Underage rape victim charged for killing her attacker and sentanced to death in irac.

[paigesplaymate]

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=5183


Wonder why the goverment doesn't step into shit like this instead of putting there nose where it doesnt belong, seems to me the new goverment isn't better than the past goverment there.

 

[noneasgood]

Why doesn't the government step in you asked?

Because the current Iranian government, particularly their new President, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad, is essentially an extention of the religous fanatics who sentenced her, that's why.

 

[Ilovethemall]

they are the gov't

The gov't supports that kind of BS in that country.....see my signature for what to do with Iran.

 

[HankQuinlan]

http://www.iranfocus.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=5183


Wonder why the goverment doesn't step into shit like this instead of putting there nose where it doesnt belong, seems to me the new goverment isn't better than the past goverment there.

To original poster --- I suspect you misread the article as being from Iraq (new government and all, even though Iran has a recent new asshole president as well) rather than from Iran.

 

[georgebushmoron]

well what a surprise. This kind of thing has been happening in places like Iran, Afghanistan, and even the new American friend and ally, Pakistan, where they are trying a man who slit the throat of his daughters because the eldest one was an adulterer and didn't want the bad example set for the younger ones. Even a year ago, in good ol' friend Kuwait, a man got a paltry 18 month sentence for slitting the throat of his 14-year-old daughter. But even in states that are friends of the US, nothing is done about the form of justice in these countries.

You will see the step up in rhetoric about Iran in the next few months about things that have been happening in Iran for decades. Khatami is nothing new either, there have been past mullahs and clerics who have said crazed things about Israel and the US before. The rhetoric being stepped up is purposeful; it is to rile the American public into a justification for war with Iran, the justfication being that we are going to save the women and give them democracy - the usual "humanitarian" excuse. It'll probably be an invasion, by summer time. Mark my words, it's going to happen.

 

[Discombobbled]

well what a surprise. This kind of thing has been happening in places like Iran, Afghanistan, and even the new American friend and ally, Pakistan, where they are trying a man who slit the throat of his daughters because the eldest one was an adulterer and didn't want the bad example set for the younger ones. Even a year ago, in good ol' friend Kuwait, a man got a paltry 18 month sentence for slitting the throat of his 14-year-old daughter. But even in states that are friends of the US, nothing is done about the form of justice in these countries.

You will see the step up in rhetoric about Iran in the next few months about things that have been happening in Iran for decades. Khatami is nothing new either, there have been past mullahs and clerics who have said crazed things about Israel and the US before. The rhetoric being stepped up is purposeful; it is to rile the American public into a justification for war with Iran, the justfication being that we are going to save the women and give them democracy - the usual "humanitarian" excuse. It'll probably be an invasion, by summer time. Mark my words, it's going to happen.

Hey George, good to see you back. The new rules, well ...

Have you seen the growing calls to impeach you?

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/index.php?id=5498

 

[Discombobbled]

The gov't supports that kind of BS in that country.....see my signature for what to do with Iran.

It sure is good to see that you're still determining who should live and who should die there Mall. Including the innocents, but I guess they're just 'collateral damage' aren't they? Maybe you should focus your time harrassing and degrading SP's for no particular reason?

 

[georgebushmoron]

Have you seen the growing calls to impeach you?

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/index.php?id=5498

Bring it on! Cuz it doesn't matter anyways, by the time the fact-finding and analyses of law and hearings are over, the term of office would have already expired. The only saving grace is that a criminal investigation proceeds as a result.

 

[future canadian]

They are waving the red blanket into the face of the western world and most likely already have a nuke, with a madman's finger on the button!

a nuke that probably is short range and would not strike the US. Probably explains why the Brits, French and Germans have been speaking with Iran, THEY don't want to be hit by their possible nuke.

"You want to know what the business world thinks of you? We think a hundred years ago you were living out here in tents in the desert chopping each others heads off, and that's exactly where you're gonna be in another hundred. So yes, on behalf of my firm, I accept your money."--Bryan Woodman (Syriana)

 

[Dulcinea]

well what a surprise. This kind of thing has been happening in places like Iran, Afghanistan, and even the new American friend and ally, Pakistan, where they are trying a man who slit the throat of his daughters because the eldest one was an adulterer and didn't want the bad example set for the younger ones. Even a year ago, in good ol' friend Kuwait, a man got a paltry 18 month sentence for slitting the throat of his 14-year-old daughter. But even in states that are friends of the US, nothing is done about the form of justice in these countries.

You will see the step up in rhetoric about Iran in the next few months about things that have been happening in Iran for decades. Khatami is nothing new either, there have been past mullahs and clerics who have said crazed things about Israel and the US before. The rhetoric being stepped up is purposeful; it is to rile the American public into a justification for war with Iran, the justfication being that we are going to save the women and give them democracy - the usual "humanitarian" excuse. It'll probably be an invasion, by summer time. Mark my words, it's going to happen.

Give us a break - you Americans execute your citizens

Some example USA is setting for the rest of the developing world. A country led by a christian who kills his own people, is there any logic in this?

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/cp.htm

In 2004, 59 persons in 12 States were executed -- 23 in Texas; 7 in Ohio; 6 in Oklahoma; 5 in Virginia; 4 each in North Carolina and South Carolina, 2 each in Alabama, Florida, Georgia, and Nevada; and 1 each in Arkansas and Maryland.

 

[Discombobbled]

Give us a break - you Americans execute your citizens

Some example USA is setting for the rest of the developing world. A country led by a christian who kills his own people, is there any logic in this?

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/cp.htm

In 2004, 59 persons in 12 States were executed -- 23 in Texas; 7 in Ohio; 6 in Oklahoma; 5 in Virginia; 4 each in North Carolina and South Carolina, 2 each in Alabama, Florida, Georgia, and Nevada; and 1 each in Arkansas and Maryland.

George can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think his point is that the majority of State sanctioned murder is misguided. The basic concept is, "If you criminalize murder, then if the state murders to get some sort of retribution then the state is no better than the accused murderer in carrying out it's sentence"

So in basic language it means, " don't do this because if you do do this we will ensure the same thing (or much worse) happens to you but only under the guise of legality. If you believe in an eye for an eye, then so be it, but if you think there is something more beyond your primary desire to see another suffer untold pain, then there are always other acceptable choices. Well said Dulcinea!

 

[georgebushmoron]

George can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think his point is that the majority of State sanctioned murder is misguided. The basic concept is, "If you criminalize murder, then if the state murders to get some sort of retribution then the state is no better than the accused murderer in carrying out it's sentence"

So in basic language it means, " don't do this because if you do do this we will ensure the same thing (or much worse) happens to you but only under the guise of legality. If you believe in an eye for an eye, then so be it, but if you think there is something more beyond your primary desire to see another suffer untold pain, then there are always other acceptable choices. Well said Dulcinea!

I think you interpreted Dulcinea's post accurately.

But sorry to disappoint you, I support state-sanctioned execution under the right circumstances. I'd like to add that many who oppose state-sanctioned execution (presumably because they believe that the sanctity of life is paramount above all else) also support execution of a fetus by the mother under what is called "abortion". While I support state-sanctioned execution of criminals, I am weak on support of execution of fetuses by their mothers.

If America is a Christian nation, then it ought to abide by Christian principles, which is to hold the sanctity of life paramount above all other things on earth. I for one don't believe America is a Christian nation.

I support state-sanctioned execution not because it would deter crazed murderers (I doubt it would do anything to the crime rate), and not because it would bring back dead victims from the grave, and not because it is a good form of punishment (I think solitary confinement forever is much much worse, then of course, there is also torture as the ultimate punishment). I support it because I don't think that life is the right and sanctity of the individual. I think one's right to life and it's liberties and freedoms should be owned by the state. You are alive only because the state deems you worthy of living. You forfeit your life by taking extreme actions that are against society thereby endangering its' proper function. I also support state-sanctioned execution because it is the ultimate form of justice, and Justice must reign supreme over the sanctity of life. There is no avenging the victim save what the state can do to wipe the murderer off the face of the earth. Life without justice is what the wilderness offers us, but we live in civilization so we must have justice.

 

[Discombobbled]

I support state-sanctioned execution not because it would deter crazed murderers (I doubt it would do anything to the crime rate), and not because it would bring back dead victims from the grave, and not because it is a good form of punishment (I think solitary confinement forever is much much worse, then of course, there is also torture as the ultimate punishment). I support it because I don't think that life is the right and sanctity of the individual. I think one's right to life and it's liberties and freedoms should be owned by the state. You are alive only because the state deems you worthy of living. You forfeit your life by taking extreme actions that are against society thereby endangering its' proper function. I also support state-sanctioned execution because it is the ultimate form of justice, and Justice must reign supreme over the sanctity of life. There is no avenging the victim save what the state can do to wipe the murderer off the face of the earth. Life without justice is what the wilderness offers us, but we live in civilization so we must have justice.

Fair enough, it's clear that harsher penalties don't have an effect on the crime rate. We used to burn people at the stake and other unspeakable things, but the crime rate didn't go down.

I must take issue with one of your statements though. People don't forfeit their right to life, the state takes that right away from them. It's not a conscious choice, it's a decision that's imposed.

 

[Tater54]

A Couple of Thoughts Regarding This Thread

Reading the various posts here sparked a couple of thoughts with me.

1. In my opinion, the biggest barrier to any western country (the U.S., Canada, Great Britain, etc.) dealing successfully with middle eastern countries is rooted in the huge cultural differences that exist between our societies and those differences originate in what were the dominant religions at the time of the nations' founding. The philosophical differences between Christianity and Islam manifest themselves in the politically motivated actions of all parties involved. Until the U.S. fully realizes how completely their religious beliefs influence their actions, it will be unable to deal successfully with any middle eastern country. And while what they call crimes and how those crimes are dealt with may be abhorant to us, they find the values we have just as disgusting.

2. In war, people die, and a lot of them are "innocent" civilians. I put that in quotes because people are ultimately responsible for their leadership and therefore are not really innocent, but that's another discussion for another thread. The mcivilian casualties involved with most military actions is precisely the reason why those of us who have served or are serving really don't like the idea of going to war a whole lot. We know what the weapons we have can do and it isn't pretty for anyone who happens to get in their way. Armed action should always be the last resort, but once that path is chose, we also believe you should do the job right the first time because in the end it results in the least loss of life possible. Yeah, war is indeed hell and people do die. That's why it stinks to high heaven, but as an extreme example I would have no second thoughts about dropping a nuclear weapon into the middle of Tehran if it was a question of them or us.

 

[georgebushmoron]

. I put that in quotes because people are ultimately responsible for their leadership and therefore are not really innocent

you've got to be kidding. Maybe so in a democracy, but not so in many other forms of government. Yeah, the Kurds really wanted Sadaam as their leader. The Nicaraguans wanted Somoza. Russians wanted Stalin. Chileans wanted Pinochet. People want to be treated unfairly, wrongly imprisoned, executed, raped, starved, poor, etc. Yes they do.

 

[Tater54]

Your Entitled to Your Opinion ...

... as I am to mine. Leaders come and go, be they despotic or benevolent. Over the course of time, the people are ultimately responsible for who ends up in power. While the Russians may have not had much choice about Stalin, they DID have choice in the course of events that eventually led to his rise to power.

The problem that I think the U.S. has in particular is that we look at events and history over too short a window of time. We are not a patient people. Just look at the rise of the instant gratification society we have created. We look at vurtually everything that way. We're also arrogant in that we refuse to learn from the mistakes of the past. Why? Because we're smarter and stronger and wiser. We won't make the same mistakes this time around, but usually do.

This is just my take on things. We are all entitled to our own opinions, so by all means disagree if you feel inclined to do so. Without disagreement we have no hope of ever finding out what truth really is.

 

[georgebushmoron]

... as I am to mine. Leaders come and go, be they despotic or benevolent. Over the course of time, the people are ultimately responsible for who ends up in power. While the Russians may have not had much choice about Stalin, they DID have choice in the course of events that eventually led to his rise to power.

The problem that I think the U.S. has in particular is that we look at events and history over too short a window of time. We are not a patient people. Just look at the rise of the instant gratification society we have created. We look at vurtually everything that way. We're also arrogant in that we refuse to learn from the mistakes of the past. Why? Because we're smarter and stronger and wiser. We won't make the same mistakes this time around, but usually do.

This is just my take on things. We are all entitled to our own opinions, so by all means disagree if you feel inclined to do so. Without disagreement we have no hope of ever finding out what truth really is.

Generally speaking, I'm not into philosophy.