Libya

[Jethro Bodine]

It looks like the tables are slowly but surely turning in Gadhafi's favor.
I'm sure he's one person happy about the earthquake in Japan which is likely deflecting a lot the world's attention away from Libya and the atrocities he's likely committing.
http://news.ca.msn.com/top-stories/cbc-article.aspx?cp-documentid=28006870

 

[uncleg]

Without outside interference the odds were always in his favor. While the earthquake is deflecting news coverage, it's not affecting the action or lack thereof being taken against him. Libya is one of those situations where you hope something big happens somewhere else to deflect attention, because it's a no win situation for the West.

 

[Jethro Bodine]

I'm no expert on Middle East affairs so my view is probably oversimplistic but you are right when you say it is a no win situation for the West.
I wish the moderate arab nations would start taking more of a lead role in these situations. Surely with all of their wealth Saudi Arabia for example could amass and equip a very impressive army that could be called upon in these situations rather than the world constantly looking to the Western nations.
Athought that doesn't take in all of the other variable which over complicate these matters such as ancient tribal biases, oil, strategic location, fear of the alterantive to Gadhafi (Al Quada), etc.

 

[uncleg]

I'm no expert on Middle East affairs so my view is probably oversimplistic but you are right when you say it is a no win situation for the West.
I wish the moderate arab nations would start taking more of a lead role in these situations. Surely with all of their wealth Saudi Arabia for example could amass and equip a very impressive army that could be called upon in these situations rather than the world constantly looking to the Western nations.
Athought that doesn't take in all of the other variable which over complicate these matters such as ancient tribal biases, oil, strategic location, fear of the alterantive to Gadhafi (Al Quada), etc.

Good idea, I'm sure the West would love to see that happen, but first you have to find a moderate Arab nation.

Saudi Arabia is not a moderate nation. They are as quick to put down the opposition as any of them, it's just that they are a lot more quiet about it. Their military is the best equipped in the Middle East after the Israelis and it's a decent size. They also have a National Guard that answers to the King and when they step into a situation everybody else backs off, police, regular army, etc. That force is nearly the size of the regular army and just as well, if not better equipped.

Another "moderate" nation is Bahrain, home of the U.S. 5th fleet, see what they did today ? Saudi and Emirate "police" have moved into the country and local forces went in and cleaned house in Pearl Square. You think the U.S. or any other government with make the same noises about those operations as they have done about Libya ? I don't think so.

 

[Aleister Crowley]

Good idea, I'm sure the West would love to see that happen, but first you have to find a moderate Arab nation.

Saudi Arabia is not a moderate nation. They are a quick to put down the opposition as any of them, it's just that they are a lot more quiet about it. Their military is the best equipped in the Middle East after the Israelis and it's a decent size. They also have a National Guard that answers to the King and when they step into a situation everybody else backs off, police, regular army, etc. That force is nearly the size of the regular army and just as well, if not better equipped.

Another "moderate" nation is Bahrain, home of the U.S. 5th fleet, see what they did today ? Saudi and Emirate "police" have moved into the country and local forces went in and cleaned house in Pearl Square. You think the U.S. or any other government with make the same noises about those operations as they have done about Libya ? I don't think so.

BINGO...... moderate arab nation.....hehehehe...a moderate moslem....lol.
Libya will have control or upper hand again before UN or Nato makes up their slow minds.
Gadafiy ducks clan will have arrested all the rebel leaders and have them executed (rats) asap.
He and his sons have zero choice , they have nowhere to run to. So stick and stay and play dirty for keeps.

 

[uncleg]

BINGO...... moderate arab nation.....hehehehe...a moderate moslem....lol.
Libya will have control or upper hand again before UN or Nato makes up their slow minds.
Gadafiy ducks clan will have arrested all the rebel leaders and have them executed (rats) asap.
He and his sons have zero choice , they have nowhere to run to. So stick and stay and play dirty for keeps.

Have to disagree with your lol, there are lots of moderate Muslims in the world, unfortunately they are not large and in charge anywhere in the Middle East.
Remember that Arab and Muslim are not synonymus, there is the small matter of places like Turkey, Indonesia, and the various 'stans' found in the former Soviet Union.

 

[Big Dog Striker]

The UN sponsored No-Fly Zone over Libya a few days ago saved the Libyan Rebels from Gadhafi's advancing troops and mercenaries. Who pays the $ 300 Million weekly bill to make sure the No Fly Zone is fully implemented on the skies of oil rich Libya? Or is it IOU that leads to future Libyan oil supply.

Fly Now, Pay Later.

 

[uncleg]

The UN sponsored No-Fly Zone over Libya a few days ago saved the Libyan Rebels from Gadhafi's advancing troops and mercenaries. Who pays the $ 300 Million weekly bill to make sure the No Fly Zone is fully implemented on the skies of oil rich Libya? Or is it IOU that leads to future Libyan oil supply.

Fly Now, Pay Later.

You and I are paying that bill, at least the Canadian portion of it. IOU, not in this type of situation, this is "protection of civilians" an obligation of the U.N. unlike Iraq where it was regime change, which was going to pay for itself from oil revenues once Saddam was out. Saw how that worked out.

 

[uncleg]

[QUOTE=Ovaltine;1134889]I think most of you Westerners really think your US/Canadian government are all self-righteous about protecting other countries' citizens, so blinded by the Western media and News Corp. Libya is basically China's turf, this war is actually a power struggle between China, Russia and India against the West. China invested alot of money to set up infrastructure in all of Africa. Have y'all watched the Wire? China just want to buy up some properties, make the money, no gangster shit, no street rep. Here is when the West sees the weakness of Gadaffi's government and strike. for what? to let the rebels control the oil fields so Chevron and esso can have access to it after they bomb Gadaffi's ass. I just don't see how the West can tame the unrests in North Africa, part of it is due to rising food prices, these governement have been scheming their citizens way too long.[/QUOTE]



Say what ? Maybe read what was said again and if you have a problem understanding it, I'll be happy to explain, what with you not being a Westerner and all.

You'll note the quotation marks, usually indicates a person is being sarcastic, though it may mean something else wherever you come from.

 

[badbadboy]

I would never mention Saudi nor moderate in the same sentence. They are one of the least tolerant Persian Gulf nations with probably the most to lose if the fundamentalists ever got control. Some of my oil patch and technology counterparts have taken contracts there and it was only for the money and a fixed time period.

What we are seeing these days is countries with 30 or 40 year dictatorship regimes that have not kept up with the times. They can not deal with the social networking via computer or cell phones and it has allowed the masses to get organized.

Gaddafi will likely stay to the bitter end and go out as a martyr. Funny how times have changed. I had counterparts from the UK who worked there way back when and they raved about how liberal and fun Libya was at the time

 

[uncleg]

Looks like Canada is having "Sucker's Remorse" on the whole NATO effort to help the "Civilians" in Libya. Peter MacKay said that Canada will not be sending any additional forces and will not permit the Canadian forces there to step beyond the original UN mandate. http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/World/20110515/mackay-libya-airstrikes-110515/

It would have been better never have sent anything to support the Italian/USA Oil Grab, but it's nice to see a little sanity set in.

About that ???? Originally the Italians weren't even getting involved. They finally allowed the use of air bases but have not committed any fighters to the no fly zone. The US really wasn't all that interested until the Colonel started to threaten a blood bath. This was a rush job by the French, it's Sarkozy's war and I think he may just end up regretting it.