HST - how are you planning to vote?

[huggzy]

And the next election is when again?

If they lose this referendum this will stick with them all the way to the next election.

This is exactly why we have referendums...so that politicians can't just impose very unpopular policies and then hope four years down the road the electorate forgets. If the HST is defeated, the blame for all these wasted tax dollars are solely on the Liberal government, and NOT the people who voted against the HST in this referendum.

The Liberals never had a mandate to impose this. They ignored their electorate and now they will be punished for it.

 

[wilde]

If they lose this referendum this will stick with them all the way to the next election.

If you followed my discussion with CP then you should know we are talking about the federal election not provincial.:doh:

 

[huggzy]

If you followed my discussion with CP then you should know we are talking about the federal election not provincial.

Fair enough, although the comment can apply to either election.

I despise the way these governments have handled this. The worst part from my own personal perspective is that I've always supported the provincial liberals (can't imagine ever voting NDP...until now), and lately the federal PC's.

 

[wilde]

This is exactly why we have referendums...so that politicians can't just impose very unpopular policies and then hope four years down the road the electorate forgets. If the HST is defeated, the blame for all these wasted tax dollars are solely on the Liberal government, and NOT the people who voted against the HST in this referendum.

But it's coming out of our pockets...

Look, I hear you man. Your stance is my initial reaction to how the Liberals force the HST down our throats. But after reviewing all the pros and cons, I am now convinced that we should stick with it. As for the Liberals, they will get what they deserve.

 

[huggzy]

But it's coming out of our pockets...

Look, I hear you man. Your stance is my initial reaction to how the Liberals force the HST down our throats. But after reviewing all the pros and cons, I am now convinced that we should stick with it. As for the Liberals, they will get what they deserve.

First of all I do believe that there is a shifting of the tax burden from business owners to the consumer - and I do not think that this is fair or appropriate. In the end this HST will cost me more money. I track every penny I spend and I've noticed my personal costs of gone up appreciably since the HST (and no...its not only increases in gas costs) However...that aside...

I also believe that there is a huge, intangible value in communicating to our leaders that they will get a whipping if they pull this shit on us going forward. I am getting fucking tired of continually having my pockets picked and these elitest assholes think they can do this and assume we will forget this 3 or 4 years down the road come next election.

 

[wilde]

First of all I do believe that there is a shifting of the tax burden from business owners to the consumer - and I do not think that this is fair or appropriate. In the end this HST will cost me more money. I track every penny I spend and I've noticed my personal costs of gone up appreciably since the HST (and no...its not only increases in gas costs) However...that aside...

I see it as a shift form taxing manufacturing to services, as well as placing more emphasis on comsumption rather than income tax. The tax base for manufacturing is dying fast, if we don't start taxing services, pretty soon there'll be nothing to tax. At the end of the day, nobody likes to pay tax but the HST is fairer than the PST with it's ridiculos rules and exemptions. In the short term, we all pay more. But if we look a little further ahead, we just might come out ahead.

 

[luvsdaty]

The thing that pisses me off about gov't, both prov & federal is the amount of bull shitting to get re elected. If i remember correctly the gst was a tax that was suppose to be used to pay down the deficite? Our own money that we pay into the ei fund is constantly being filtered into general revenue.These guys are like a bunch of retards with a cheque book(well i still have cheques, so i still must have money?) I could go on & on & on & on about the missuse of our money, Pamela Martin, David Hahn, getting 2 pensions? The icbc monopoly, it just makes me wanna puke, but every ones attitude seems to be oh well, its already in my ass, might as well just take a deep breath & try to relax.

 

[aznboi9]

The thing that pisses me off about gov't, both prov & federal is the amount of bull shitting to get re elected. If i remember correctly the gst was a tax that was suppose to be used to pay down the deficite? Our own money that we pay into the ei fund is constantly being filtered into general revenue.These guys are like a bunch of retards with a cheque book(well i still have cheques, so i still must have money?) I could go on & on & on & on about the missuse of our money, Pamela Martin, David Hahn, getting 2 pensions? The icbc monopoly, it just makes me wanna puke, but every ones attitude seems to be oh well, its already in my ass, might as well just take a deep breath & try to relax.

If you don't like what they're doing, then don't vote for them in the next election, when sending a message will punish them (costing them THEIR jobs) with out punishing us (costing us OUR jobs). That's the whole point of an election: it's a referendum on the government of the day. This referendum is on something entirely different. So voting down something that's better for the province, and us by extension, to send a message makes absolutely no sense when we already have an avenue specifically for that purpose. I couldn't care less what happens to the provincial liberals; but I don't want my province going down with them, especially when it isn't necessary to achieve the former.

 

[luvsdaty]

I don't know how 'good' this hst thing is, its definately costing me more money. Last time i checked, politicians weren't in office to help 'us' out.As far as business passing on the savings onto us.....YEAH RIGGGHHHHT. I was talking to a guy that owns a Smitty's restaurant & he said he was losing money ever since it was introduced.
That & the fact the liberals lied to us about introducing it before the election, i've voted in every election'federal,provincial, municipal' ever since i turned 18 & i'll def be voting YES as soon as my package arrives in the mail.

 

[aznboi9]

I don't know how 'good' this hst thing is, its definately costing me more money.

Then you'll be paying less under HST vs GST/PST when the rate goes down to 11% and 10%, for many years compared to two.

Last time i checked, politicians weren't in office to help 'us' out.As far as business passing on the savings onto us.....YEAH RIGGGHHHHT.

Apparently, they do.

[URL="http://www.chilliwackchamber.com/hst_atlantic.pdf"]http://www.chilliwackchamber.com/hst_atlantic.pdf[/URL]

I was talking to a guy that owns a Smitty's restaurant & he said he was losing money ever since it was introduced.

One restaurant? We're talking about a net increase of 2 billion and 24,000 jobs to the economy with entire industries lobbying to not return to the GST/PST.

That & the fact the liberals lied to us about introducing it before the election, i've voted in every election'federal,provincial, municipal' ever since i turned 18 & i'll def be voting YES as soon as my package arrives in the mail.

If you wish to pay more taxes, then go right ahead.

 

[Pirate Code]

First of all I do believe that there is a shifting of the tax burden from business owners to the consumer - and I do not think that this is fair or appropriate. In the end this HST will cost me more money. I track every penny I spend and I've noticed my personal costs of gone up appreciably since the HST (and no...its not only increases in gas costs) However...that aside...

I also believe that there is a huge, intangible value in communicating to our leaders that they will get a whipping if they pull this shit on us going forward. I am getting fucking tired of continually having my pockets picked and these elitest assholes think they can do this and assume we will forget this 3 or 4 years down the road come next election.

Your initial response in this post, about how it costs you more money is a perfectly valid, intelligent comment and a reasonable reason for voting yes.

After the 'however'... you make yourself look like an idiot.


Yes, we are upset about how the tax was implemented. You have a huge round of agreement with every British Columbian. Are we all angry? HELL YA.
Are we going to pay more in taxes? For those that spend money on services and the good things in life. YES right now.. later not as much.

Does the government need to get more cash from us in other ways because the old ways are dying? YES.

If you don't like the HST, and you agree that you want to maintain the services and infrastructure we have in place (healthcare, education, etc), WHAT DO YOU SUGGEST THE GOVERNMENT DO TO GET ENOUGH REVENUE FROM US?

If you are saying no to the HST, you must know a better way. Please share!!

 

[Cock Throppled]

Then you'll be paying less under HST vs GST/PST when the rate goes down to 11% and 10%, for many years compared to two.


One restaurant? We're talking about a net increase of 2 billion and 24,000 jobs to the economy with entire industries lobbying to not return to the GST/PST.

If you wish to pay more taxes, then go right ahead.

I beg to differ - 11% or 10% of dozens more goods and almost every previously-exempt service results in us all paying much more in taxes.
The restaurant INDUSTRY has been hardhit by the HST, not just one restaurant.
The 2 billion (I assume you are talking money here) is the amount of money taken out of consumer pockets and put into corporation profits. So far no savings have been passed on to this consumer. Job creation from the HST hasn't happened either.
PS - there is no indication the government has let go even one tax collector, so re-instituting the GST/PST system would be relatively easy for the government.

 

[luvsdaty]

Yeah, nice to know its gonna only cost me $1000 in hst instead of $1200 for my funeral.

 

[bcneil]

I beg to differ - 11% or 10% of dozens more goods and almost every previously-exempt service results in us all paying much more in taxes.
The restaurant INDUSTRY has been hardhit by the HST, not just one restaurant.
The 2 billion (I assume you are talking money here) is the amount of money taken out of consumer pockets and put into corporation profits. So far no savings have been passed on to this consumer. Job creation from the HST hasn't happened either.
PS - there is no indication the government has let go even one tax collector, so re-instituting the GST/PST system would be relatively easy for the government.

You're correct. My Canucks tickets alone, with no playoff games. Cost an extra $840 because of gst.
Even if they reduce it to 10% thats still $600 more a year. Restaurants will always be a few hundred more a year
No way I make that back on other things that are 2% less.

Personally I dont like the way they do the 1% decreases either.
Can you imagine being a used car lot for the month or 2, before each decrease.
My buddy said when they did the GST reductions he sold 4 cars that whole month, before it went from 6-5.

 

[alby2]

Im voting No.

Im in manufacturing, so before HST I only received a PST exemption on the materials that go into the final product and all GST paid was refunded as an ITC against all GST collect from the sale of my products. Ever since HST I was able to claim back all taxes including expenses that I previously did not have PST exemptions like repairs and maintenance on equipment/fixed items, the PST on utilities, the PST on office supplies/equipment purchases and PST on Fuel for company vehicles. Because my bottom line is better I have been able to give our employees raises and pay for better benefits for them. Im no economic major but I prefer these incentives through Business owners over working class(improving economy through helping business) rather than an incentive through working class over businesses (improving economy through helping workers like minimum wages).

The plus side is that on an international scale the HST has made my product more competitive in the global market as outside countries do not need to pay for the HST and I have been able to claim for the HST paid in manufacturing where before HST I still had to pay PST on other items and such disciussed above.

The businesses that did not benefit by the HST appear to be the service industry to the end user. While my business can claim an ITC on work done on the company equipment or consulting, I personally would need to burden the increased taxes if it was work done for personal reasons. It would be wishful thinking to hope that those businesses that benefit would spread the wealth as I did to the employees so that it brings back equilibrium in spending in general.

 

[Cock Throppled]

Im voting No.

Im in manufacturing, so before HST I only received a PST exemption on the materials that go into the final product and all GST paid was refunded as an ITC against all GST collect from the sale of my products. Ever since HST I was able to claim back all taxes including expenses that I previously did not have PST exemptions like repairs and maintenance on equipment/fixed items, the PST on utilities, the PST on office supplies/equipment purchases and PST on Fuel for company vehicles. Because my bottom line is better I have been able to give our employees raises and pay for better benefits for them.
It would be wishful thinking to hope that those businesses that benefit would spread the wealth as I did to the employees so that it brings back equilibrium in spending in general.

Gotta ask - if you have benefited so much, why reward your employees, who have done nothing more because of the HST over your customers, who are paying more for your products as a direct imposition of the HST? Seems the rewards are going to the wrong people.
That's not helping consumers accept the tax.

 

[aznboi9]

I beg to differ - 11% or 10% of dozens more goods and almost every previously-exempt service results in us all paying much more in taxes.

No, Based on the numbers I hear, we pay an average of 10.6-10.96% of GST/PST; with the income tax cuts already in place, once the HST is dropped to 11%, we pay less taxes in total.

The restaurant INDUSTRY has been hardhit by the HST, not just one restaurant.

Yes, there will always be winners and losers. Off the top of my head, the film, mining, and forest industries are among those who are lobbying hard to keep the HST.

The 2 billion (I assume you are talking money here) is the amount of money taken out of consumer pockets and put into corporation profits. So far no savings have been passed on to this consumer.

No, that's the projected growth in the economy, not the tax shift.

Job creation from the HST hasn't happened either.

Anecdotely, it apparently already has. Every reputable, independent source that I've come across confirms that there will be a net benefit of job growth over staying with the GST/PST.

PS - there is no indication the government has let go even one tax collector, so re-instituting the GST/PST system would be relatively easy for the government.

This isn't really relevent; but it will be a huge problem for all the businesses in BC.

 

[luvsdaty]

I don't know, but in the fishing industry, you get lots of write offs at tax time anyway. I wouldn't pay the pst at point of purchase & at the end of the year i could apply to get the gst back.

 

[Cock Throppled]

I just had an interesting conversation with a guy who is a contractor in Langley.

He said the HST just about put him out of business. Everyone was offering cash-only deals to home owners and he had to do the same.

Of course, cash-only deals have always been around, but he said the underground economy just took off when the HST was introduced. He said many are pocketing the HST credits and doing cash deals - everyone wins.

They risk an audit but the attitude seems to be "It's better to be caught because I'm still in business, than be driven out of business."

 

[tontos]

ANY TAX PURPOSED BY THE GOVERNMENT IS NOT OUT TO HELP YOU IN ANYWAY SHAPE OR FASHION! the sure fact they are giving you a choice of in the ass or in the mouth tells you how insane the tax regime in this country really is, and how much they spend and on what!How about quit spending so FUCKING much and tax us ALL less???????? That would be fair.. To all the NDPers if you like taxes so much YOU can pay more for the rest of us??!!!! OK?? More money left for me to spend on vagina!!!!