Thoughts on Canada Post Strike

[johnnydepth]

My take is simple; These guys should be grateful they have jobs at all. The home delivery mail system is so obsolete it probably could have been
streamlined 10 years ago or more. Most of what I receive is unwanted junk mail, flyers, etc.. The majority of my mail is handled online and the few things that
"have" to be delivered to my door are issued locally so I could just pick them up myself.
There is no reason mail needs to be delivered to a household more than once a week.
I think the postal service is about as useful as a daily home newspaper delivery. Both are dinosaurs refusing to see the cloud forming
over their heads.
Thoughts?

 

[87112]

It is a hard ass job. I did it for the USPS. Time goes by amazing quick out there except for the 2 to 3 hour mail sort in the morning which is absolutely boring and tedious touture. There are a billion slots to sort mail in and I hated every min of that. It will be gone in 20 years and maybe me too.

 

[badbadboy]

I take it you are not a big user of Amazon or other merchants who depend upon Canada Post to provide home delivery? They deliver goods 5 days a week if it is available. There has been pressure to be more like US Postal Service delivering 6 days a week.

If you read job search engines like Monster or Indeed you will see reviews about Canada Post written by employees. Not exactly a great place to work from the comments I've read.

I agree that the amount of junk mail is excessive. Canada Post gives bulk contracts to the merchants who depend upon getting their sales messages out to people. I'd say 75% of the stuff coming to me goes straight into the recycling bin. If you think about it, Canada Post is the messenger and its the large merchants like SaveOn Foods, Supervalu, London Drugs etc who are buying the print media to send out to every household.

I don't think there will be changes to their delivery mandate given they have to deliver to every postal code in Canada. Many courier companies won't go to some of the areas served by Canada Post.

 

[felixthecat]

My take is simple; These guys should be grateful they have jobs at all.

It is a rational response to squeeze as much as possible from your current situation if your job has no future. Either that, or look for a career change already.

However, Canada Post as a business is profitable. It's not going anywhere just yet. The focus shifted from lettermail to parcels, still need regular deliveries though.

There are potential challenges, sure. Online shopping won't disappear, but people may get more savvy ordering from abroad (I'm guessing incoming parcels from China, Malaysia etc. can grow faster than revenue-generating parcels from Canada). As of now, online shopping has hardly reached its full potential, so the near future is relatively safe for Canada Post. Retailers have their own streamlining to do, and local deliveries by Canada Post seem to work for them.

 

[Cock Throppled]

Canada Post made a specifci plan to go after the parcel delivery market, but they don't seem to want to hire enough people to run their successful operation. If their service was still failing there might be an argument for streamlining, but they have cornered a huge part of the current delivery system, so fund it properly.

 

[Papa Chongo]

here is my take,

They get paid well, they have better benefits than most. They should be grateful for what they have, I know it is a grueling job, but I know many that work in more grueling, and more dangerous jobs and get less.

The time for big unions is over, they were needed years ago, but now they are no longer needed.

 

[westwoody]

Little known fact: FedEx, UPS, DHL all subcontract to the post office.
FedEx is not going to send a parcel to Island Lake or Cranberry Portage, it is cost prohibitive.
Canada Post is obligated by law to deliver to those place at great expense.
All those great private courier companies are subsidized by getting Canada Post to do their shitty jobs for them.

I work at an airport, I load cans, I see what goes where and who is taking it.

 

[Lets Review]

If Canada Post is so unnecessary and pointless, why are people worried about a strike?
It's a private company run by political appointees as a slush fund for whatever government is in charge at the moment. It makes millions every year, which goes into general revenues and is pissed away. Re-invest in the company? Let's just blame the greedy employees and cry poverty. When they do invest, they buy outdated mechanical equipment and technology that was discarded by the USPS, for millions of dollars (just before profit and loss statements) that sits idle.
Instead of admitting that parcels and flyers are the main, very profitable, portion of the business, they cling to the old chestnut "lettermail is dying" and we're going out of business.
BULLSHIT! The increased revenue from parcels is making up for any loss in lettermail revenues, and more. The fact that flyers are a huge profit maker is downplayed if not hidden.

My bias is pretty obvious, but after 29 years of working for CPC (until my legs gave out, now disabled) their methods haven't changed. Lie about profitability, deny injury rates, blame the worker. It's the most top-heavy corporation in Canada, with deadhead managers focused on protecting their jobs and hiding from responsibility. As I've been saying for years, it's a consistent money-maker that really doesn't need to grind up employees. Yes, I've seen my share of idiot employees, especially in recent years since CPC stopped checking references or requiring background checks. The "can't be fired" narrative is a joke, CUPW is one of the weakest Unions in Canada. This job action will probably be pointless as well, another legislated end. I think that's 5 contracts in a row that will have been imposed by various ministers over the years. Why negotiate, or make realistic offers?

You may notice that when the media favorite small business owners are complaining about a possible strike, they say it's "too expensive" to use other methods. Think about that for a second. Why can CPC deliver this service so much cheaper than anyone else? It's not the infrastructure advantage, because CPC sold off most of their physical assets and leases them back. Canada Post used to own a prime piece of real estate in almost every town in Canada. Where did that money go? It's not Final Mile, because Fedex and UPS could easily lobby that out of existence. Must be the heroic managers taking pay cuts and doing all the work.
Again, let's remember that it's a private corporation. Not a Crown corporation, not a Department nor Ministry of the government, so tax dollars don't go in, but millions of dollars come out, every year. No accountability either. Who is the CEO of the corporation? How many bonuses has management received lately for putting this company in it's supposed distress?

My 2 cents, I welcome respectful debate on the subject at hand, but "Unions ruined this Country" type stuff will be ignored.

 

[80watts]

Sorting mail into slots --- really sucks, and you have to match quota's of mail sorted, have to be fast.... Do that for 40 hours a week.... repetitive motion.....

They get paid well, they have better benefits than most. They should be grateful for what they have, I know it is a grueling job, but I know many that work in more grueling, and more dangerous jobs and get less.

The time for big unions is over, they were needed years ago, but now they are no longer needed.

Big Union are still needed. I always though the labour laws passed in Canada were enough, but alot of small businesses ignore them, and abuse their workers for time, breaks and overtime and benefits. when I went to highschool over 30 years ago, they did't teach you the labour laws and still don't, people learn of it through word of mouth or if its online.

Unions fought for better working conditions, better pay, 40 hour work week, benefits that could include dental, medical, sick leave, paid leave for holidays, overtime, time off for overtime, severance pay, accumulated sick leave, seniority. In the last 10/15 years or so... the governments has been slowly eliminating benefits government workers had, like accumulated sick leave, severance pay; trying to follow industry to increase their profitability or bottom line. Unions also have their bad sides- corruption/greed etc.

A lot of people site that lazy senior union worker that make all union workers look bad. What employers want to see is that bright, young, energetic youthful person going 110% all the time... Spell the word burnout...

I always like those guys that gave 150% of their effort when the boss was around (when the boss was around) and tapered off to nothing when he wasn't there.... 2 of them in the workplace, well I don't want to work there then....

Reminds me an story I heard one time:

The workplace had 1 supervisor, and 3 workers. The supervisor had to go on course for 3 weeks, so he decided to be fair and give the 3 workers a chance to fill in for him. His most accomplished worker(worker 1) got 85% of jobs done. The second worker (worker 2) accomplished 75% of jobs done. The 3 worker(worker 3) only got 40% done.
So the 1 week, when worker 1 supervised he achieved only (75 + 40)/2 = 57% work completed.
The next week, worker 2 supervised and achieved (85+40)/2 = 61% work completed
The 3rd week worker 3 supervised and achieved (85 +75)/2 = 80% work completed
So who was the better supervisor? Who were the better workers....
You see that worker 3 increased productivity by 20%--- management material... right?

Lets go back to the early 1900's when companies hired strikebreakers (violent thugs) to break up strikes... cause management wasn't getting rich enough off the backs of the workers....

Lets use words like scabs....

So Merry Christmas to all those who won't get their parcels on time for Christmas. Its the thought not the present that counts....the backing up of the mail won't kill us, and if your business depends on the xmas rush, maybe you should consider another business or business option....

 

[clu]

I feel like it's hard to be an armchair quarterback on this one. We probably don't know the working conditions, prevalence of injury, etc. Independent impartial (if there is such a thing) arbitration seems like the way to go, to me.

I don't begrudge them putting the squeeze on during the holiday season. (a) that's when the problems they're complaining about are at their worst and (b) they have to leverage what they can. They aren't in it to be Santa Claus, not for us the customers. They're in it to provide for themselves and their families.

A business owner, be it the government or otherwise, typically isn't going to voluntarily improve working conditions. And "lucky to have a job at all" is the usual justification for that apathy. Employees have to make noise so their "rewards" keep pace with the rewards their employees reap.

At least with independent arbitration you'd be likely to get a more objective answer on which party in the negotiation is being the most greedy.

 

[deathreborn]

new hires don't get paid that well anymore. under $20 an hour now when they used to start at $24 for letter carriers. union sold out the new hires 6-7 years ago and the whole wage structure changed. i worked for them briefly while this was all happening. got in the last group hired under the old rules. even at $25 an hour not worth it, so left after 4 months. worst atmosphere i have ever encountered in a workplace.

 

[nickcan]

new hires don't get paid that well anymore. under $20 an hour now when they used to start at $24 for letter carriers. union sold out the new hires 6-7 years ago and the whole wage structure changed. i worked for them briefly while this was all happening. got in the last group hired under the old rules. even at $25 an hour not worth it, so left after 4 months. worst atmosphere i have ever encountered in a workplace.

Yup, new letter carriers get what the salary was 20 years ago.

 

[rlock]

Not sure I agree with them on every issue, but the rural and urban posties should have pay parity, and also the workplace injury issue needs to be dealt with. I can see where understaffing is causing sickness and injury - it's not only posties who have this problem. I've never been a postie but experienced it in other jobs, and let me tell you, overstretching your workforce (especially with physical and outdoor work) leads to worn out employees and staff attrition.

 

[johnnydepth]

Not going to get into my thoughts on unions for government jobs, just not going there.
I understand the importance of the parcel service sector of Canada Post... and USPS, UPS, FedEx, DHL, etc...
It is the mail delivery portion that I think is ridiculous.
Someone help me out with the things that absolutely need to be delivered to homes on a regular basis.
I would say pension cheques, social assistance, etc.. but even those could be d.d. to the bank.
I know! Traffic camera tickets!
Seriously I have nothing. I can't think of anything that needs to be sent by postal mail anymore.

 

[clu]

Not going to get into my thoughts on unions for government jobs, just not going there.
I understand the importance of the parcel service sector of Canada Post... and USPS, UPS, FedEx, DHL, etc...
It is the mail delivery portion that I think is ridiculous.
Someone help me out with the things that absolutely need to be delivered to homes on a regular basis.
I would say pension cheques, social assistance, etc.. but even those could be d.d. to the bank.
I know! Traffic camera tickets!
Seriously I have nothing. I can't think of anything that needs to be sent by postal mail anymore.

Referendum ballots?

Seriously, as virtually every article notes, the core service has moved from letters toward parcels. Amazon and the like. Bulk mail like flyers also generates revenue for them.

 

[westwoody]

Who is the CEO of the corporation?

Stephen Harper's greasiest backroom deal.

Appoints Deepak Chopra to be CEO. Chopra was head of Pitney Bowes Canada and Latin America operations.
Chopra convinces EBay to use Pitney Bowes for customs brokerage, the "Global Shipping Program".
This was a huge money maker. Pitney Bowes overcharges for duty, and charges many times more the Canada Post for brokerage.
Pitney Bowes makes millions of dollars PER DAY off this scam.

Hard to believe Chopra got nothing from his former employer in exchange. Or Harper.

Harper also renewed Chopra's five year contract a few days before the last election. Why? Why was it so important to remew that contract?

 

[80watts]

The problem is the bean counters got involved and said 8 hours work is for 1 man. So they employ 1 person. What happens when that person is sick or goes on holiday, his job does not get done, while the employee is gone. The job stand empty/alone/work not done. 1 man 1 job......


In reality they need 1.2 person per 8 hours. Reason being to cover for the one man job, and lighten the workload when the one man is there....this has a positive effect on the workplace... not overworked, so the chances of getting sick are lower...

The bean counters win. Save money, but the job backs up. The .2 man can cover up to 5 people for holidays and sick days.

 

[Abbott_]

^
To be The Queen's schlepper, no-way !

 

[abkb12]

Before commenting people should talk to a postal worker.
One issue is that Canada Post wants to put a 2 tier wage system in.
What ever happened to equal pay for equal work.
Also rural delivery times are not correct. rural drivers are given a certain time to do deliveries.
Most rural delivery take longer than the time given to do them.
The rural drivers complete there route and do not get paid for the extra time it takes to do it.
Also on any route whre the postal worker has to stop and get a signature that also increase the time to do the delivery.

Question: If you are at work and your employer comes to you and tells you have to say over without pay would you.

 

[sevenofnine]

I dunno how they expect people to live,
talked to some people no pension no benefits

yeah I agree benefits get abused like sick time,
but that has as much to do with the medical profession as anything,

you bring in a doctors note and they can't fire you, sick time how much and rate of pay,
is negotiated in the contracts,
its managements fault as well,

I told a bunch of our shop managers, the problem with them,
is they have no fucking balls. guys should be fired, there an embarrassment to the company,
but because were unionized its not easy, things have to be documented and put in your file.
and the fucking supervisors are too fucking lazy to do there job.
don't blame the fucking unions.

its the same as a good defense lawyer, defending a guilty guy, the prosecution still has to do his job, and if there fucking lazy or stupid,

unions have a place, big unions have a place, the cost of housing food gas, everything, and everyone should work around minimum wage, with no benefits
we might as well all go on assisted living, or try and claim refugee status

do you guys bitch about a hockey player making millions a year,
but some guy might make 40 an hour with benefits and he doesn't deserve it.
who is making all the fucking money out of our energy costs,

you know its fucking stupid,
yeah a union guy might be over paid a little.
but look at what we pay for cell phones t.v internet, etc etc, somebody is making some fucking money, millions and millions but you go after some guy, because he has a little cash in his pocket,

while some guys have fucking millions,

the last time I was in court,
I had to stop myself from laughing

there was a guy in there cops lawyers the whole entire shit load of them,
and what do you think he did, stole a chocolate bar, a fucking chocolate bar,

I was in downtown and I looked up at all those ivory towers full of oil execs ceo;s etc
how much fucking money do you think there is up in those towers in unpaid taxes, etc etc etc, etc,
come on,