Watchlist-you-can-help!/page16

http://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthread...itution-related-laws-opinions-comments/page96

 

[johnsmit]

Actually you know that is true.. 40% of 65% of the voters, is not majority rule.. of course I did not mean it in that way ...but pointing it out serves a good purpose too...it show the flaw in our political system ..which we are the direct recipients of the consequences.

 

[badbadboy]

I don't know if this has already been posted but I thought it was humorous and informative.

Legoman/Woman dramatization.

[video]http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/12/15/canadas-new-prostitution-law-explained-with-lego-video/[/video]

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014/12/15/canadas-new-prostitution-law-explained-with-lego-video/

 

[Scavenger]

Let hope that nothing really changes for now. I know it is a different county but in the Philippines, a very Catholic country, prostitution is illegal in any shape or form. However, it remains a destination for the sex tourist industry. You can't sit in a mall as a single guy without some girl coming up to you and asking if you need company. A couple of major cities there make most of there money from the pay for pussy business. The police occasionally make raids and arrest a few token escorts and clients. It certainly sucks to be the one arrested but for the most part it all goes on without interference. May be it will be like that for Canada.

 

[Caramel]

The only GOOD thing about this new law is that police can be called (or threatened to be called as a security measure) on abusive terrible clients with absolutely NO repercussions on SPs themselves. There was a few instances of clients who pushed boundaries or were being abusive, were then refused service and asked to leave (without refund of course), one of the clients actually threatened to phone the police on the SP and report a scam and out her thinking that selling sex was illegal (ignorant person) another one said "go ahead and call the cops i'm not leaving and will hit you if you don't give my money back or finish me off".

But of course the shitty thing is that the actual scam artist type of girls could probably accept the cash, have sex for 5 minutes to complete the transaction, and then threaten to call the police --- THAT is really scary!!! BE CAREFUL out there boys!!! I would totally ignore all brand new ads with no connection to any known provider/reviewer/agency.

 

[vancity_cowboy]

The only GOOD thing about this new law is that police can be called (or threatened to be called as a security measure) on abusive terrible clients with absolutely NO repercussions on SPs themselves. There was a few instances of clients who pushed boundaries or were being abusive, were then refused service and asked to leave (without refund of course), one of the clients actually threatened to phone the police on the SP and report a scam and out her thinking that selling sex was illegal (ignorant person) another one said "go ahead and call the cops i'm not leaving and will hit you if you don't give my money back or finish me off".

But of course the shitty thing is that the actual scam artist type of girls could probably accept the cash, have sex for 5 minutes to complete the transaction, and then threaten to call the police --- THAT is really scary!!! BE CAREFUL out there boys!!! I would totally ignore all brand new ads with no connection to any known provider/reviewer/agency.

i agree with you, caramel. the rip-off artists of the escort world have been handed a very powerful tool by mr. mackay et al

not that he cares, as a matter of fact he probably believes that the 'perverts' deserve everything bad that they get as a result of his crowning achievement, bill c-36

board members should be paying more attention to, and contributing to, the neighbourhood watch section in future to make sure that we can all avoid these kind of rip-offs... and stay out of jail!

 

[Rod_Longenhard]

First off, you're kidding yourself if you don't think McKay and cronies aren't partaking in escorts themselves.

Secondly, nothing really changes. Heed all the normal red flag warnings and you'll be fine : ie) don't see women at seedy motels, don't see women that are in a rush to see you (you know the ones - "babe book me soon my night is filling up fast" when the ad was posted a day ago), don't see women that post 1am-6am every day, and finally if it looks too good to be true - it is. Don't be expecting a pornstar experience with a playboy model at 3am from a crack shack in Surrey for $60. Use some common sense.

I haven't seen or heard of any shake downs since the law went into place over 2 weeks ago. It's business as usual.

 

[summerbreeze]

just a thought.....

The asian service providers have as much to loose as the client given that they would be facing issues with their visa. some are trying to immigrate, some are here on a student visa, some tourist.

Under the new law, a client would not be able to call law enforcement for a problem related to a bad SP. Admission of guilt problem and the SP with far less to worry about in terms of legal liability.

The foreign SP not the case. While the client would still have an admission of guilt issue, the potential for deportation a real threat for the SP.

Might be a bit of risk mitigation here.

 

[frisky business]

With everybody upping their cautiousness prior to Canada 's first well publicized sting operation (January?), here are some possible new safety protocols. If adopted industry wide they would make us all less vulnerable in our consensual P4P rendesvous:

HOW YOU PAY. The guy meets her with the pre-counted donation and nothing else in his left rear ass pocket. She gives him a kiss, puts her arms around him and helps herself to it. She has taken it. He didn't offer it. The start of a legal defence.

HOW THE LADIES ADVERTISE. When she talks about her sessions in her massage ads she prefaces it with "Here are some of the things I enjoyed with my last boyfriend." Whether detailed or vague. Again, not an airtight legal defence but a toehold for a good lawyer to argue reasonable doubt.

HOW THEY MEET. She lets it be known that she greets everyone with a wet kiss and groping. If the guy doesn't get this upon meeting she might be a female cop. Not too many ladycops want to have this level of intimacy with their random sting targets.

Probably there are more. Ladies, who buys into this? Lets keep ourselves safe out there.

FB

 

[Caramel]

With everybody upping their cautiousness prior to Canada 's first well publicized sting operation (January?), here are some possible new safety protocols. If adopted industry wide they would make us all less vulnerable in our consensual P4P rendesvous:

HOW YOU PAY. The guy meets her with the pre-counted donation and nothing else in his left rear ass pocket. She gives him a kiss, puts her arms around him and helps herself to it. She has taken it. He didn't offer it. The start of a legal defence.

HOW THE LADIES ADVERTISE. When she talks about her sessions in her massage ads she prefaces it with "Here are some of the things I enjoyed with my last boyfriend." Whether detailed or vague. Again, not an airtight legal defence but a toehold for a good lawyer to argue reasonable doubt.

HOW THEY MEET. She lets it be known that she greets everyone with a wet kiss and groping. If the guy doesn't get this upon meeting she might be a female cop. Not too many ladycops want to have this level of intimacy with their random sting targets.

Probably there are more. Ladies, who buys into this? Lets keep ourselves safe out there.

FB

These are hilarious and would never work for most girls...maybe if they are regular clients who have a good trustworthy relationship already. There have been clients who were confused with our laws and USA/world(prior to dec 6th/c36), and they go in there thinking its illegal, they ask if she is a cop. Then they show her the cash and ask her to touch him (crotch area with pants still on) first to make sure she is not a cop, then the transaction happens and he is comfortable. (Sometimes some ladies might get offended and tell the guy to eff off understandably - because its creepy).