It's my human right not to wear a bra, says B.C. woman fired for doing just that

[Big_Guy_Rye]

"Who outlined what exactly is considered professional [and] why breasts sitting maybe a half an inch lower on my chest is unprofessional?"

LOL

If this is a serious question, I'll give a serious answer.

"SHE DID!"

Men are men, as women are women.....if I notice a woman's nipple poking out her shirt, I'm going to look! (Of course not stare rudely, but glimpse at it for a long while, giggle to myself, and think what a 'free spirited', 'open minded' freak she is between the sheets, as the man's mind goes....)

...but women are women, and in this modern age of 4th wave feminism, and empowerment, and of course mandatory beliefs of "her stories"; you stare at that nipple long enough, there will be sexual harassment lawsuits coming every which way.

Case in Point, it's a known policy of NBC's HR department that you cannot look at a female employee for longer than a few minutes, and must not make direct eye contact for too long either. Companies have been on high-alert with this wave of 'empowerment' and #MeToo twitter movements, they are setting stricter policies and dress codes to make sure incidences of sexual harassment is kept to a minimum. And if wearing a bra, reduced the chance of a man like me checking out the shape of a nipple in the workplace; then for the sake of millions of dollars in lawsuits. Wear a damn bra, and tell the female community to stop being hypocrites.

 

[ddcanz]

Her boss' commentary about "protection" is just plain wrong. But I believe he just spoke out of turn with an inappropriate reference that only opens the door to public debate around cause and fault.
However, the dress code aspect of wearing a bra I fully support (no pun intended, T8E )
I like a nice set of tits as much as the next guy- maybe even more-so.
However, at a decent restaurant when out with my wife is not the time or place for a pair of orbs and their hard nips saying "hello" whenever Sally comes by the table and leans over. It's distracting. It's also disrespectful. And an employer should be able to set a code according to their own standards.
Let 'em hang on your own time- keep 'em covered on mine.

 

[mylander]

Her boss' commentary about "protection" is just plain wrong. But I believe he just spoke out of turn with an inappropriate reference that only opens the door to public debate around cause and fault.
However, the dress code aspect of wearing a bra I fully support (no pun intended, T8E )
I like a nice set of tits as much as the next guy- maybe even more-so.
However, at a decent restaurant when out with my wife is not the time or place for a pair of orbs and their hard nips saying "hello" whenever Sally comes by the table and leans over. It's distracting. It's also disrespectful. And an employer should be able to set a code according to their own standards.
Let 'em hang on your own time- keep 'em covered on mine.

Sorry, have to disagree with you on this. Firstly, it's a golf club, not a decent restaurant. And the fact that she has, or hasn't, a bra on does not guarantee that you won't see nipples. Wearing a sheer bra does nothing to hide nipples. At my local pub, if the barmaid goes into the cooler to change a keg, or move stock to the front of the shelves, when she comes out her nips are sticking out proudly. Are we now going to legislate what type of bra that she wears?

Don't be an ass, and don't make a fuss about it.

 

[Smoothmover]

Should a male server be allowed to wear this? Or can his employer suggest he be more modest as part of the dress code?

 

[clu]

Should a male server be allowed to wear this? Or can his employer suggest he be more modest as part of the dress code?

Straw man argument. Dress codes are permitted. The point of contention is whether they are allowed to not be gender neutral.

They could just create a uniform that conceals nipples on men and women and there wouldn't be an issue.

 

[NEbaD]

Straw man argument. Dress codes are permitted. The point of contention is whether they are allowed to not be gender neutral.

They could just create a uniform that conceals nipples on men and women and there wouldn't be an issue.

It's not a gender neutral issue though; women have mammories, men do not. A bra is a support garment for mammories, not for covering nipples

 

[clu]

It's not a gender neutral issue though; women have mammories, men do not. A bra is a support garment for mammories, not for covering nipples

(a) men have mammories, they're just inactive due to hormones, (b) the owner's issue was not that she was sagging, it was that her nipples were visible, (c) some men have larger breasts than some women.

You can deflect all you want but the guy's actual argument/justification is invalid.

 

[NEbaD]

(a) men have mammories, they're just inactive due to hormones, (b) the owner's issue was not that she was sagging, it was that her nipples were visible, (c) some men have larger breasts than some women.

You can deflect all you want but the guy's actual argument/justification is invalid.

A) Okay then, so they have inactive mammories. Bras, then, are intended to support "active" mammories, if that pleases you. Semantics aside, breasts are breasts, women have them, that's what bras are for. Point stands, it's a gendered issue, and discrimination doesn't have anything to do with it. I mean, by your logic, a clitoris is an undeveloped penis, so women should then wear a jock?

B) Female breasts have been sexualized throughout most of the world for an awfully long time. Sagging, jiggling, nipples showing, whatever - don't bring it to work. Site decency, or protection, or professionalism, or whatever. Use some sense.

C) So what? Refer to above; women's breasts have been sexualized, men's chests are roughly the equivalent of nice legs on a woman.

Deflecting? Who's deflecting? This is pretty straight talk, bucko. You seem to have a functioning brain, just no sense; good hardware, bad software; intelligence, lacking wisdom. Hopefully you're just young, which is what it seems like.

Bra, breast, nipple issues, those are typically gendered things, pertaining to women. Equality doesn't come into it. Whatever says the rule of law, we must obey, however many stupid, stupid things come to pass under the law. That hag in Maple Ridge already won the right to go topless years ago in the Supreme Court under the same ridiculous premise of equality you espouse. Parade a highschool full of girls topless down the street in the name of equality, though, and see how that goes over. Common sense, should you choose to exercise any, should tell you right from wrong.

 

[nightswhisper]

(a) men have mammories, they're just inactive due to hormones, (b) the owner's issue was not that she was sagging, it was that her nipples were visible, (c) some men have larger breasts than some women.

You can deflect all you want but the guy's actual argument/justification is invalid.

This is an instance where he should have done what he wanted to do, without saying what he said.

 

[clu]

A) Okay then, so they have inactive mammories. Bras, then, are intended to support "active" mammories, if that pleases you. Semantics aside, breasts are breasts, women have them, that's what bras are for. Point stands, it's a gendered issue, and discrimination doesn't have anything to do with it. I mean, by your logic, a clitoris is an undeveloped penis, so women should then wear a jock?

B) Female breasts have been sexualized throughout most of the world for an awfully long time. Sagging, jiggling, nipples showing, whatever - don't bring it to work. Site decency, or protection, or professionalism, or whatever. Use some sense.

C) So what? Refer to above; women's breasts have been sexualized, men's chests are roughly the equivalent of nice legs on a woman.

Deflecting? Who's deflecting? This is pretty straight talk, bucko. You seem to have a functioning brain, just no sense; good hardware, bad software; intelligence, lacking wisdom. Hopefully you're just young, which is what it seems like.

Bra, breast, nipple issues, those are typically gendered things, pertaining to women. Equality doesn't come into it. Whatever says the rule of law, we must obey, however many stupid, stupid things come to pass under the law. That hag in Maple Ridge already won the right to go topless years ago in the Supreme Court under the same ridiculous premise of equality you espouse. Parade a highschool full of girls topless down the street in the name of equality, though, and see how that goes over. Common sense, should you choose to exercise any, should tell you right from wrong.

There is no need to get personal in your attacks.

First, common sense as you put it is actually a cultural bias. If it were a Muslim owner who insisted she wear a burqa you'd be ok with that because the nape of the neck or the ankle or the hair is potentially sexualised and must be hidden from the male gaze? These are the cultural biases that the commission has a mandate to override. It's part of the reason it exists.

So, my "software" as you put it is trying to analyse the situation according to the rules the commission would apply, not society, because that's the question at hand: is he ALLOWED to fire her on these grounds? I'm speaking of the question of law, law you evidently don't agree with (Maple Ridge comment). I'm not asserting anything about how it "should" be.

Regardless, let me spell out the deflection I'm suggesting you're doing since you aren't understanding it: regardless of the reasons YOU are coming up to justify it, it was not the reason HE used to justify it. That's what the commission has to evaluate, not the 100 other angles he didn't say.

nightswhisper has it right: he might've got away with it if he'd been smarter in what he said.

 

[sevenofnine]

don't bring it to work

a women is supposed to leave her tits at home,

 

[Daniella]

Imagine insulting someone's intelligence while also saying men don't have mammories, being corrected, and following up with something that is still wrong. Men can have hormonal embalances that cause their mammories to be activated. This is why trans women over time can grow breasts. So should cis men with Gynecomastia have to wear bras?

YOU sexualizing ME is NOT my problem. Men who sexually harrass women do NOT do it for any other reason but to assert gender dominance. The difference in, in cases like this men know they can get away with it more cuz clearly we were asking for it.

There are many tribal cultures where women are topless and not assaulted for it, but I bet you think you are more civilized than those tribes.

And shout out to the man on the first page who said that no is no even when you're paying for it, I'm sure some of you needed that reminder.