24 Seconds of Hell: My Sad Take on Robert Dziekanski

[Olmac]

What everyone seems to be forgetting is the RCMP are a force that appears to be under siege. Remember, it the last couple months they have had two of their own killed in what was seemingly minor incidents (one a simple and routine traffic stop). Not to mention the bunch killed outside Edmonton a couple yeras ago and the list goes on. I guess they don't matter though. You can sit on your over stuffed couches and continue to berate the guys that did not have the benefit of watching the video over and over and over again before they made their decision.

These officers acted within their guidelines when they used the tazer. If they didn't they would be in serious trouble already. The tazer is a tool used to subdue a person with minimal risk to themselves, the officers and the public. They made a quick judgment to use the tool, in hopes that no one would be hurt and the situation resolved. They make these dicisions in a fration of a second and we, (you mostly), have hours to sit here and criticize them for it.

The guy was obviously agiatated, had shown that he could be violent, and had a weapon in his hand. I think the chioce to use the tazer was the correct one.

The only thing I find wrong with what happened was the lack of effort put in to save the man when they realized something went wrong.

Flame away.

 

[Dr.Weedsmoker]

What everyone seems to be forgetting is the RCMP are a force that appears to be under siege. Remember, it the last couple months they have had two of their own killed in what was seemingly minor incidents (one a simple and routine traffic stop). Not to mention the bunch killed outside Edmonton a couple yeras ago and the list goes on. I guess they don't matter though. You can sit on your over stuffed couches and continue to berate the guys that did not have the benefit of watching the video over and over and over again before they made their decision.

These officers acted within their guidelines when they used the tazer. If they didn't they would be in serious trouble already. The tazer is a tool used to subdue a person with minimal risk to themselves, the officers and the public. They made a quick judgment to use the tool, in hopes that no one would be hurt and the situation resolved. They make these dicisions in a fration of a second and we, (you mostly), have hours to sit here and criticize them for it.

The guy was obviously agiatated, had shown that he could be violent, and had a weapon in his hand. I think the chioce to use the tazer was the correct one.

The only thing I find wrong with what happened was the lack of effort put in to save the man when they realized something went wrong.

Flame away.

No Flame here.

The video I watched showed me a man who had the possibility of being violent........there are so many what ifs and what could have beens.......its truly tragic this man lost his life BUT if he instead would have attacked an innocent bystander EVERYONE would have said "why didnt the police do anything?" The Cops cant win on this one.They did f#ck up on what transpired afterwards but i have no problem with the tazering in itself.

The world has become a fucked up place. I dont find this as a black eye for the country of Canada. There is 40x's worse shit going on in other places.

If everyone just smoked a big fatty the world would be a better place!


Dr.W

 

[ma1234]

The tazer is a tool used to subdue a person with minimal risk to themselves, the officers and the public.

Didyou say minimal risK? Tell this to the mother of Robert Dziekanski.

I guess if the risk is minimal you would let your family undergo a taser test anytime, right?

What people - including the "experts" don't understand is that electricity can be deadly for humans. It is not deadly all the time, but it can be.

Just like airport metal detectors can be dangerous for people with pace makers, we don't know why, but some people die when tasered.

It needs a new assesssment, a lot more testing. I am sure they tasered a few pigs or monkeys in the labs and when they didn't die, they declared tasers harmless.

Remember, not so long ago smoking was considered harmless.

 

[Randy Whorewald]

I think that once ALL the information is in it will be determined that Robert Dziekanski died of asphixiation. Did you not see the cop Kneeling on his throat and choking him. It's amazing what you can do to a guy when you cut off his air supply.

Randy Whorewald,

The photo attached at the bottom of your posts almosts generates a spontaneous outpouring from the fella downstairs. Now that is some fantastic artwork!

LOL. I hope your underwear doesn't get too wet Wiley!

 

[Krustee]

These officers acted within their guidelines when they used the tazer. If they didn`t they would be in serious trouble already.

I think not, should we just forget the report filed by Paul Kennedy?
http://protestzone.blogspot.com/2007/11/micro-meso-and-meta-of-robert.html

Then there is the handling of the evidence that REALLY has me questioning the RCMP.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wh56s4KWAJE&watch_response

Add to this mix the endless controversy of RCMP corruption & the fact that their actions are usually reviewed by themselves or other police agencies & -
I`m MAD as HELL!!!

https://perb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=77739

The tazer is a tool used to subdue a person with minimal risk to themselves, the officers and the public. They made a quick judgment to use the tool, in hopes that no one would be hurt and the situation resolved.

What about this on CBC from witnesses there?
http://www.cbc.ca/canada/british-columbia/story/2007/10/25/bc-taserlawyer.html

Witness have told CBC News that before he was shocked, Dziekanski was clearly distressed and was calling for police in Polish, and that five police officers shot him four times with Tasers seconds after they arrived.

Neither police nor airport officials have said what Dziekanski was doing between the time his flight arrived and his death, but his mother has said he did not speak English, and had no experience with international travel or large airports.

Taser devices are controversial because of the dozen North American deaths resulting from their use.

They make these dicisions in a fration of a second and we, (you mostly), have hours to sit here and criticize them for it.

Yes we do & that is our right.

Are these men not trained for these types of situations?

Has there NOT been numerous deaths prior to this one that the RCMP had been informed of & cautioned over?

The guy was obviously agiatated, had shown that he could be violent, and had a weapon in his hand. I think the chioce to use the tazer was the correct one.

Absolutely NOT!!!

They acted WRONG & without enough time to evaluate the situation properly.
https://perb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=77342

There were 4 of them.

They did NOT try to diffuse the situation.

They shot him FOUR (4) times!
WHY??

They used deadly force as their means & accomplished that means with the results we have all seen here.

Watch the video & ask yourself why?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWmue9ixN00&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wPyIikmrro&feature=related

The only thing I find wrong with what happened was the lack of effort put in to save the man when they realized something went wrong.

Flame away.

Here is one of your comments I whole heartedly agree with.
They did pretty much NOTHING from what I could see to assist him as he was dying.... well, other than to help him die I mean.

 

[therealrex]

I guess if the risk is minimal you would let your family undergo a taser test anytime, right?

I'm not sure about the RCMP but most forces require any officer who carries a taser to experience it on himself during training.

 

[Olmac]

You know what, if you think you can do a better job, step up and do it!

Krustee and ma1234, you just try and do their job for a day, make the decisions they have to make. It is pretty fucking easy to sit there and bitch and complain about it (I know, it is your right), but at least those guys are willing to put their lives on the line for a bunch of fucktards that bitch whenever their decisions do not work out as they expected.

People are tasered everyday in North America, and you guys grab onto one incident where it goes wrong, and cry blue bloody murder. Think of the lives that have been saved due to the use of a taser. Those situations would have seen the use of deadly force, instead a guy gets a jolt and no one is killed. I think that is a pretty good trade off.

Anyway, whenever you guys decide to put on a uniform and do the job, let me know, I will make sure I am in different city where I can feel safer. Because sure as shit, you guys will end up using deadly force in a airport, instead of a taser and likely kill a couple of innocent bystanders.

 

[Nickthenoob]

The RCMP reacted in all their learnt skills, lazy. I have watched the vid. SECONDS of little but anything. They moved in and then moved around him in an aggressive phase. Do NOT tell me a stapler is a weapon of ANY significance! Their utilising the taser to that, TO THAT, extent, was bullshit. Don't talk to me yaya yadayada about what they go through. They are TRAINED for this kinda of disturbed contacts. Do not preach to me otherwise. I don't care who you are or what you're training is cuz u know I'm fucking right! This was a Mountie serious screw up and it is time that certain people admit this. I will grant leeway to the Mounties in that they should not have been put in this predicament in the first place. The Vancouver Int. Airport is a fairly high grossing airport in revenues. The management at the airport should be held strongly accountable as well for not having employees with various interpreting skills on hand.

 

[Krustee]

You know what, if you think you can do a better job, step up and do it!

Krustee and ma1234, you just try and do their job for a day, make the decisions they have to make.

Anyway, whenever you guys decide to put on a uniform and do the job, let me know, I will make sure I am in different city where I can feel safer. Because sure as shit, you guys will end up using deadly force in a airport, instead of a taser and likely kill a couple of innocent bystanders.

I served my time in the military & I know what it's like to make difficult decisions.
Also lived with a cop for 3 years so I have an inside track on cops, how they live, think etc.

Also been to a few of their party's & I know first hand that the "law" does not apply to cops.
Only recently have law enforcement needed to curb their habits cuz there is too broad a chance of being cought on camera.
Not sayin cops are bad people just that they have their own culture & history.

People are tasered everyday in North America, and you guys grab onto one incident where it goes wrong, and cry blue bloody murder.

This I cannot believe you just wrote???

Re-read my above comments & the links I provided as reference.

About 275 people in the United States have died after being Tasered. According to Amnesty International.
The total number of taser-related deaths in North America is currently 302.
http://truthnottasers.blogspot.com

If the truth hurts, consider it like taking a spoonful of bad tasting medcine...
Once you swallow the healing begins.

 

[ma1234]

People are tasered everyday in North America, and you guys grab onto one incident where it goes wrong, and cry blue bloody murder. Think of the lives that have been saved due to the use of a taser. Those situations would have seen the use of deadly force, instead a guy gets a jolt and no one is killed. I think that is a pretty good trade off.

I am sure if the "one incident" would be one of your family members you would still consider it a "good trade off."

You know, it is easy to be generous with other people's lives.

 

[Olmac]

I served my time in the military & I know what it's like to make difficult decisions.

Kudos for you.

Also lived with a cop for 3 years so I have an inside track on cops, how they live, think etc.

Guess that makes you an expert.

Also been to a few of their party's & I know first hand that the "law" does not apply to cops.

This is not the issue here. I never once said police do not think they are above the law. I know for a fact some of them do think this. I know there are bad cops. Again this is not the issue here. I am debating the use of tasers, not whether there are bad cops out there.

Only recently have law enforcement needed to curb their habits cuz there is too broad a chance of being cought on camera.

And public scrutiny is a good thing. It keeps them honest.

This I cannot believe you just wrote???

Re-read my above comments & the links I provided as reference.

Links to PERB pages for reference are not imho useful, unless it is a review of a SP. I stop reading nutbar blogs when they start using terms "The state execution of Robert Dziekanski" and "RCMP goons". It was the goons comment where I stopped reading. I have not time for people like that poster. Want me to read what you have to say, keep the inflamatory comments out.

About 275 people in the United States have died after being Tasered. According to Amnesty International.
The total number of taser-related deaths in North America is currently 302.
http://truthnottasers.blogspot.com

Maybe quote the whole paragraph next time, just not the piece that suits your arguement.

About 275 people in the United States have died after being Tasered. According to Amnesty International, coroners have listed the Taser jolt as a contributing factor in more than 30 of those deaths.

Hmmm....30....far cry from the 275 you lead us to believe. Contributing factor, wonder what else was going on there that was contributing? No where does it specificly say the taser was the cause of death. Still, how many of those 245 left would have been dealt with using deadly force if there were no tasers? As for the 302, I am sure they had some more of those "contributing factors" as well as being tasered.

If the truth hurts, consider it like taking a spoonful of bad tasting medcine...
Once you swallow the healing begins.

Maybe have some of your own medicine. I don't need healing, doing just fine thanks.

Also, I sleep well at night in case your concerned about that too.

 

[Olmac]

People are tasered everyday in North America, and you guys grab onto one incident where it goes wrong, and cry blue bloody murder. Think of the lives that have been saved due to the use of a taser. Those situations would have seen the use of deadly force, instead a guy gets a jolt and no one is killed. I think that is a pretty good trade off.

I am sure if the "one incident" would be one of your family members you would still consider it a "good trade off."

You know, it is easy to be generous with other people's lives.

I have no idea what your family is like, but I do not have a single member in my family that would put themselves in the kind of situation where they would have to be tasered. If I did have a family member tasered, I would be thankful they did not put a nice three shot pattern in the chest instead.

I am not be generous with other peoples lives. I am not the one putting them in the situation where they get tasered. They are doing that all on their own.

Truth be told the death of Robert Dziekanski is tragic. It did not need to happen. There was a series of events that lead up to it that are mitigating. The biggest culprit IMO was the Airport and there lack of customer service. This man should have been helped long before police were even involved.

 

[ma1234]

I have no idea what your family is like, but I do not have a single member in my family that would put themselves in the kind of situation where they would have to be tasered.

The trouble is anyone could get into a situation like this.

If I did have a family member tasered, I would be thankful they did not put a nice three shot pattern in the chest instead.

Yes, that would make a much nicer corpse. I am sure the undertaker would be glad. Burned intestines are easier to hide than shot patterns.

 

[ma1234]

Years ago I have returned something to the store I bought it from because it fell apart. I wanted my money back, but the clerk said their policy is no refund, but she can give me a credit voucher.

I said I live 30 miles from there, besides, I can't see anything I would want to buy in the store, and please, give me my money back. I was polite, no name calling, just firm.
I asked her to call the manager. She got on the phone and told the manager that here is a customer threatening her. I said I am not threatening anyone. She lied to the manager. All of a sudden the security guy came and treated me like I was a nuisance. He told me to leave the clerk alone, etc.

I told him, all I am doing is trying to return something. I showed him the merchandise, he saw it was faulty.

In the end I had to leave the store. The security man outside apologized to me. He said it was his job to "protect" the clerk.

What I am trying to say is is that would this have happened today, and would they have called the cops on me lying about me being abusive, I could be dead today.

Tasering is too dangerous. They should ban it or use it on hard-core criminals only.

And don't tell me that this was and isolated incident and this was just one stupid clerk. It takes only one stupid clerk and one stupid cop and you are DEAD!

 

[Olmac]

I have no idea what your family is like, but I do not have a single member in my family that would put themselves in the kind of situation where they would have to be tasered.

The trouble is anyone could get into a situation like this.

Nope, law abiding people will never be in a situation like this. And before you even go off on me, read the Criminal Code of Canada, Robert Dziekanski broke the law. If the RCMP members are also found to have broke the law, they will be dealt with as well. That is the way Canada works.

 

[ma1234]

Nope, law abiding people will never be in a situation like this. And before you even go off on me, read the Criminal Code of Canada, Robert Dziekanski broke the law. If the RCMP members are also found to have broke the law, they will be dealt with as well. That is the way Canada works.

Yes, they will investigate themselves. Thank you very much.

 

[ma1234]

Nope, law abiding people will never be in a situation like this.

No comment. This is such a colossal stupidity, there is nothing I can say.

 

[Olmac]

Years ago I have returned something to the store I bought it from because it fell apart. I wanted my money back, but the clerk said their policy is no refund, but she can give me a credit voucher.

I said I live 30 miles from there, besides, I can't see anything I would want to buy in the store, and please, give me my money back. I was polite, no name calling, just firm.
I asked her to call the manager. She got on the phone and told the manager that here is a customer threatening her. I said I am not threatening anyone. She lied to the manager. All of a sudden the security guy came and treated me like I was a nuisance. He told me to leave the clerk alone, etc.

I told him, all I am doing is trying to return something. I showed him the merchandise, he saw it was faulty.

In the end I had to leave the store. The security man outside apologized to me. He said it was his job to "protect" the clerk.

What I am trying to say is is that would this have happened today, and would they have called the cops on me lying about me being abusive, I could have been dead today.

Tasering is too dangerous. They should ban it or use it on hard-core criminals only.

I am not excusing the actions of the clerk. She clearly lied by what you have said. Management does have an obligation to protect their employees. The store does have the right to ask you to leave if they feel they have to. It is private property after all. No different than your own home.

You did what the law abiding person does, leaves a prmise when they are asked to. Had you not, then you would have been trespassing. If it had gone as far as calling the police and they told you leave, I am sure you would have done the same thing, leave. I do not think you would have been tasered.

It is the unreasonable person that ends up on the wrong side of the law (and a taser) in situations like that.

As I have been saying, the taser is a tool. In the end, if it was improperly applied, there will be 5 RCMP officers that will answer to that. But do not convict the tool. That would be like convicting the knife used to murder someone.

 

[Olmac]

And don't tell me that this was and isolated incident and this was just one stupid clerk. It takes only one stupid clerk and one stupid cop and you are DEAD!

I guess you are not one that will debate without getting all angry,yelling and shit. I am done responding to you. I do not need bold bull shit thrown in my face. I have been calm and reasonable, now you are not.

Have a nice life.

 

[ma1234]

I guess you are not one that will debate without getting all angry,yelling and shit. I am done responding to you. I do not need bold bull shit thrown in my face. I have been calm and reasonable, now you are not.

Have a nice life.

Somehow I knew if I tell you the story you will blame me, just like you are blaming Dziekanski......