Bill c-36 in Victoria

[johnywalker87]

Hi,
I just moved to Victoria and my landlord made me sign a form from Victoria Police that mentions that it isn't allowed to bring sex workers or smoke marijuana in the apartment.
My landlord told me that this is a program between Victoria police service and landlords. I'm renting from a company that owns and manages dozens of buildings in Greater Victoria area.
The form doesn't say it isn't allowed for a sex worker to use the apartment to sell sex,so they might follow the federal policy of targeting clients
I don't know if this form was drafted before or after bill c-36 because outcalls used to be legal before c-36.
I'm confused because in the medias the city of Victoria and police say that they are against that bill,but they already gave policies against sex trade like this form signy by tenants.
anyone experienced that ?
Is it safer to take the ferry to hobby in Seattle ?

 

[*emmanuelle]

Hi,
I just moved to Victoria and my landlord made me sign a form from Victoria Police that mentions that it isn't allowed to bring sex workers or smoke marijuana in the apartment.
My landlord told me that this is a program between Victoria police service and landlords. I'm renting from a company that owns and manages dozens of buildings in Greater Victoria area.

It sounds to me like this is a form that was specifically requested by the property management company. It's not really surprising that since paying for sex is technically illegal, the legal departments of large rental companies would want to cover their butts.

In the medias the city of Victoria and police say that they are against that bill

That's correct. Victoria police are openly against the bill. They have told me personally that there is "nothing to worry about" and that "nothing is going to change"

Is it safer to take the ferry to hobby in Seattle?

Definitely not! There are police stings in the states. There are no stings in Victoria.

There has been a lot of fear mongering on this board lately, guys talking about a near future in which doors are going to be broken down and incalls swarmed with swat teams. That is not going to happen.
If you are really nervous about it, stick to well-reviewed, reputable ladies and agencies and you have nothing to worry about!

 

[escapefromstress]

I found this BC Housing Tenant Handbook from 2012 , so the rules could have existed pre C-36.

Page 25 has a clause regarding no sex workers

The tenant(s), any occupant of the tenant(s’) household and any persons
invited onto the residential property or residential premise by the tenant(s)
or any member of the tenant(s’) family shall not engage in any criminal
activity on the premises or property including, but not limited to:

• any drug-related criminal activity;
• solicitation (sex-trade workers and related nuisance activity);
• street gang activity;
• assault or threatened assault;
• unlawful use of a firearm;

 

[johnywalker87]

I found this BC Housing Tenant Handbook from 2012 , so the rules could have existed pre C-36.

Page 25 has a clause regarding no sex workers

The tenant(s), any occupant of the tenant(s’) household and any persons
invited onto the residential property or residential premise by the tenant(s)
or any member of the tenant(s’) family shall not engage in any criminal
activity on the premises or property including, but not limited to:

• any drug-related criminal activity;
• solicitation (sex-trade workers and related nuisance activity);
• street gang activity;
• assault or threatened assault;
• unlawful use of a firearm;

Outcalls wasn't a criminal offense back in 2012, why did they include it ?

 

[tadolder]

I found this BC Housing Tenant Handbook from 2012 , so the rules could have existed pre C-36.

Page 25 has a clause regarding no sex workers

The tenant(s), any occupant of the tenant(s’) household and any persons
invited onto the residential property or residential premise by the tenant(s)
or any member of the tenant(s’) family shall not engage in any criminal
activity on the premises or property including, but not limited to:

• any drug-related criminal activity;
• solicitation (sex-trade workers and related nuisance activity);
• street gang activity;
• assault or threatened assault;
• unlawful use of a firearm;

This handbook is for BC Housing properties, government owned low income housing, and co-ops, not private sector rentals. No such clause appears in the standard rental or lease agreement.

 

[johnywalker87]

Note that it specifically refers to the term solicitation and does not limit it to sex work solicitation. We here on PERB automatically connect the term solicitation to prostitution but in the clause of the agreement it also includes panhandling & all other nuisance soliciting. I would assume that the agreement prohibits the tenant from running one of those auto-dial phone scams from the property as that would be nuisance solicitation.

So that clause of the agreement states that the tenant or guests cannot solicit on the property but is silent on the issue of having a sex worker visit the tenant or for the tenant to be a sex worker who sees clients there by appointment.

The form I signed mentioned that it isn't allowed for a tenant to solicit the services of sex trade workers. My understanding is that means inviting sex workers to your apartment, because if you refer to public solicitation e.g on the street then you are not on the property. I have never seen sex workers soliciting tenants outside of their apartments building .

 

[johnywalker87]

This handbook is for BC Housing properties, government owned low income housing, and co-ops, not private sector rentals. No such clause appears in the standard rental or lease agreement.

The form I have signed was an annex attached to my lease agreement.

 

[Blonde Brynn]

I signed a similar form when I rented a place in Victoria over 3 years ago. I'm guessing it's a way for the rental company to cover their asses, and maybe get a break on their insurance rates to boot.

 

[tadolder]

They can add what ever they want and the only reason to do so is to protect themselves, it doesn't mean it will stand up in an arbitration hearing. It shows that they know the activity is illegal, so why would they allow a tenant to move in with the intention of doing something illegal. It may get them off the hook but when it comes to the tenant, there has to be proof, and the residential tenancy branch will side with the tenant most of the time.

 

[johnywalker87]

Now my concern is whether this would encourage neighbours to report to the landlord sex workers visiting tenants, and if the landlord is allowed to kick out tenants suspected of inviting sex workers based on neighbours complaints .

 

[johnywalker87]

I imagine any well respected SP would give someone the thought " Oh she's pretty" if any thought at all and not "HOOKER HOOKER HOOKER" to some normal person walking down the hallway. Most people don't have prostitutes on the mind, except maybe for the pervy guy at the end of the hall who hopes every hot chick he see's he can pay to lay I wouldn't worry so much. Just make wise choices.

Yes but if you are for example in your 50's and neighbours see often different girls in their early 20's coming to visit you, they can suspect that you're inviting sex workers

 

[johnsmit]

Well every thing has to have proof. . and if girl visit you place they might or might not be sex workers
you may just happen to know girls that work as escort...they can't stop them from visiting you..
They have know way of knowing what goes on in your privit residence.. If they attempt to that is invasion of privacy. .they would be breaking the law.
Unless your activities or hour guest activities cause a disturbance and there lagitamate grounds for complaints...There is very little they can do to you..

Some more individual trying to put their morel opinion on others behavoiur .
Even the refrance to weed or other drugs..is uniforcable with out physical evidance. that means the
smell can be traces .only to.your apt and there is weed or drugs found by the police in your apt.
All have to been done legally and with warrents

 

[johnywalker87]

Not necessarily. You could be - How did Steve Martin put it??? - "Helping unwed mothers get their start".

Snapping at the folks who offer suggestions (and you have been a bit snappish) is uncalled for. I suggest you either:
1 - abide by the contract that you signed and not invite sex workers to your home,
2 - disregard the contract that you signed and invite sex workers to your home, or
3 - move to a new place where the landlord does not require you to sign a contract requiring you to not invite sex workers to your home.

We here cannot fix your issue. You read it & you signed it. Somewhere in that process a reasonable person would have considered what it meant & decided if they could live with the requirement or not before signing off on it.

If it is a real burning issue for you, go talk to your lawyer to discuss your options and the risks. Let us know how that turns out for you. Or not.

You forgot number 4:
4- get a mortgage , so you own your home

 

[johnywalker87]

Definitely not! There are police stings in the states. There are no stings in Victoria.

!

Well, at least in the states it's illegal for both client and sex worker so no risk or blackmail . Here in Victoria there is also the risk when you invite a sex worker and she knows your address to threaten you to report you for obtaining sexual service for consideration from her as she won't be prosecuted for that but only you.
I have heard that Washington state is very liberal, even more liberal than Canada as recreational marijuana is legal there so they should be more tolerant about sex trade.

 

[leoghaire]

Well, at least in the states it's illegal for both client and sex worker so no risk or blackmail . Here in Victoria there is also the risk when you invite a sex worker and she knows your address to threaten you to report you for obtaining sexual service for consideration from her as she won't be prosecuted for that but only you.
I have heard that Washington state is very liberal, even more liberal than Canada as recreational marijuana is legal there so they should be more tolerant about sex trade.

you would think they would be more tolerant, but Washington state is actually almost the most uptight state when in comes to the sex trade

 

[Larry Storch]

Well every thing has to have proof. . and if girl visit you place they might or might not be sex workers
you may just happen to know girls that work as escort...they can't stop them from visiting you..
They have know way of knowing what goes on in your privit residence.. If they attempt to that is invasion of privacy. .they would be breaking the law.
Unless your activities or hour guest activities cause a disturbance and there lagitamate grounds for complaints...There is very little they can do to you..

Some more individual trying to put their morel opinion on others behavoiur .
Even the refrance to weed or other drugs..is uniforcable with out physical evidance. that means the
smell can be traces .only to.your apt and there is weed or drugs found by the police in your apt.
All have to been done legally and with warrents

This is your solution. Relax and get laid occasionally.

 

[summerbreeze]

I think you might want to consider this is about the contractual right to evict someone without having to go through a very lengthy process otherwise.

A landlord might put in a rental contract no smoking for instance or no loud noise/music after 10pm. These terms give them the right to evict someone who is in breach.

It does not mean they will actually enforce the terms of their contract however it gives them the option to give notice and clear a tenant out within the contractual time in the agreement.

I lived in an apartment that prohibited bbq on the patio since it was a wood frame building and they had a fire. The insurance company refused to re-insure unless they put that clause in the rental agreement.

Would not read more into this than a contractual term issue between a landlord and a tenant.