Facebook stock.

Jethro Bodine

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Feb 17, 2009
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Anybody own Facebook?
A buddy of mine who plays the market a lot more than I do and who seems to do okay at it was telling me the other day I should buy some.
The price right now is down and it is a good deal. He said when it first came out alot was bought up by short term investors thinking the value would go up immediately and they could make a quick buck. It didn't because their earnings were a bit off and Facebook had also announced they were reinvesting alot of money into the company so the forcasted earnings/profits for the next quarter or 2 would also be down. I guess short term investors don't like this type of long term planning regardless how economically solid it is because they don't plan on owning the stock for along time. Thus a lot of them dumped their stock and caused the priced to drop. The price now is more what it should have been during the initial offering and Facebook is still a good buy.
He told me the same thing happened to Amazon when they came on the market years ago. The stock dropped dramatically in value the first several months but then climbed and continues to from ~$2.00/share to over $245.00/share today.

I'd appeciate knowing what any of you KNOWLEDGABLE about the stock market think about this?

Cheers
 

Georgieboy69

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Oct 2, 2008
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Anybody own Facebook?
A buddy of mine who plays the market a lot more than I do and who seems to do okay at it was telling me the other day I should buy some.
The price right now is down and it is a good deal. He said when it first came out alot was bought up by short term investors thinking the value would go up immediately and they could make a quick buck. It didn't because their earnings were a bit off and Facebook had also announced they were reinvesting alot of money into the company so the forcasted earnings/profits for the next quarter or 2 would also be down. I guess short term investors don't like this type of long term planning regardless how economically solid it is because they don't plan on owning the stock for along time. Thus a lot of them dumped their stock and caused the priced to drop. The price now is more what it should have been during the initial offering and Facebook is still a good buy.
He told me the same thing happened to Amazon when they came on the market years ago. The stock dropped dramatically in value the first several months but then climbed and continues to from ~$2.00/share to over $245.00/share today.

I'd appeciate knowing what any of you KNOWLEDGABLE about the stock market think about this?

Cheers
I wouldn't say I'm knowledgable, however I agree with your friend, think long term buy now and you will do very well
 

Jethro Bodine

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As a trader, maybe yes. But comparing to Amazon.....Amazon has " real " products to sell that turn into revenue and pure profits.

Facebook........how do they make real money? :confused: Unless I am missing something about F/B.
I know what you mean. I remember reading an article a while back about all these internet companies' worth and how they are values at more than companies like Boeing which actually manufacture tangible items and have real assets you can put you hands on.
I guess that's why I'm skeptical but I'm also the first to admit I know little about this kind of thing and the real value of the internet heading into the future.
 

HeMadeMeDoIt

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As a trader, maybe yes. But comparing to Amazon.....Amazon has " real " products to sell that turn into revenue and pure profits.

Facebook........how do they make real money? :confused: Unless I am missing something about F/B.
FB makes money the same way Google does, by selling advertising. Google's 52 week range is 480-680. The IPO was at $80 and is now trading close to $680.
 

CorriGuy

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FB makes money the same way Google does, by selling advertising.
Not true. As in FB makes money same way Google does.

FB makes almost all its money using ONE of the ways Google does. Google makes money from licensing agreements for its store of patents, for selling its technology, for selling storage space, for selling search technology, etc etc etc etc... oh and for selling advertisements.

FB makes money from selling advertisements, and not much else.

I'd buy FB at $20 or below, and have. Right now it's at $19.34. I'd consider that a buy. But I do not see FB breaking $75, or even $50 anytime soon.
 

HeMadeMeDoIt

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Not true. As in FB makes money same way Google does.

FB makes almost all its money using ONE of the ways Google does. Google makes money from licensing agreements for its store of patents, for selling its technology, for selling storage space, for selling search technology, etc etc etc etc... oh and for selling advertisements.

FB makes money from selling advertisements, and not much else.

I'd buy FB at $20 or below, and have. Right now it's at $19.34. I'd consider that a buy. But I do not see FB breaking $75, or even $50 anytime soon.
Yes google has other sources of revenue BUT they account for less than 4% of its revenues.

In 2011 Google's total revenues were $37.9 billion dollars, $36.53 of that ie 96.375% came from advertising. That is their core and highest margin business.

http://investor.google.com/financial/tables.html
 

CorriGuy

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Yes google has other sources of revenue BUT they account for less than 4% of its revenues.

In 2011 Google's total revenues were $37.9 billion dollars, $36.53 of that ie 96.375% came from advertising. That is their core and highest margin business.

http://investor.google.com/financial/tables.html
Yes but :) Google wraps up many things into their blanket "advertising" revenue. For instance, Google runs ads on third party websites and manages ad networks on same, which accounts for over a quarter of their ad revenue alone. FB does not have access to this kind of income. Google's search and how it works in browsers like Chrome, Firefox, etc etc also create revenue streams for the company. Another huge portion of Google's ad take comes from scenarios like this:

Joe blow types in "Remy Lacroix best porn" on his iPhone. Google returns the search with suggestions including shopping sites. Dude hits shopping sites orders his porn, Google just made some micro $ from that guy's mobile search. FB does not generate revenue like this.

I guess what I am trying to say is that Google's revenue model is radically different from FB's, and while ad revenue is their top way of doing it, they have a billion more ways to drive that revenue, which FB can only dream about. So comparing both companies and how they make money (and therefore they should have similar valuations) isn't accurate. And unlike FB, Google has other core businesses that generate billions of dollars in revenue, and their growth rate is astounding.
 

HeMadeMeDoIt

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Yes but :) Google wraps up many things into their blanket "advertising" revenue. For instance, Google runs ads on third party websites and manages ad networks on same, which accounts for over a quarter of their ad revenue alone. FB does not have access to this kind of income. Google's search and how it works in browsers like Chrome, Firefox, etc etc also create revenue streams for the company. Another huge portion of Google's ad take comes from scenarios like this:

Joe blow types in "Remy Lacroix best porn" on his iPhone. Google returns the search with suggestions including shopping sites. Dude hits shopping sites orders his porn, Google just made some micro $ from that guy's mobile search. FB does not generate revenue like this.

I guess what I am trying to say is that Google's revenue model is radically different from FB's, and while ad revenue is their top way of doing it, they have a billion more ways to drive that revenue, which FB can only dream about. So comparing both companies and how they make money (and therefore they should have similar valuations) isn't accurate. And unlike FB, Google has other core businesses that generate billions of dollars in revenue, and their growth rate is astounding.
I'm aware of all this BUT the man asked a simple question on what they actually sell and it was answered in the simplest manner possible. Yes i know they have several platforms yada yada yada (I was in that business until a year ago)

I never suggested similar valuations or any similarity other than that both companies are in the business of selling advertising. One does it extremely well and is diversified beyond what the other one will ever be.
 

CorriGuy

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I'm aware of all this BUT the man asked a simple question on what they actually sell and it was answered in the simplest manner possible. Yes i know they have several platforms yada yada yada (I was in that business until a year ago)

I never suggested similar valuations or any similarity other than that both companies are in the business of selling advertising. One does it extremely well and is diversified beyond what the other one will ever be.
Fair enough :)

I really looked at FB as an offering investment but at the end of the day they looked like Web 2.0 all over again, and I just couldn't see them sustain a $30 offering or the projections of the overly optimistic at them being $50 or $60 out of the gate. End of the day they are just a social network with a shitton of users but very little ways to generate revenue outside of their website. Their purchase of Instagram was interesting, though their price scared me away - $1billion. I'm certainly not an investor expert, but I do a bit of research and to me, FB was screaming a $20, at best, value. In time this might change, but like Twitter, FB has very few legit ways to generate revenue, but unlike Twitter, it seems FB is already maximizing those streams. At $20 or less, seems like an okay purchase for me, and I did by some just to have it in my small portfolio; but the more I think about it, I think FB will just be around till the next big thing hits. Remember, everyone thought Friendster was going to be the biggest thing ever. Then Myspace. Now FB. Till the next thing comes along. But Google otoh broke the logjam on search by doing it a new and different way (clean interface) back in the early 2000s, and more important, they were smart enough to know to diversify and find constant new was to increase their revenue streams, which made them a true breakout, and turned them into a standard, much like Microsoft or Apple is a standard. Google made that transition from being a service to being a product - virtual or real - and it's safe to say they'll be around for a long, long time, like Microsoft has. Facebook? I really don't know = with all the animosity that company has against them, I have no doubt millions of users would jump ship in a moment if something better came along.
 

storm rider

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Dec 6, 2008
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Buy Facebook stock??? A great way to make a small fortune out of a large one.

At present their business model is based on advertising. The price paid by companies per eyeball for online ads has dropped continuously every year since online ads began. Facebook is so large now that it is nearing market saturation; it cannot add new members fast enough to offset the drop in ad revenue per eyeball so revenue from ads can go no place but down.

The next revenue stream is to increase the sale of all the data they have on their members, names, addresses, ages, friend connections, photos, videos, deleted posts, etc. I'm not sure how members will react as more and more of their personal information is sold to anyone that has a dollar and whether those members will continue to add to the data set & thus the value of the company (i.e. stop contributing & abandon Facebook like they did Friendster, Myspace, etc.).

Not a lot of upside to investing in a company that was past its best before date before its IPO.
+1 to this sentiment and I would like to add that if facebook starts charging money to it's members
then facebook will die faster than a mouse in a cat hoarders house.

To the OP if you want to put your hard earned money to work for you look at something like Parkland Fuel Corp.It is an income trust that pays a monthly dividend of 8.5 cents per share and if you roll the monthly dividends back into more shares you automatically get a 5% gain for re-investment and with no brokerage costs.Just my .02

SR
 

CorriGuy

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I'd take a pass on it.....which means it's a buy!!! :p
LOL! That's exactly my experience buying physical metals (gold and silver). Seems whenever I feel its in a buy time, and I do buy, it tanks. ;) Thankfully, I'm still ahead on those investments so far because the bulk of my metals buying was during and after the 2008 financial crisis.
 

Syncmaster

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Dec 19, 2004
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I shorted FB when it was $31. I won't be covering my short until it gets to $15 or so. Buying and FB don't mix well.
 

Avery

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Jul 7, 2003
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Jethro, maybe you should invest in Amazon.com instead, despite its high share price.

From Monday's New York Times:

Active in Cloud, Amazon Reshapes Computing

By QUENTIN HARDY

SEATTLE — Within a few years, Amazon.com’s creative destruction of both traditional book publishing and retailing may be footnotes to the company’s larger and more secretive goal: giving anyone on the planet access to an almost unimaginable amount of computing power.

Every day, a start-up called the Climate Corporation performs over 10,000 simulations of the next two years’ weather for more than one million locations in the United States. It then combines that with data on root structure and soil porosity to write crop insurance for thousands of farmers.

Another start-up, called Cue, scans up to 500 million e-mails, Facebook updates and corporate documents to create a service that can outline the biography of a given person you meet, warn you to be home to receive a package or text a lunch guest that you are running late.

Each of these start-ups carries out computing tasks that a decade ago would have been impossible without a major investment in computers. Both of these companies, however, own little besides a few desktop computers. They and thousands of other companies now rent data storage and computer server time from Amazon, through its Amazon Web Services division, for what they say is a fraction of the cost of owning and running their own computers.

“I have 10 engineers, but without A.W.S. I guarantee I’d need 60,” said Daniel Gross, Cue’s 20-year-old co-founder. “It just gets cheaper, and cheaper, and cheaper.” He figures Cue spends something under $100,000 a month with Amazon but would spend “probably $2 million to do it ourselves, without the speed and flexibility.” He conceded that “I don’t even know what the ballpark number for a server is — for me, it would be like knowing what the price of a sword is.”

Cloud computing has been around for years, but it is now powering all kinds of new businesses around the globe, quickly and with less capital.

Instagram, a 12-person photo-sharing company that was sold to Facebook for an estimated $1 billion just 19 months after it opened, skipped the expenses and bother of setting up its own computer servers. EdX, a global online education program from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and Harvard, had over 120,000 students taking a single class together on A.W.S. Over 185 United States government agencies run some part of their services on A.W.S. Millions of people in Africa shop for cars online, using cheap smartphones connected to A.W.S. servers located in California and Ireland.

“We are on a shift that is as momentous and as fundamental as the shift to the electrical grid,” said Andrew R. Jassy, the head of A.W.S. “It’s happening a lot faster than any of us thought.”
He started A.W.S. in 2006 with about three dozen employees. Amazon won’t say how many people now work at A.W.S., but the company’s Web site currently lists over 600 job openings.

Amazon’s efforts are just the start of a global competition among computing giants. In June, Google fully introduced a service similar to A.W.S. Microsoft is also in the business with its offering, Windows Azure.

If only for competitive reasons, Amazon does not say much about A.W.S. However, it is estimated to bring in about $1 billion to Amazon. Its three giant computer regional centers in the United States, in Virginia, Oregon and California, each consist of multiple buildings with thousands of servers.

There are others in Japan, Ireland, Singapore and Brazil. And the pace of its expansion has quickened. It opened four of those regions in 2011 and is believed to be building a similar number now. Jeff Bezos, the chief executive of Amazon, is interested in setting up cloud-computing installations for other governments.

According to an executive with knowledge of Amazon’s operation who was not authorized to speak publicly, just one of the 10 data centers in Amazon’s Eastern United States region has more servers dedicated to cloud computing than does Rackspace, a public cloud company serving 180,000 businesses with more than 80,000 servers.

Eventually, however, Mr. Jassy said, “we believe at the highest level that A.W.S. can be at least as big as our other businesses.” Amazon recorded nearly $50 billion in revenue last year. Mr. Jassy thinks A.W.S. is probably less than 10 percent of its eventual size.

The lower cost of computing, along with overnight deployment of machines, drives the business. Germany’s Spiegel TV paid A.W.S. to make digital copies of 20,000 programs. It cost less than Spiegel would have paid for the electricity powering its own servers.

GoodData, based in San Francisco, analyzes data from 6,000 companies on A.W.S. to find things like sales leads. “Before, each company needed at least five people to do this work,” said Roman Stanek, GoodData’s chief executive. “That is 30,000 people. I do it with 180. I don’t know what all those other people will do now, but this isn’t work they can do anymore. It’s a winner-takes-all consolidation.”

All that data running through Amazon’s cloud also has value. People leave bits of data about themselves that others then analyze. At any given time on A.W.S., there are about one million uses of a powerful database, called Elastic MapReduce, that is used to make predictions. Some suggest a new movie or video game to play, while others log behavior for advertising, credit history or suggestions about whom to date. (Companies have to permit their data to be analyzed, and Amazon says it applies the same security standards it uses on its retail site.)

The efficiency of this hyper-aware environment is already remaking jobs for many and will most likely dislocate more. “You can now test a product against millions of users for just a few thousand dollars, or start a company with just one or two people,” said Graham Spencer, a partner at Google Ventures, which invests in data-heavy start-ups that rely on such cheap computing. “It’s a huge change for Silicon Valley.”

That vision is in line with the way Mr. Bezos sees A.W.S., say executives who have worked with him. “Jeff thinks on a planetary level,” said David Risher, a former Amazon senior executive who now heads a charity called Worldreader, which uses A.W.S. to download books to thousands of computers in Africa. “A.W.S. is an opportunity, as a business. But it is also a philosophy of enabling other people to build big systems. That is how Amazon will make a dent in the universe.”
 

Jethro Bodine

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2009
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Beverly Hills. In the Kitchen eatin' vittles.
LOL! That's exactly my experience buying physical metals (gold and silver). Seems whenever I feel its in a buy time, and I do buy, it tanks. ;) Thankfully, I'm still ahead on those investments so far because the bulk of my metals buying was during and after the 2008 financial crisis.
LOL! Yes, usually if you want to know when a stock or commodity is going to have a downturn, just see when Jethro decides to buy and GET OUT FAST! LOL!
The only time I ever over ruled an investment adviser was over gold. Many years ago, lets say 8, I had a fairly large amount of gold in my portfolio. That was around the time when gold prices were tanking. I'm sure someone can clarify the exact date. Anyway after hanging onto my gold for a long time and losing money, my investment advisor, who is no longer my advisor, told me I should sell it. His rational was we had waited long enough for it to turn around, which it wasn't and he didn't think it would soon, so it was betterr to cut my losses and move the money into something else. I said no. Was I glad I did. Within a few months it had started to climb and continued to do so, making up my losses and much more. I soon after fired that guys ass.

Anyway thanks for the advice guys. I've always been nervous about these types of stocks. I haad a school buddy who maybe 10-12 years ago made a killing on "Tech" stocks. So much he actually retired and started to enjoy the good life. I heard a few yes later he was back working and lost almost everything when that balloon burst.

Cheers
 

TenderLover

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Jul 1, 2008
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Lets put it this way, it's still trades at 50X forward earnings where average company is less then 20times.
But I think they have some good points once they figure out how to make money because they didn't figure that out yet. I'd wait on this one there is easiest way to make money out there.

Anybody own Facebook?
A buddy of mine who plays the market a lot more than I do and who seems to do okay at it was telling me the other day I should buy some.
The price right now is down and it is a good deal. He said when it first came out alot was bought up by short term investors thinking the value would go up immediately and they could make a quick buck. It didn't because their earnings were a bit off and Facebook had also announced they were reinvesting alot of money into the company so the forcasted earnings/profits for the next quarter or 2 would also be down. I guess short term investors don't like this type of long term planning regardless how economically solid it is because they don't plan on owning the stock for along time. Thus a lot of them dumped their stock and caused the priced to drop. The price now is more what it should have been during the initial offering and Facebook is still a good buy.
He told me the same thing happened to Amazon when they came on the market years ago. The stock dropped dramatically in value the first several months but then climbed and continues to from ~$2.00/share to over $245.00/share today.

I'd appeciate knowing what any of you KNOWLEDGABLE about the stock market think about this?

Cheers
 
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