disputing speeding ticket question

[Orpheus6]

i read the recent perb discussion on disputing speeding tickets and thought i would seek fellow perb members who have been to court some advice. The thing is i will be disputing a speeding ticket next week. i think i have a good case as the police officer screwed up the dates on the ticket. (eg. instead of indicating that the offence took place nov 30, he writes 03). I am hoping that even if the officer shows up, the ticket will still be thrown out by the judge becuase of this. In addition, If this is not enough, what other agruments should i bring up to reduce my ticket.

any advice would be greatly appreciated, as this will be my first trip to court and i don't really know WHAT to say or HOW to address court officials. Will the judge ask me to present my argument first, or will the judge ask the police officer?

thanks

 

[Discombobbled]

i read the recent perb discussion on disputing speeding tickets and thought i would seek fellow perb members who have been to court some advice. The thing is i will be disputing a speeding ticket next week. i think i have a good case as the police officer screwed up the dates on the ticket. (eg. instead of indicating that the offence took place nov 30, he writes 03). I am hoping that even if the officer shows up, the ticket will still be thrown out by the judge becuase of this. In addition, If this is not enough, what other agruments should i bring up to reduce my ticket.

any advice would be greatly appreciated, as this will be my first trip to court and i don't really know WHAT to say or HOW to address court officials. Will the judge ask me to present my argument first, or will the judge ask the police officer?

thanks

The Crown can amend issues such as dates, etc. Sorry, you're out of luck on that one. As for what you should argue, it's important to discuss the number of feet before the cop saw you, if you were going around a corner (radar isn't accurate on corners-bends) etc. However, if you don't have a lawyer or other representative, the judge will give you some leaway. In fact, the law requires that he/she act in your best interest. Also, question them about how they tested their radar gun before use. If it wasn't tested 'by way of tuning fork' then it's not considered accurate. Good luck! BTW, the Crown must present their case first. The officer will be called to testify by the Crown, but if he/she doesn't show up then you need to plead not guilty. No testimony, no conviction.

 

[Orpheus6]

thanks for the tip Discombobbled. let's hope the cop doesn't show up.

Anyone know how far the radar gun works, cause i must have been a block away (maybe 50 meters away from where the cops were holding a road block). sort of caught me when i was trying to merge into a lane (as the car beside me wouldn't give way and there was a huge line up behind him).

 

[ghostie]

any advice would be greatly appreciated, as this will be my first trip to court and i don't really know WHAT to say or HOW to address court officials. Will the judge ask me to present my argument first, or will the judge ask the police officer?

Check out this page. It is about photo-radar but it gives a lot of good B.C. specific information that might help you, including what arguements you should not be wasting your time on, and some links to cases:

http://www.sense.bc.ca/program.htm

 

[ghostie]

You should also go pick up this book if you are going to take your case through court. I believe they have it at most Chapters (phone ahead) or you can order it online:

http://www.chapters.indigo.ca/item....ight+ticket&N=35&Lang=en&Section=books&zxac=1

I think you get it at the public library as well.

Note that it is not completely up to date, but it will help you with a lot of your questions.

 

[Swguy]

The Crown can amend issues such as dates, etc. Sorry, you're out of luck on that one.

Not so fast there, Discom... (sorry... pun not fully intended )...

A few years ago I got a speeding ticket with the wrong date on it. I got nabbed doing 94 in a 50 zone one sunny afternoon in April. Cop pulled me over and gave me the ticket. Driving home I look at the ticket to see how fast they caught me at (was always proud of my lil' RX-7) and notice that the cop put my birthdate - which is in June - on the ticket as the date of offence. I though.. what?... they're hiring psychic cops now..??

Needless to say I disputed it. On the day in court, the cop was there, and the judge asked if there had been any effort made by the Mounties to amend the ticket and present me with a new ticket. They said that they hadn't tried and that mine must have slipped by them.

Case dismissed.

So, if the date is wrong, dispute it immediately and then wait to see if they DO try to get ahold of you, if they catch their mistake.




SWG

 

[Discombobbled]

Check out this page. It is about photo-radar but it gives a lot of good B.C. specific information that might help you, including what arguements you should not be wasting your time on, and some links to cases:

http://www.sense.bc.ca/program.htm

Good link Ghostie, thanks.

 

[yyctype]

The Crown can amend issues such as dates, etc. Sorry, you're out of luck on that one.

Not quite true. In Canada the Crown can amend information within 6months of the ticket date. If you are beyond that point the Crown can apply for the amendment, but you should object on the basis that the statue only allows for amendments within a 6mo time frame.

If successful the Crown should withdraw the charge or you should ask to have it quashed.

 

[Discombobbled]

Not quite true. In Canada the Crown can amend information within 6months of the ticket date. If you are beyond that point the Crown can apply for the amendment, but you should object on the basis that the statue only allows for amendments within a 6mo time frame.

If successful the Crown should withdraw the charge or you should ask to have it quashed.

Shall I post more, or am I just an idiot and need to go back to law school

(2) Proceedings to which any of the provisions amended by the schedule apply that were in progress immediately before the coming into force of this Act shall be continued in accordance with those amended provisions without any further formality."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), ss. 204 to 207:

Certificates of analysis of breath


204. Paragraphs 255(1)(f) and (g) of the Criminal Code, as they read immediately before the coming into force of the amendments to those paragraphs, as enacted by section 36 of this Act, continue to apply to any proceedings in respect of which a certificate referred to in those paragraphs was issued prior to the coming into force of the amendments to those paragraphs.

Trial by judge and jury in county court


205. The Criminal Code, as it read immediately before the coming into force of the repeal of section 430 made by section 63 of this Act, continues to apply to any prosecution in which the information was laid before the coming into force of that amendment.

Appeal by way of stated case


206. The Criminal Code, as it read immediately before the coming into force of the amendments made by section 182 of this Act, continues to apply to any case in which the notice of application to state a case was served on the summary conviction court before the coming into force of that amendment.

Application of increased punishment


207. Where any penalty, forfeiture or punishment provided by the Criminal Code is varied by this Act, the lesser penalty, forfeiture or punishment applies in respect of any offence that was committed before the coming into force of this Act."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 51 (1st Supp.), s. 2:

Review of s. 213 after three years


"2. (1) Three years after the coming into force of this Act, a comprehensive review of the provisions of section 213 of the Criminal Code, as enacted by this Act, shall be undertaken by such committee of the House of Commons as may be designated or established by the House for that purpose.

Report to House of Commons


(2) The committee referred to in subsection (1) shall, within a year after the review is undertaken or within such further time as the House of Commons may authorize, submit a report on the review to the House including a statement of any changes the committee recommends."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 27 (2nd Supp.), s. 11:

Transitional: proceedings


"11. Proceedings to which any of the provisions amended by the schedule apply that were commenced before the coming into force of section 10 shall be continued in accordance with those amended provisions without any further formality."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 19 (3rd Supp.), s. 19:

Review after four years


"19. (1) On the expiration of four years after the coming into force of this Act, the provisions contained herein shall be referred to such committee of the House of Commons, of the Senate, or of both Houses of Parliament as may be designated or established by Parliament for that purpose.

Report


(2) The committee designated or established by Parliament for the purpose of subsection (1) shall, as soon as practicable, undertake a comprehensive review of the provisions and operation of this Act and shall, within one year after the review is undertaken or within such further time as the House of Commons may authorize, submit a report to Parliament thereon including such recommendations pertaining to the continuation of those sections and changes required therein as the committee may wish to make."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 23 (4th Supp.), s. 8:

Transitional


"8. Section 727.9 of the Criminal Code, as enacted by section 6 of this Act, does not apply to any proceedings in respect of an offence committed before the coming into force of that section."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 40 (4th Supp.), s. 2(2):

Transitional-- proceedings


"(2) Every proceeding commenced before the coming into force of this section under a provision amended by the schedule shall be taken up and continued under and in conformity with the amended provision without any further formality."

-- R.S., 1985, c. 40 (4th Supp.), s. 2(4):

Transitional-- rules of court (SI/81-32 and 33)


"(4) The Rules of Practice of the Court of the Sessions of the Peace of Quebec, Penal and Criminal Jurisdiction and the Rules of Practice of the Youth Court of the Province of Quebec, on Criminal and Penal Matters shall be deemed to have been made by the Court of Quebec with the approval of the lieutenant governor in council of that Province."

-- 1990, c. 16, s. 24(1):

Transitional: proceedings


"24. (1) Every proceeding commenced before the coming into force of this subsection and in respect of which any provision amended by this Act applies shall be taken up and continued under and in conformity with that amended provision without any further formality."

-- 1990, c. 17, s. 45(1):

Transitional: proceedings


"45. (1) Every proceeding commenced before the coming into force of this subsection and in respect of which any provision amended by this Act applies shall be taken up and continued under and in conformity with that amended provision without any further formalit

 

[Cock Throppled]

If you are really innocent, try to make a contribution to our society. If you are guilty take your punishment.

I agree. If you are truly a victim of circumstances fight for your rights. But if (for example) you're doing 94 in a 30 zone let's face it - you're a moron who is endangering others and deserves a ticket. Grow some cojones and take your punishment.

 

[sdw]

i read the recent perb discussion on disputing speeding tickets and thought i would seek fellow perb members who have been to court some advice. The thing is i will be disputing a speeding ticket next week. i think i have a good case as the police officer screwed up the dates on the ticket. (eg. instead of indicating that the offence took place nov 30, he writes 03). I am hoping that even if the officer shows up, the ticket will still be thrown out by the judge becuase of this. In addition, If this is not enough, what other agruments should i bring up to reduce my ticket.

any advice would be greatly appreciated, as this will be my first trip to court and i don't really know WHAT to say or HOW to address court officials. Will the judge ask me to present my argument first, or will the judge ask the police officer?

thanks

The police officer gives his/her testimony first. If the police officer says that you were speeding on Nov 3, ask to see their ticket book. If the other tickets are dated Nov 30, the judge will quash the ticket.

 

[Orpheus6]

appreciate all the tips. Particularly about treating the cop with a little respect. I was planning to go hardcore (saying something like if the cop can't write the date correctly, how can we be sure he measured my speed correctly, or something along that line). Instead, I'll probably just bring the date error to the court's attention if the cop shows up, and see what the judge says. if that doesn't work, I'll just ask the judge to lower the speeding ticket due to financial difficulties.

dsw: what happens if the cop or crown reads the offence date as (Eg. nov 30) instead of the error of (eg. nov 3) on my ticket. I am thinking the crown might try to cover up the fact that the ticket was made on the wrong date.

anyone also know whether the judge has the power to remove your demerit points??

 

[notyetgeezer]

Ticket

If the cop shows up, put him on the stand and cross examine him, start with simple questions as to his experience etc...then ask him where he was on the wrong date, he should be able to refer to his diary, he will be toast, I have done it lots of times and never lost one yet..

 

[gossie]

Speeding Tickets

I've disputed my last six and they were all dismissed because the office never showed. About two weeks before the court date you request a different court date due to some sort of emergency ie trip, funeral, wedding etc. By then its often months before you finally get into court and often the police officer is transfered (especially if its RCMP). If they do show up just denie the charge. The most you will get is the fine you would have had to pay anyway.