Any substance, even water, can kill. Should water be considered poison?
Fentanyl is still a useful tool for pain management.
The thread title is "Mass Murder".
Mass murders ,it happening again!!!!
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Fentanyl is still a useful tool for pain management.
Murder might be hard to prove on a mass scale with out evidence that that is the drug producers and or the distributors intent. In some cases individuals may be supplying drugs that they have doctored or know are a deadly leave, that is murder.
There are multiple levels of killing some one and multi able ways to kill your self .All those aspects are in play when it comes to drugs and drug users.Any one with an addiction will have a hard time resisting the need to for the drug of choise. Whether they know it could kill them or not does not stop them from taking it.
Now if the person selling it to them or just giving it to them know it a deadly combo then there is culpability in there death,then it us proving what was their intent.At the very least they are guilty of a degree of Manslaughter. But lacing fentanyl in to cocain ,and other drugs with out telling the dealer or user is willfully puthing some one at risk of overdosing and knowing that people will probably die.
The whole concept of safe injection sites and only using drugs when some one is there with a number of Narcon injections a is totally missing the point of what's going on.
People are dieing not just because they are addict but because there drugs arrested all tainted with ship that kills.
I personally am not involved in any of this stuff but I know to many people that use drugs of sone kind ,some even used herion and we're knowingly using fentanyl when that was all that was available.
Six months ago a girl that I knew through friends OD (and just a few days ago a friend I have lost a relative to deadly combo) and since that time other friends that are familiar with victoria drug culture has been presented at numerous ODS and administered Narcon on a number of occasionsession to safe people's lives..And we here about that his all the time from emergency response people of how many times they are called to ODs every day and how many are maltable repeat calls.
This has to be unacceptable for so many people to just be dieing in our streets and allies. Or is it only when the regular people OD or loss there children to drugs that there is a out cry..But still they are looking at it the wrong way.
The police know who are the drug producers and who are the dealers but feel the law ties their hands because they need to gather evidence legally. Maybe they just need to for get about legalities and just stop the flow any way possible. And then the goverment will gave to start dealing with the wide range addiction situation we have in our country,with about lot more resources then they about lot recently putting in now.
And there is another aspect of this mass dieing ,Those we vote into office as custodians of our society ,economics and we'll being of capitalism and consumerism ,they have know idea How to make treating this a viable option .When drug use permeates every aspect of our society and drug money and organized crime are society are such a big part of out economic growth. And some might say a stabilizing force on some social classes of sociaty.
But none of that should make mass murder ok.!!!
There are multiple levels of killing some one and multi able ways to kill your self .All those aspects are in play when it comes to drugs and drug users.Any one with an addiction will have a hard time resisting the need to for the drug of choise. Whether they know it could kill them or not does not stop them from taking it.
Now if the person selling it to them or just giving it to them know it a deadly combo then there is culpability in there death,then it us proving what was their intent.At the very least they are guilty of a degree of Manslaughter. But lacing fentanyl in to cocain ,and other drugs with out telling the dealer or user is willfully puthing some one at risk of overdosing and knowing that people will probably die.
The whole concept of safe injection sites and only using drugs when some one is there with a number of Narcon injections a is totally missing the point of what's going on.
People are dieing not just because they are addict but because there drugs arrested all tainted with ship that kills.
I personally am not involved in any of this stuff but I know to many people that use drugs of sone kind ,some even used herion and we're knowingly using fentanyl when that was all that was available.
Six months ago a girl that I knew through friends OD (and just a few days ago a friend I have lost a relative to deadly combo) and since that time other friends that are familiar with victoria drug culture has been presented at numerous ODS and administered Narcon on a number of occasionsession to safe people's lives..And we here about that his all the time from emergency response people of how many times they are called to ODs every day and how many are maltable repeat calls.
This has to be unacceptable for so many people to just be dieing in our streets and allies. Or is it only when the regular people OD or loss there children to drugs that there is a out cry..But still they are looking at it the wrong way.
The police know who are the drug producers and who are the dealers but feel the law ties their hands because they need to gather evidence legally. Maybe they just need to for get about legalities and just stop the flow any way possible. And then the goverment will gave to start dealing with the wide range addiction situation we have in our country,with about lot more resources then they about lot recently putting in now.
And there is another aspect of this mass dieing ,Those we vote into office as custodians of our society ,economics and we'll being of capitalism and consumerism ,they have know idea How to make treating this a viable option .When drug use permeates every aspect of our society and drug money and organized crime are society are such a big part of out economic growth. And some might say a stabilizing force on some social classes of sociaty.
But none of that should make mass murder ok.!!!
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Point taken on the murder issue although some people might argue there is little difference between handing out poison to a bunch of people you know are going to take it and herding them into gas chambers.. Fentanyl might be a useful tool for pain management but that does not preclude it from being a poison a large part of the problem being the difference between a safe dose and a lethal one is so small that mistakes are to easy to make and people are dying a lot of other drugs this is not the case. Not really sure what can be done so I think we should all try and come up with whatever they think might help because a lot of people are dying and were not hearing much from the politicians.
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Just a little side note.
The acctual amount of people that have died from fentanyl OD is likely a lot higher then the reported official number. Numerous deaths are not investigated for drugs or are they expert enough to suspect fentanyl. Or they just don't want to bothered to send samples away because of the time it takes. And some families don't want it Stated that there family member died of a drug overdose.
Never the less this is world wild and in epidemic perportions and the amount of deaths here in our locale area and provincially is just a small amount compared larger populated areas .There it would be all most I'm possiable to determine what drug was the cause of all the drug related deaths.If it mixed with a know easy to detect drug ., then no doubt that will be put down as cause of death, fentanyl would be totally over looked.
The acctual amount of people that have died from fentanyl OD is likely a lot higher then the reported official number. Numerous deaths are not investigated for drugs or are they expert enough to suspect fentanyl. Or they just don't want to bothered to send samples away because of the time it takes. And some families don't want it Stated that there family member died of a drug overdose.
Never the less this is world wild and in epidemic perportions and the amount of deaths here in our locale area and provincially is just a small amount compared larger populated areas .There it would be all most I'm possiable to determine what drug was the cause of all the drug related deaths.If it mixed with a know easy to detect drug ., then no doubt that will be put down as cause of death, fentanyl would be totally over looked.
Correct. Stats only show overdose deaths where the family or someone else gets the OD victim to the hospital & they expire in a hospital environment. It doesn't count those who drop dead in an alley, a club bathroom, or a 5 star hotel room. Also doesn't count the near fatalities that result in permanent disability (brain damage) or the lucky few who actually gets the Naloxone in time.
The one thing I find very strange is that there has been a number of high profile celebrity due from drug overdoses and many of the resent ones it was fentanyl that they OD on. Now we're they even aware what they were using ? Was in suicide in some cases?
Again it seems there friend ,family and the community sees it as a tragedy and an inevitable out come of their addiction struggle. And yet they could of just as easily been supplied with the deaday drug to purposely kill them
And I feel that is highly likely when millions of dollars are involved.
But we hear nothing of the posiablity of murder when this deadly drug is involved.
Again it seems there friend ,family and the community sees it as a tragedy and an inevitable out come of their addiction struggle. And yet they could of just as easily been supplied with the deaday drug to purposely kill them
And I feel that is highly likely when millions of dollars are involved.
But we hear nothing of the posiablity of murder when this deadly drug is involved.
I've only read the first part of your post and not every reply, so I will only reply to that part. A lot of the users DO KNOW its fent, they are so sick and so addicted to it that they are willing to take the risk of hitting a "hot spot" (a high dose of fentanyl where its not properly mixed) and dying. True story, there is a documentary recently done in Canada by CBC http://watch.cbc.ca/firsthand/season-2/episode-7/38e815a-00b3f74929f
Then "some people" are fucking idiots who have no god damn clue.
My father was one of the first Allied troops into Buchenwald, and saw Dachau as well.
I toured the Auschwitz site myself. Also saw REAL genocide in various overseas rotations, as in piles of bodies in ditches, securing sites for UN war crimes investigators, and worse.
Comparing drug dealers with those places is ridiculous and tells me "some people" lead pretty cushy sheltered lives.
There are plenty of places where many more people die for being the wrong religion, the wrong race, or just because they are in the crossfire.
That never bothered the latte liberals of Vancouver.
Fentanyl is the first time they have had to face anything up close and they are panicking.
I am sure many addict know it fentanyl ,for that last 6 month I heard that there has not been much or any herion available, so they are all shooting and smoking some combination of fentanyl and what ever.
That should not mitigate the fact they are being sold a possiable death sentence. Whether they are druggist or not they deserve to be treated better by their deserve tug dealers .
As for other problably %50 of deaths by occasional users and shit in party favors they just seem to be ignorant of the fact and dangers of fentanyl., even though there are all the reports of deaths .Those deaths are still being promoted more aso the street scene and long time drug addicts. Totally miss leading reporting.
That should not mitigate the fact they are being sold a possiable death sentence. Whether they are druggist or not they deserve to be treated better by their deserve tug dealers .
As for other problably %50 of deaths by occasional users and shit in party favors they just seem to be ignorant of the fact and dangers of fentanyl., even though there are all the reports of deaths .Those deaths are still being promoted more aso the street scene and long time drug addicts. Totally miss leading reporting.
Its Chinese, really easy to get from China. The reason why its so heavily prevalent everywhere is because its easy to order off the internet with a click of a few buttons from the research chemical labs in China. No more smuggling kilos of heroin through the ports, now it comes right through Canada post into your mailbox.
So as long as you scatter the bodies around so there not all in one place your just the friendly neighborhood salesman trying to make sure everyone has a good time but you know accidents happen.
It was my understanding that if a body was found in an alley, club, etc. the coroner's office would have to determine cause of death nonetheless, particularly if there are no external signs (e.g. ingested not injected). Would those Fentanyl statistics not roll those toxicology reports into their numbers?
I go to a SW or SP or..????...have bareback sex, end up with brain rot clap and it's all my fault....I should have known better. The fact she told me she was clean just isn't a good enough excuse...it's your fault buddy. Go to some back alley hump or dial a dope dealer and get whatever shit you intend to snort, inject, smoke or mix in your drink and it kills you...it's, oh you poor victim...just wanted to have some fun, relax after a hard day at work. Well if you need a drug for that get some from a Doctor...... if that kills you then there's some excuse to complain. You go dial a dope........you are a fucking dope. No sympathy whatsoever, clean out the gene pool.....
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murder is a stretch
possibility of an involuntary manslaughter, but of course I am not a criminal lawyer
not that its any better regarding the criminality of distributing harmful substance
not sure its a blanket situation, more like a case by case situation but I agree that something like this can grow in terms of level of problem and a proportional response is warranted
possibility of an involuntary manslaughter, but of course I am not a criminal lawyer
not that its any better regarding the criminality of distributing harmful substance
not sure its a blanket situation, more like a case by case situation but I agree that something like this can grow in terms of level of problem and a proportional response is warranted
Do you have a link to anything that specifies their inclusion criteria? The only thing I can find is this coroners' report:
http://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/pu...th-investigation/statistical/illicit-drug.pdf
Since it comes from BC Coroners Services itself it seems odd that they wouldn't include street deaths, club deaths, etc. since they would have that data.
Edit to add: I'm responding to the train of thought where you followed up on johnsmit's speculation that the number of deaths would be much higher than the "official number." (I think he was responding to LalaniElectrica's number of 755, which seems to be the number from this report.) You seem to be saying this official number wouldn't include street deaths etc. Yet this Coroners' Report seems to be the source of the official number and there's no indication they'd exclude them. I'm wondering if we're talking about the same thing?
I was making an assumption that maybe some deaths were not reported as drug related for variety of reasons.
As it turns out that not all deaths are examined by a BC corinor to determine course of death , they often accept the cause of death report from the hospital. And there are a number of death. Where unknown cause is listed .
There were over 35000 deaths in B.C last yr..95 were listed as murder.
If more drug deaths were classed as murder that would sure raise the murder rate above acceptable levels.
There were 605 murders in all of Canada in 2016 ,add in just 40% of drug deaths and we would have over 2000.
murders of some degree.
I am not suggesting that every drug related deaths should be classed as murder and yet culpability can be ascribed to other then just the user, and those supplying tainted drug that are a lethal combination have to bear part if not all responsibility for the persons death .
Just a note .BC. has the highest number of reported drug deaths . It strange that Ontario and Quebec are lower. But they also have different criteria for having a corinor investigation for deaths in the province.
I personally don't think they want to report the amount of real drug deaths in their Provence. They report them as other cause.
As it turns out that not all deaths are examined by a BC corinor to determine course of death , they often accept the cause of death report from the hospital. And there are a number of death. Where unknown cause is listed .
There were over 35000 deaths in B.C last yr..95 were listed as murder.
If more drug deaths were classed as murder that would sure raise the murder rate above acceptable levels.
There were 605 murders in all of Canada in 2016 ,add in just 40% of drug deaths and we would have over 2000.
murders of some degree.
I am not suggesting that every drug related deaths should be classed as murder and yet culpability can be ascribed to other then just the user, and those supplying tainted drug that are a lethal combination have to bear part if not all responsibility for the persons death .
Just a note .BC. has the highest number of reported drug deaths . It strange that Ontario and Quebec are lower. But they also have different criteria for having a corinor investigation for deaths in the province.
I personally don't think they want to report the amount of real drug deaths in their Provence. They report them as other cause.
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Consuming drugs will always lead a person to the road of loss and death. We know that very well but actually our mind is forgetting to accept it.
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