Is Perb a dying or useless Board?

[Fred Zed]

Yea as always Edmonton/Calgary don't matter when compared to the amount of paid advertiser revenue Fred gets from Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver so he can afford to say fuck off to Edmonton/Calgary.

I appreciate that Fred built a park for us to play in, however he's not doing anything to maintain or improve it when compared to the other forum.

LOL, unfortunately you are correct that 99% of our advertising revenue is from Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver. Remember when PERB started it was VERB - Vancouver Escort Review Board. As far as advertising revenue most of the money is to be made in the big cities. We could close the small city forums and it would not make much difference to our advertising revenue.

 

[Dark_Knight]

The forum is basically a free service to the hobbyist. Our format is working very well for many years now. It is the same format for Calgary and Edmonton as we have for other cities across Canada. It does not matter to us if people in Edmonton or Calgary choose not to use the forums.

That has been quite apparent over the years as the "Other Canada" section of PERB suffered from neglect and trolls. It is just how it is. a few years back there was a lot of drama and trolling in the edmonton section that was allowed to continue. There have been certain Trolls that made perb a very hostile bitter place "MethodMan" "FunnyFunGuy" and others. In the case of Methodman, he (or she) outed several SPs on the board, and that information was left up for at least 24 hours before it was finally removed. I think that was part of the downfall of the Edmonton section, as there were a few ladies that were paid advertisers that got outed there. A real big thing that was needed when the Edmonton section of perb was a busy viable place was a separate advertising section. I do know that was requested back then, but you had said the board was good as it was. The Edmonton ladies mentioned to me that their ads would get buried in the ad section as that section was for alberta, sask, and manitoba. Finally that has been changed, but for the most part it is too late. There are very few advertisers for Edmonton now compared to what there was back then!

LOL, unfortunately you are correct that 99% of our advertising revenue is from Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver. Remember when PERB started it was VERB - Vancouver Escort Review Board. As far as advertising revenue most of the money is to be made in the big cities. We could close the small city forums and it would not make much difference to our advertising revenue.

Yet another board is able to survive on JUST those smaller cities. I would bet a the peak of the Edmonton and Calgary sections of PERB's popularity that you made as much in ad revenue from them as you did from Vancouver. That market has since dried up for the most part, but back then I would bet it made some good revenue.

 

[Fred Zed]

Yet another board is able to survive on JUST those smaller cities. I would bet a the peak of the Edmonton and Calgary sections of PERB's popularity that you made as much in ad revenue from them as you did from Vancouver. That market has since dried up for the most part, but back then I would bet it made some good revenue.

No, some parts of Canada just don't generate that much in terms of ad revenue. We never have made that much from Edmonton/ Calgary. There isn't much money to be made there. Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver is where the money is. Toronto in particular has the largest market followed by Montreal and Vancouver. Toronto and Montreal get lots of US business. Edmonton and Calgary is just pocket change.

 

[Dark_Knight]

No, some parts of Canada just don't generate that much in terms of ad revenue. We never have made that much from Edmonton/ Calgary. There isn't much money to be made there. Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver is where the money is. Toronto in particular has the largest market followed by Montreal and Vancouver. Toronto and Montreal get lots of US business. Edmonton and Calgary is just pocket change.

I never doubted that Toronto was the center of the universe!

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I don't see this as Fred's problem as much as the general membership's.
Fred built the board and runs it as far as the advertising and other logisitics but the meat and potatoes of the board are the reviews. Fred is not the one seeing the SP's (well, maybe he does ), requesting the information, writing the reviews, etc. We the members are.
I have sat on the board of a couple of different professional organizations. Members would always complain about the association this or the association that. I would constantly remind them that the "association" was not an entity of itself but it was the "members." If they didn't like something they were the ones who should and could change it.
While Perb may not work exactly like that, if Perb is "failing" us it is because of the general apathy out there in the community, not because of anything Fred did or didn't do.
If we want Perb to be more useful, start writing reviews. I assume you are here because you see SP's. If so then share your experiences. Don't expect everyone else to write reviews and think you can just sit back and not contribute.

Cheers

 

[Dgodus]

I don't see this as Fred's problem as much as the general membership's.
Fred built the board and runs it as far as the advertising and other logisitics but the meat and potatoes of the board are the reviews. Fred is not the one seeing the SP's (well, maybe he does ), requesting the information, writing the reviews, etc. We the members are.
I have sat on the board of a couple of different professional organizations. Members would always complain about the association this or the association that. I would constantly remind them that the "association" was not an entity of itself but it was the "members." If they didn't like something they were the ones who should and could change it.
While Perb may not work exactly like that, if Perb is "failing" us it is because of the general apathy out there in the community, not because of anything Fred did or didn't do.
If we want Perb to be more useful, start writing reviews. I assume you are here because you see SP's. If so then share your experiences. Don't expect everyone else to write reviews and think you can just sit back and not contribute.

Cheers

But, but, but finger pointing is so much easier than looking in a mirror and accepting responsibility!!!

 

[Bobo The Rabbit]

This thread is about PERB Edmonton and Calgary.
Their death was not the fault of the users but mismanagement on behalf of the mods/Fred. Again ill say that due to His sucess elsewhere he dosent have to care about Edmonton and calgary.
That's fact.

Take the time to read what the users from Edmonton and Calgary have said.

It's not a lie that trolls ruined the forums along with the other issues.

Then go look at Canada adult funs forums and you'll see names that for years posted reviews here posting there.

Perb Edmonton and Calgary ARE dead.

 

[Annalise Lane]

the other board makes 200k a year: my estimations are as follows.

Front page ads:
55 X 365 = 20,075
45 x 365 = 16,425
35 x 365 = 12,775
(I believe he is now charging for 4th place at 25 a spot/day) 25 x 365 = 9125

Membership is 120 for 3 months assuming they have a 100 advertisers:
480 (one member will pay/year) x 100 (assumption) = 48,000


97,275 a year on these numbers (4th spot added, 106,400)

Banners are 50 to 100 = assumptions: 20 x 100 = 2000/m x 12 m = 24k

121,275 a year. (4th spot added, 130,400)

Funny how we do the math and Chillman makes 120k a year on these numbers. It's probably closer to 150k as I'm being conservative with 100 paid members. I believe he charges the men an admission fee for the men's section of that board, which brings his numbers closer to 150k/year

Edmonton's population is 812,201
http://www.edmonton.ca/city_government/news/2012/edmontons-population-is-growing.aspx

Now lets ad:
Spruce Grove, 26,171
Sherwood Park, 92,490
St. Albert, 60,994
Leduc, 57,719
Nisku, is included in Leduc from what I can google.
Fort Saskatchewan, 19,051
Beaumont, 13,284
Camrose, 17,286

= 286,995 for surrounding communities of Edmonton.
= 1,099,196 in a 30km radius of Edmonton Proper
Lets not forget the farmers = no number(but you get the idea)

http://www.citypopulation.de/Canada-Alberta.html

With the many traveling men from Fort Mac because of 10 on 4 off or 21 on and 7 off rotations. They stop in before heading home East or else where.


Calgary's population is 1,120,225
http://www.edmonton.ca/city_government/news/2012/edmontons-population-is-growing.aspx
The majority of the Oil and Gas head offices are in Calgary, which puts them in the prime of U.S Executives traveling for business.

Chestemere, 14,824
Cochrane, 17,580
Okotoks, 24,511
Airdrie, 42,564
Canmore, 12,288

= 111,767 for surrounding communities of Calgary
Total population within 30mins of Calgary Proper, 1,231,992
Lets not forget the farmers = no number(but you get the idea)


Total of both cities is higher then Vancouver Proper, yet we on perb have no value ? Edmonton and Calgary combined is 2,331,188 which is higher then Vancouver Proper. Interesting when you put numbers down to really see our population compared to Vancouver, when it was argued that Vancouver leads in Population --- WE also lead in economic growth when compared to Vancouver.

Vancouver's population is around 578,000, but the metropolitan area exceeds 2.1 million.

We, Albertain's are under valued on perb as a hooker consumers, it's sad. Fred has let the other board dominate this section of Western Canada. ~sigh~ To recover the lost membership for Alberta might be difficult at this point, but not impossible. Women who use these boards to advertise do so if they see a return on their investment. There was a time, PERB rocked Western Canada.

Men come to boards to verify a lady is worth spending his hard earned money on, a lady advertises on a board because the men are looking. These two groups need to algin otherwise it's off balance and other sides of the equation became relative. Men only come to sites where the ladies are, women only advertise where they make their most from the investment of advertising. Men come to boards to read reviews. Women come to boards to advertise. It's a cycle, but who wins in the end ? The board owners who understand the economic needs the ladies have to generate the most bang for her buck. Drawing new membership, maintaining old membership = growth. Stay stagnant for to long (which perb did), or do not do your due diligence with growth and you'll lose a whole group of people who find value in other boards. This is what happened. The bigger question is: how do we regain our (perbs) strength back from another time ?

Where do the ladies advertise to get the most value from her $$ ?? Backpage is number one, perb use to be. At 3.25 a day (U.S currency exchange and processing fee ads to .25) every day. Backpage makes a day from edmonton alone, over 400 plus the sponsorship ads at 14 a week.

Fred has said, he's happy with the numbers from Vancouver membership, but has neglected Albertians to the point of allowing another board dominance in this industry in by which he has said 150k/year isn't worth the effort. ~FROWN~

FRED come back to US !!

 

[Bobo The Rabbit]

Fred's attitude has been dismissive of Edmonton and Calgary.
Wish I made enough to say fuck you to $150,000.

 

[Fred Zed]

This thread is about PERB Edmonton and Calgary.
Their death was not the fault of the users but mismanagement on behalf of the mods/Fred. Again ill say that due to His sucess elsewhere he dosent have to care about Edmonton and calgary.
That's fact.
Take the time to read what the users from Edmonton and Calgary have said.

It's not a lie that trolls ruined the forums along with the other issues.

Then go look at Canada adult funs forums and you'll see names that for years posted reviews here posting there.

Perb Edmonton and Calgary ARE dead.

Wow, what's wrong with Alberta being served with more than one board ? In Toronto there are over 5 boards serving the city as of right now. Almost all of them are doing very well in terms of traffic, reviews and advertising. Right from about the time that I started these boards about 10 years ago Edmonton had their own board EAEB -Edmonton Alternative Entertainment Board ?? I don't think that is a bad thing ?
Perb's overall traffic is significantly higher than the other board.

 

[Fred Zed]

I don't see this as Fred's problem as much as the general membership's.
Fred built the board and runs it as far as the advertising and other logisitics but the meat and potatoes of the board are the reviews. Fred is not the one seeing the SP's (well, maybe he does ), requesting the information, writing the reviews, etc. We the members are.
I have sat on the board of a couple of different professional organizations. Members would always complain about the association this or the association that. I would constantly remind them that the "association" was not an entity of itself but it was the "members." If they didn't like something they were the ones who should and could change it.
While Perb may not work exactly like that, if Perb is "failing" us it is because of the general apathy out there in the community, not because of anything Fred did or didn't do.
If we want Perb to be more useful, start writing reviews. I assume you are here because you see SP's. If so then share your experiences. Don't expect everyone else to write reviews and think you can just sit back and not contribute.

Cheers

Well said. Couldn't have said it better myself. Btw for those of you blaming trolls. I never received a single email from you complaining about trolls.

 

[Dark_Knight]

Just a simple observation here.... I have noticed lots of people attempting to lay blame on WHY perb has failed as a review board for Edmonton/Calgary, but I see no suggestions or ideas on how to improve it. There are probably many reasons why perb is a dying board in terms of Edmonton/Calgary, but arguing about them won't change anything.

Yes, the cart is broken. Now we can either leave it broken or attempt to fix it.

 

[Mod-2]

Yes, the cart is broken. Now we can either leave it broken or attempt to fix it.

Well said. Perhaps some positive ideas to forward the areas being discussed would be more productive.

 

[satinguy]

Edmonton and Calgary seem to have a large(r) transient SP population. The other board allows links to non-paid advertisers which helps identify the SP in question, this may help increase the traffic.

I'm no expert but this seems like a pretty good suggestion to me and definitely a step in the right direction.

I'm a member of both Boards and feel there is a place for both. Not for me to say which one is better as both have things I like and things i don't like.

Lets start with PERB, the good is a great Lounge section with great discussions on a number of topics. BDSM section is much better here too. "The other One" more Alberta content although a lot of it is Calgary which leaves Edmonton left out. Pictures section is great and i have made many booking based on this section alone.

The Bad: PERB, because of rules on links i am often lost on the person being reviewed. Advertising, not so much lately but too many times i read an ad that interested me in the Edmonton section, only to find out it is for Vancouver. THere are a few trolls kicking around but they all have that. THe SP's on the other site are more vocal and tend to weigh in on the reviews and sometimes defend themselves on bad reviews. Advertising rules here prohibit this on PERB i believe. SAdly less Edmonton and Calgary content, reviews and ads.

THe Bad: "Other Board," Asshole Moderators who are nothing more than pathetic bullies. Not all of them mind you, in fact most are very decent, fair and helpful, and in this to help but one or two, one in particular is a schmuck and driving members off the site. THey lock threads and ban good contibutors for no reason. The Mods break their own rules, insult members, cover for their friends and have one set of rules for Calgary guys and one set for Edmonton guys. Reputation points are just dumb the way they structure it, they lead to far too much drama and too many guys getting banned. Annonymous Neg reps are cowardly and you get banned if you complain about it so they should have it so you must sign your name to it.

Schilling over there is pathetic too. One clown dug up his old review from about 2 years ago to tell people to go visit a certain lady. I get neg repped from the same clown for trying to help a new guy who asked a simple question. The pack mentality can be brutal when they decide to gang up on someone, SP's included. I even seen a thread locked and opened just so one mod could get a shot in at a particular lady. Ass kissers, that site is full of them. Mostly Calgary guys trying to keep on the good side of the Moderators but so transparent it is comical.

It is too bad really, both Boards serve a valuable purpose. New people are not treated very well over there and the pathetic bullying by moderators and "Elite" members is pathetic. Overall there are some great people on that site but also some of the worse. I joined both places around the same time and was made to feel welcome but most of those guys have been banned and i hope they are here under new handles. Would love to hear from them but i also understand discretion.

Hopefully both boards can fix a few things and 2 boards is better than one.

 

[Dark_Knight]

It was my intent to try to help perb regain some of its former glory. With the recent deletion of what I felt to be a valuable thread for Edmonton pooners, I have re-evaluated things and I will no longer be contributing reviews to this board.

 

[satinguy]

Sad news DK,

I always felt your contirbutions to PERB were positive and helpful, hopefully you reconsider your decision. Kind of curious as to the thread you are referring to. All the best.

It was my intent to try to help perb regain some of its former glory. With the recent deletion of what I felt to be a valuable thread for Edmonton pooners, I have re-evaluated things and I will no longer be contributing reviews to this board.

 

[LalaniElectrica]

Actually, Fred it would perhaps be a good idea to consider including Edmonton and calgary in the Perb site, as many many people travel back and forth all year long, instead of Alberta not having a resource at all.

Someone mentioned about responding to requests, I have definitely at times, gone back and offered to indulge a fantasy someone has requested and Many times I do not hear a response back. I do get inquiries through perb but they go through My website usually, or simply call, so it's definitely an active board and in the bdsm section I have gotten many reviews so people do check the posts and read the reviews, etc.

The first review I ever received here someone called it a "shill" and I did find it insulting. It takes a lot of courage for some people to post a review, so it would be a great idea to have more respect for those who are supporting the advertisers here!

 

[satinguy]

Sad news DK,

I always felt your contirbutions to PERB were positive and helpful, hopefully you reconsider your decision. All the best.

Unable to edit my previous post on this topic so please diregard my previous comment/question. Again DK, i hope you reconsider your decision and not let this deleted thread bother you. You are a valuable contributor and you will be missed greatly.

 

[jim]

Sad news DK,

I always felt your contirbutions to PERB were positive and helpful, hopefully you reconsider your decision. Kind of curious as to the thread you are referring to. All the best.

I think he will. As we have seen there is no perfect place to hang out in and even those that profess for be 'better and fairer' are in the end worse than the established sites.

 

[leoghaire]

with the new AB based board even the people who are only on here because they got banned from C** will switch to the new board and more people will leave here. Sad really but that is what willful neglect of an entire section of a board will do for you.