Draft

[LonelyGhost]

Since Westwoody had a meltdown about this topic
i've decided to add this:

I am 100% against war.

This post is about compulsory military service,
particularly for people who have nothing better
to do than terrorize their own citizens!

This post arose from a conversation with some
people active and retired from the military:

at no time was I making 'light' of any war or conflict.


Is it time to bring back compulsory military service?

I don't think decent, hardworking people should be shipped
over to some middle eastern cesspool to risk their lives, when
we have an over-abundence of scum, crooks, and bored teenagers
wasting valuable space!

 

[westwoody]

If you have actually seen it up close, smelled the bodies, seen kids crying because their house has been burned and they don't know where their mommy or daddy are, you will be a lot less likely to be yelling about how "We" should go over there and fix "Them". I notice it's usually arrogant little chickenshits that know they will never be serving anywhere who are the most eager to send others into harm's way. You ever see anybody with their head blown off? Maybe it isn't as funny as you think.

 

[tedsweettangv]

I could be wrong but I don't think Canada has had conscription since WWII. The status quo in Canada is no forced or manditory military service unless we are actually in a declared war and the National Resources Mobilization Act would have to be invoked and voted on in parliament.

 

[gravitas]

I believe the Swiss & Austrians (and I'm sure others) have the right idea. When you turn 18 you owe two years to the state whether that be military, assisting in hospitals/schools or some other public service. You get paid a fair wage but below what an equivalent private sector employee would make but are provided subsidized housing and living. In addition to providing a valuable resource to the rest of the population they learn life skills and hopefully responsibility and work ethic.

Maybe it isn't as funny as you think.

Don't think LG was making light of either the current war in Israel/Lebanon. If anything I viewed his post as being sympathetic to the decent men and women dying who are caught up in the middle of someone else's conflict. Oh, and while I've never seen a head "blown off" I have witnessed someone after an MVA resulting in a decapitation and its one of the most surreal events of my life.

 

[LonelyGhost]

If you have actually seen it up close, smelled the bodies, seen kids crying because their house has been burned and they don't know where their mommy or daddy are, you will be a lot less likely to be yelling about how "We" should go over there and fix "Them". I notice it's usually arrogant little chickenshits that know they will never be serving anywhere who are the most eager to send others into harm's way. You ever see anybody with their head blown off? Maybe it isn't as funny as you think.

did you actually read what I wrote? nothing about us fixing them ...

the question was whether the scum who live here should serve in
the military ... and maybe oversees if there is a mission.

and if you EVER read any of my posts on the subject of WAR,
you would know that I am 100% against it but I do support the
people who do their job and duty in it.

 

[H.Miller]

Is it time to bring back compulsory military service?

I don't think decent, hardworking people should be shipped
over to some middle eastern cesspool to risk their lives, when
we have an over-abundence of scum, crooks, and bored teenagers
wasting valuable space!

Why bring these decent people into it ; scum, crooks ,teenagers, (relatively speaking), we could send nortel execs instead.

 

[Rain Man]

Everyone in for 2 years. Think of the improvements in our society it would bring.

This is my rifle
This is my gun
This is for fighting
This is for fun


Spent many drunk nights marching in the barracks singing that one.

 

[rickoshadows]

What makes you think we even want your riff raff. Being a soldier in the modern world takes far more analytical thinking and judgement than most people realize, abilities which are sadly lacking in those most of you think would be suitable for military service. That is why those morons are, and will continue to be a burden on society.

A single soldier today has the ability to direct enough firepower and destruction to destroy and entire WWII regiment. Which is why the only enemy standing against modern armies are ununiformed irregulars which are well dug in and hiding among civilian populations. They die like flies by the way, for every NATO soldier killed in Afganistan, they lose 30-50.

In the CNN war, even front line troops may be required to make decisions which will have international repurcussions. Now look again at those petty criminals and layabouts, you can keep em.

 

[sirlickheralot]

What makes you think we even want your riff raff. Being a soldier in the modern world takes far more analytical thinking and judgement than most people realize, abilities which are sadly lacking in those most of you think would be suitable for military service. That is why those morons are, and will continue to be a burden on society.

A single soldier today has the ability to direct enough firepower and destruction to destroy and entire WWII regiment. Which is why the only enemy standing against modern armies are ununiformed irregulars which are well dug in and hiding among civilian populations. They die like flies by the way, for every NATO soldier killed in Afganistan, they lose 30-50.

In the CNN war, even front line troops may be required to make decisions which will have international repurcussions. Now look again at those petty criminals and layabouts, you can keep em.

Well said, I was thinking along similar lines before I read your post.

(Take group of people who have shown poor judgement + access to serious firepower x anger over being forced to serve against their will = recipe for disaster)

 

[planetsmurf]

if WW3 broke out and canada really needed troops then i would sign up and if not enough volunteers enlisted then i would say bring back the draft but now we don't need one.

 

[sdw]

Is it time to bring back compulsory military service?

I don't think decent, hardworking people should be shipped
over to some middle eastern cesspool to risk their lives, when
we have an over-abundence of scum, crooks, and bored teenagers
wasting valuable space!

One of the biggest problems we have is that the people who do choose to become soldiers or police are so dumb.

I'm not talking about the skilled positions like pilots, naval officers, etc.
What I'm talking about is the person who entered the forces because they couldn't get another job.

There really has to be a minimal amount of inteligence required or you have people getting killed too easily or killing too easily.

The reason armed forces have gone away from compulsory service is that you get stuck with the untrainable like the platoon that committed the Mai Li atrocity in Vietnam. The scared boys that shot up a car load of women because they don't speak english and couldn't understand the instructions.

The American and Canadian armed forces performed with distinction in WWII and the Korean War because the population knew the war had meaning and joined up. When you have a core of intelligent people, you don't get the really stupid stuff.

The intelligent people knew that Vietnam didn't have meaning and used their intelligence to avoid going. That meant that only the dumb went.

The same is the case with Iraq. The war only has meaning to a very small number of people. To the rest of us it's just a lot of people dying in a country that is going to be handed on a platter to Iran. The only thing the Iraq war is doing is intensifying the justified hatred the people of the region have for us.

I think that when it is important, the intelligent ones will be willing to serve again. Fighting for oil or so some people can hang on to what they have stolen isn't worth dying for.

 

[therealrex]

When it comes time to invade Alberta to take back Canada's oil I'll sign up.

 

[gravitas]

When it comes time to invade Alberta to take back Canada's oil I'll sign up.

bring it on bitch

 

[Highsticking]

One of the biggest problems we have is that the people who do choose to become soldiers or police are so dumb.

My initial reaction to your post was anger, but frankly at the time I left the forces I would have to say your comment is a fair generalization, abeit poorly worded. Ingnorant is a more accurate description.

A conscript army is without a doubt not fit for the same service as a professional army. Unfortunatey we have a professional force that is poorly paid, poorly funded, and with questionable leadership.

I also agree with gravits, everyone, absolutely everyone, low lifes to the sons/daugters of CEOs should serve in some form or another.

Cheers,
HS

 

[LonelyGhost]

One of the biggest problems we have is that the people who do choose to become soldiers or police are so dumb.

I'm not talking about the skilled positions like pilots, naval officers, etc.
What I'm talking about is the person who entered the forces because they couldn't get another job.

There really has to be a minimal amount of inteligence required or you have people getting killed too easily or killing too easily.

First off, not every criminal is an idiot, nor police or military: I certainly agree
with a lot of the posts that the new military is a highly intelligent, highly trained group of men and women.

HOWEVER, what's wrong with handing 'junior with the attitude problem' a fucking shovel (pretty low tech weapon) and having him or her dig the fucking latrines? they still need to be cleaned too, right? need someone to do the dishes, pick up garbage, vacuum tents.

as far as i know, there is plenty of 'grunt' work that needs to be done in the military and even if you just need a dummy for bayonet practice, junior will do just fine!

at no time did i say send them into actual combat (unless they have an aptitutde for it and are properly trained) but there's lots they can do.

and the money that our fucked up govt spends on youth programs can go to the military for a new and improved 'youth' program!

Why is it that many other countries can have compulsive military service and it works and you mention it here in Canada and everyone collectively shits their pants???

 

[rickoshadows]

First off, not every criminal is an idiot, nor police or military: I certainly agree
with a lot of the posts that the new military is a highly intelligent, highly trained group of men and women.

HOWEVER, what's wrong with handing 'junior with the attitude problem' a fucking shovel (pretty low tech weapon) and having him or her dig the fucking latrines? they still need to be cleaned too, right? need someone to do the dishes, pick up garbage, vacuum tents.

as far as i know, there is plenty of 'grunt' work that needs to be done in the military and even if you just need a dummy for bayonet practice, junior will do just fine!

at no time did i say send them into actual combat (unless they have an aptitutde for it and are properly trained) but there's lots they can do.

and the money that our fucked up govt spends on youth programs can go to the military for a new and improved 'youth' program!

Why is it that many other countries can have compulsive military service and it works and you mention it here in Canada and everyone collectively shits their pants???

Oh, so what you really want is a juvenile daycare facility to do the job that parents and society should have done in the first place. Why didn't you say so in the first place. I can't believe I'm hearing this from the less-government-get-rid-of-nanny-state LG. Be that it may, we would want to start a little earlier, say 12 or 13. That way we would stamp out any hint of personality and creativity. Kids could finish at about age 18 properly conditioned to work for minimum wage in order to serve the needs of the collective citizens of Canada. Count me in as a yes.

NOT!

 

[Quarter Mile'r]

Draft??

Nope, I like bottled beer personally!


.........QM'r

 

[gravitas]

society should have done in the first place

I, as part of society, chose not to have kids so why should I have to raise someone else's

 

[LonelyGhost]

Oh, so what you really want is a juvenile daycare facility to do the job that parents and society should have done in the first place. Why didn't you say so in the first place. I can't believe I'm hearing this from the less-government-get-rid-of-nanny-state LG. Be that it may, we would want to start a little earlier, say 12 or 13. That way we would stamp out any hint of personality and creativity. Kids could finish at about age 18 properly conditioned to work for minimum wage in order to serve the needs of the collective citizens of Canada. Count me in as a yes.

NOT!

1. yes, parents SHOULD have done THEIR job in the first place ...

however, since many don't, a couple years military service would do the little fucks some good...

2. no one is saying to restart the Hitler Youth like you seem to be advocating ... but since no one else teaches kids any discipline, why not have them serve some time?

 

[sdw]

1. yes, parents SHOULD have done THEIR job in the first place ...

however, since many don't, a couple years military service would do the little fucks some good...

2. no one is saying to restart the Hitler Youth like you seem to be advocating ... but since no one else teaches kids any discipline, why not have them serve some time?

When I went to Vietnam I used to care if the dumbf**ks that I was saddled with survived. After a couple of hundred of them had managed to kill themselves and anyone unfortunate enough to be in the area, I ceased to care.

They would go out on patrol already high on drugs, too lazy to carry rations or ammo, use a transistor radio to listen to tunes.

The ones that wanted to live soon learned how to leave the walking suicides far behind.

Conscripts make lousy soldiers. Soldiers who think the military is an alternative to welfare make lousy soldiers.

All you get in the "grunt" trades is dross unless the intelligent people think there is a real necessity to the war. All the fighting since the 1950s has been for the benefit of the multinationals. It is not worth dying for oil, trade or money. Expecially since it's only the people like Cheney who gain any benefit.