9-11: Five Years Later—Where Are We?

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9-11: Five Years Later—Where Are We?

Those who are questioning the “official” explanation of 9-11 are not being unpatriotic

Paul Craig Roberts, Ph.D.

Many readers have praised me for my courage in broaching taboo subjects and stating obvious truths. Others denounce me for “being unpatriotic and distrusting our government.”

One reader, Susan Hartman, wrote to me that I was obviously in the pay of Islamic jihadists and that she had reported me to the FBI.

Despite the lack of evidence to support their belief, a number of readers remain confident that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction and that America narrowly missed being annihilated. These readers know for a fact that Hussein had WMD because “the president would know, and he wouldn’t lie.”

In other words, whatever Bush says is true, and all who doubt him are unpatriotic. “You are with us or against us.”

The facts be damned. There are a large number of Susan Hartmans in the body politic. A group of scientists, engineers and university professors are trying to start a debate about the collapse of the three World Trade Center buildings. I reported one of their findings:

There is an inconsistency between the speed with which the buildings collapsed and the “pancaking theory” used to explain the collapse. Another way of putting the problem is that there seems to be a massive energy deficit in the explanation that the buildings fell as a result of gravitational energy. There simply was not sufficient gravitational energy to produce the results.

For reporting a scientific finding, I was called a “conspiracy theorist.” Only in America is scientific analysis seen as conspiracy theory and government lies as truth.

Applications of the laws of physics and scientific calculations can be reviewed and checked by other scientists. Scientists, like the rest of us, can
make mistakes. Questions raised about the collapse of the WTC buildings are not engaged, however, but ignored.

The 9-11 scholars’ findings seem to be in sync with public opinion. Polls show that more than one-third and as much as one-half of the American public does not believe the government’s 9-11 story.

The public doesn’t believe the John F. Kennedy assassination story, either.

Nevertheless, experts who point out problems in the official story are still called “conspiracy theorists,” even though a large percentage of the people share their doubts.

I think the reason so many Americans do not believe the Kennedy story told by the Warren Commission and the 9-11 story told by the 9-11 Commission is not because Americans are knowledgeable about ballistics or physics, or know how to do energy calculations, but because the stories contain too many unusual happenings, too many oddities.

In the Kennedy case, doubts are raised by such things as an improbable bullet trajectory, the against-all-procedures absence of Secret Service agents from the rear and sides of Kennedy’s limo, the inexplicable access of an unauthorized armed civilian, Jack Ruby, who was able to assassinate Oswald inside the jail before Oswald could be questioned.

Online at insidebayarea.com there is a report that two scientists, Pat Grant and Erik Randich, at the Forensic Science Center of the Lawrence Livermore Laboratory, have discredited the reliability of the “neutron activation” analysis, which was used to “prove” that all the recovered bullet fragments came from Oswald’s shots. Courts no longer accept this as evidence, and the FBI no longer uses the analysis that was employed to close the Oswald case.

Any one of these things would be an oddity. The combination of oddities becomes inexplicable, a statistical impossibility.

The same with the explanation of 9-11. Powerfully constructed buildings do not collapse when there is no source of the required energy to do the job. A large 757 hits the Pentagon but leaves a small hole, and there is no sign of wings, engines, tail or fuselage. Every air control and military procedure fails, and hijacked airliners are not intercepted by jet fighters. The alleged hijackers’ names apparently are not on the passenger lists, and some of the alleged hijackers have been found alive and well in Saudi Arabia.

Dr. Thomas R. Olmstead used the Freedom of Information Act to get a copy of the autopsy list of American Airlines flight 77, and he reports that there are no Arabic names on the list.

My point is a simple one. Attentive people, even if they are not scientifically literate, can sense when there are too many oddities for an explanation to be believable. If deception is sensed, there is a receptive audience when experts or filmmakers speak. Denouncing inconvenient facts as “conspiracy theories” is a way of suppressing debate and investigation.

This itself is telling. If the official explanations are safe, their proponents should welcome the opportunity to show again and again that the explanations can stand all challenges. Instead, the second a challenge shows its head, it is branded a “conspiracy theory.” That tells me that the official explanations can stand no challenge.

Don’t ask me who killed Kennedy and why, and don’t ask me who was behind the 9-11 attack or what brought the three WTC buildings down.

My position is a simple one: The official accounts are too improbable to be believable. I won’t believe them until the government can explain where the energy came from to bring down the three WTC buildings. With the demise of the “single bullet” theory, there seems to be no verification of Oswald’s magical shooting.

It seems to me that the real conspiracy theories are the explanations that are overweighted with improbabilities. Readers ask me what can we do—we can do very little, as we have lost control over our government. Elections, even if not stolen, change very little. Government got free of our control when we forgot the teaching of our Founding Fathers that government is always the greatest threat to our liberty.

© 2006 CREATORS SYNDICATE INC.

Nationally syndicated columnist, Paul Craig Roberts, Ph.D., a former editor at The Wall Street Journal, is the author of several books. He has been associated with the Hoover Institution, and the Institute for Political Economy and from 1981 to 1982 served as assistant secretary of the treasury for economic policy.
 

OTBn

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NYTimes: "Those buildings did not fall or their occupants die to become symbols in an incoherent argument. That outpouring of strength and consideration was never meant to serve as the pretext of false conclusions. The day will slip away from us as time passes, but not the clarity of the actions we took together in response. The purest patriotism we have in us to express was expressed in the common generosity of that moment."

The conspiracy theorists will play through - that the whole truth surfaces is unlikely; however, for a period of time the world was singularly motivated and behind the U.S. efforts to retaliate - "to get Bin Laden" ... much has been squandered in the subsequent 5 years.

 

luckydog71

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This guy is 100% wrong.

I do not know why he is wrong.

But then I do not need to produce any facts that would support my position, I just need to state emphatically he is 100% wrong.
 

smackyo

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OTBn said:
The conspiracy theorists will play through - that the whole truth surfaces is unlikely; however, for a period of time the world was singularly motivated and behind the U.S. efforts to retaliate - "to get Bin Laden" ... much has been squandered in the subsequent 5 years.

tell me about it. i'm no fan of u.s. politics but i remember that feeling and actually saying, they have my support to do what they have to do. pretty much the whole world was behind them, even a lot of arab countries.

then they had to fuck it all up with this iraq bullshit. then to friends that disagreed and tried to steer them to the right course of finishing what they started in afganistan and get bin laden, they insulted them, with quotes and jibes like "old europe", "freedom fries", and "your either with us or against us".

they took that feeling of love and the out pouring of sympathy and compassion and totally fucked it up. they'd have osama by now i'm sure if they would have went after the real culprit instead of trying to pull the wool over our eyes with such a ridiculous argument about iraq. what was even more surprising was that a majority of the u.s. people bought it.

the u.s. had the chance to unite the world and royally fucked it up big time. i really feel for the good men and women that they have dying in the middle east right now. its really too bad. the u.s. government and even to an extent its people for voting those dumb fucks in for another four years have no one to blame for the current mess but themselves.
 

JMBrowning

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luckydog71 said:
This guy is 100% wrong.

I do not know why he is wrong.

But then I do not need to produce any facts that would support my position, I just need to state emphatically he is 100% wrong.
Great sarcasm there. :rolleyes:

Smackyo has it right.

The US had the world's support after 9/11/2001, but that dipshit in the White House had to fuck it up by invading Iraq.

He should have spent his time to capturing Bin Laden rather than wasting time, money, resources and lives on an unnecessary fucked up war.

5 years after 9/11, here is where we're at:
1) More expensive oil prices.
2) A world that hates the USA.
3) A world that treats all Americans like shit, even those who do NOT agree with dubya or against the war in Iraq or did not for Bush.
 

JustAGuy

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smackyo said:
they took that feeling of love and the out pouring of sympathy and compassion and totally fucked it up. they'd have osama by now i'm sure if they would have went after the real culprit instead of trying to pull the wool over our eyes with such a ridiculous argument about iraq. what was even more surprising was that a majority of the u.s. people bought it.
It's not surprising to me, sad to say. I don't believe the American public is dumber than average because I think the majority of people everywhere tend to be uninformed, lazy sods who will choose the path of least resistance every time. In this case, Americans were being told over and over and over by people who they believed should know that Iraq was part of an "axis of evil" and posed an imminent threat to the United States. How anyone can look at that reptile Dick Cheney and believe a word that comes out of his mouth is beyond me but he kept making the connection between Saddam Hussein and 9/11. The average joe didn't understand that Iraq was probably the most secular state in the arab world and Saddam's regime was one that the Muslim extremists would want to topple most of all. Saddam wasn't in league with al-Qaida, they were his worst nightmare. They wanted to overthrow him and replace it with a fanatical Muslim regime akin to the Taliban in Afghanistan. But of course those nuances weren't explained to the American public because it would impede the neo-con agenda to spread democracy throughout the world.

The Muslim extremists didn't have the resources to accomplish the overthrow of Saddam Hussein but happily for them, the U.S. has done it for them. Today, Iraq is on the verge of outright civil war and you can be sure the end result will not be some amicable hand-holding government comprised of Shi'ites, Sunnis and Kurds. Ultimately it will be an extremist Muslim state with antipathy to all things western.

smackyo said:
the u.s. had the chance to unite the world and royally fucked it up big time. i really feel for the good men and women that they have dying in the middle east right now. its really too bad. the u.s. government and even to an extent its people for voting those dumb fucks in for another four years have no one to blame for the current mess but themselves.
You have greater faith than I do in there actually being a difference between tweedledum and tweedledumber, smackyo. The sad fact of life for an American voter is that he/she has virtually no choice when election time rolls around. The difference between liberal and conservative down there is so negligible on a true political spectrum as to be nonexistent. Both parties have the same core beliefs and only differ in their approach to how to achieve the "American dream". The two party system is flawed to start with but when the two parties are this alike, it's hard to fault the American public for voting idiots into office. The only choice they have is between idiot #1 and idiot #2.
 

dirtydan

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JMBrowning said:
Great sarcasm there. :rolleyes:

Smackyo has it right.

The US had the world's support after 9/11/2001, but that dipshit in the White House had to fuck it up by invading Iraq.

He should have spent his time to capturing Bin Laden rather than wasting time, money, resources and lives on an unnecessary fucked up war.

5 years after 9/11, here is where we're at:
1) More expensive oil prices.
2) A world that hates the USA.
3) A world that treats all Americans like shit, even those who do NOT agree with dubya or against the war in Iraq or did not for Bush.

Add to that the billions and billions of dollars per month the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are costing. As Osama bin Laden essentially said, to hurt the western countries it is best to get them sucked into small but expensive wars. Bush likes to quote bin Laden, but there is one idea he has overlooked.
 

luckydog71

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JMBrowning said:
Great sarcasm there. :rolleyes:

Smackyo has it right.

The US had the world's support after 9/11/2001, but that dipshit in the White House had to fuck it up by invading Iraq.

He should have spent his time to capturing Bin Laden rather than wasting time, money, resources and lives on an unnecessary fucked up war.

5 years after 9/11, here is where we're at:
1) More expensive oil prices.
2) A world that hates the USA.
3) A world that treats all Americans like shit, even those who do NOT agree with dubya or against the war in Iraq or did not for Bush.
JMB- I should have been clearer on my post. I was mocking Roberts not Smacko. Roberts believes he can call bullshit without offering a better explanation.

You inadvertently defined the difference between our two countries.

“The US had the world’s support ….” And fucked it up.

It is the Canadian culture that asks the question – “Does everyone like me?” “Does everyone think I am doing the right thing?”

Americans don’t think like that. JMB - I don’t want to be rude….but I could give a flying F*** if you like me or not. I also could give a FF if you think I am doing the right thing.

I am trying not to be a shit head here….but we (Americans) need to do what we thing is in our best interests. I do not want to do a poll to decide if we want to kill OMB or not. I do not want to go to the UN and ask permission to bomb Iranian plants. If they are a threat to the US then strike.

Let the Canadians sit around the camp fire singing cumbya and being all concerned about what others think.

Sadam pulled out a toy gun. At the time we had no way of knowing he had a toy gun. So the US reaction was kill the bastard and then go over and check out the gun he said he had. Guess what he lied. He acted like he had a gun he did not. Boy did he ever fool us. Good one Sadam.
 

threepeat

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luckydog71 said:
It is the Canadian culture that asks the question – “Does everyone like me?” “Does everyone think I am doing the right thing?”

Americans don’t think like that. JMB - I don’t want to be rude….but I could give a flying F*** if you like me or not. I also could give a FF if you think I am doing the right thing.

I am trying not to be a shit head here….but we (Americans) need to do what we thing is in our best interests. I do not want to do a poll to decide if we want to kill OMB or not. I do not want to go to the UN and ask permission to bomb Iranian plants. If they are a threat to the US then strike.

Let the Canadians sit around the camp fire singing cumbya and being all concerned about what others think.
LD, with all due respect, if you don't care what Canadians think, why are you on a Canadian message board educating us about the American perspective?
 

williewheeler

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what threepeat said!
 

Randy Whorewald

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threepeat said:
LD, with all due respect, if you don't care what Canadians think, why are you on a Canadian message board educating us about the American perspective?
Umm .... Because this is a lounge on a hooker review board ?? :)

You don't need to agree with what LD (or anyone else) says here. However, he is just as entitled to his opinion as anyone else.
 

threepeat

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Randy Whorewald said:
Umm .... Because this is a lounge on a hooker review board ?? :)

You don't need to agree with what LD (or anyone else) says here. However, he is just as entitled to his opinion as anyone else.
Totally agree. Everyone's entitled to their opinion. My point is simply that it seems strange to me that someone would bother to say "I don't care what you think, but here's why you're wrong." It implies that he does care what Canadians think, otherwise why would he bother to argue about American foreign policy on a Canadian board? People only write about stuff they care about (or that they're paid to care about). If LD doesn't give a FF about Canadian opinion on Iraq, he could just stick to the hooker stuff if he so desired, as we all could.
 

necko

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I'm not sure how to provide a link to it but heres a web site fromMaple Ridge that this supposedly has all the experts on 9/11 .//freewebs.com/abigsecret/This site at one point was saying Cheney and his cronies fr Halaburton were responsible for the building collaspes with Israelies flying the airplanes, Alot of hokcom if u ask me. Just my 2cents
 

smackyo

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luckydog71 said:
JMB- I should have been clearer on my post. I was mocking Roberts not Smacko. Roberts believes he can call bullshit without offering a better explanation.

You inadvertently defined the difference between our two countries.

“The US had the world’s support ….” And fucked it up.

It is the Canadian culture that asks the question – “Does everyone like me?” “Does everyone think I am doing the right thing?”

Americans don’t think like that. JMB - I don’t want to be rude….but I could give a flying F*** if you like me or not. I also could give a FF if you think I am doing the right thing.

I am trying not to be a shit head here….but we (Americans) need to do what we thing is in our best interests. I do not want to do a poll to decide if we want to kill OMB or not. I do not want to go to the UN and ask permission to bomb Iranian plants. If they are a threat to the US then strike.

Let the Canadians sit around the camp fire singing cumbya and being all concerned about what others think.

Sadam pulled out a toy gun. At the time we had no way of knowing he had a toy gun. So the US reaction was kill the bastard and then go over and check out the gun he said he had. Guess what he lied. He acted like he had a gun he did not. Boy did he ever fool us. Good one Sadam.
oh yeah i forgot about the "gun" sadam said he had and that he fooled you with dispite the fact that they sent countless documents and dvd's by the deadline stated by your government detailing thier total defense capabilities, which did not include weapons of mass destruction and that there were weapons inspectors that didn't find a goddamn thing, which told the un and the u.s. that nothing was found and they expressed serious doubts if they ever would.

then there was the "irrefutable" evidence given by colin powel at the un talking about "mobile chemical labs" and other ridiculous nonsense that anyone with half a brain could say that it was hersay evidence, yet the mind controlled trained u.s. public bought it hook, line and sinker.

also lucky i don't have to ask "does everybody like me?" cause i know they already do, being a canadian i know this. we march in step with the rest of the world not out of it. taking a stand when you know that you are 100% right is an admirable thing and that is not the case with the u.s. government.

they had friends after 9 - 11 that supported and cared about them and tried to have you see the air of your ways and what did the u.s. do? they shit all over them, because in your words americans don't care what others think right? act first ask questions later right?

getting back to the gun that saddam said he had. thats funny cause i think you and i remember it very differently. all i ever saw on the news was the iraqi government stating over and over and over and time and time and time again "we do not have weapons of mass destruction, we were not part of 9- 11.", i saw the iraqi government submit to every demand that the u.s. gave them to not be bombed short of having george dry fuck tariq aziz up the ass on tv to let the world know who was in charge.

that doesn't seem like he's acting like he has a gun to me. but again as you stated we think very differently being americans and canadians.

whats also really funny was that even as the war was going on and they didn't even have a chance to look for those non - existen weapons of mass destruction the focus started to shift more to the liberation of the people of iraq. funny that they started doing this even before they had a chance to look for those weapons "that sadam said he had.". its really, really funny cause the u.s. didn't seem to give a shit about the people of iraq when rummy was over there all smiles shaking sadams hand and giving him rim jobs.
 

OTBn

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luckydog71 said:
I am trying not to be a shit head here….but we (Americans) need to do what we thing is in our best interests. I do not want to do a poll to decide if we want to kill OMB or not. I do not want to go to the UN and ask permission to bomb Iranian plants. If they are a threat to the US then strike.
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Sadam pulled out a toy gun. At the time we had no way of knowing he had a toy gun. So the US reaction was kill the bastard and then go over and check out the gun he said he had. Guess what he lied. He acted like he had a gun he did not. Boy did he ever fool us. Good one Sadam.
luckydog, thankfully you do not speak for all Americans – not all Americans favour your isolationist mindset that abrogates treaties or multinational agreements. There are Americans that see the value of working within the global community rather than as a rogue nation.

Your Saddam/toy analogy is so trite – every lame ass claim for invading Iraq has been proven false… as lies and manipulations. But you’re correct - you were fooled by your own war architects and profiteers… no Saddam-Al Qaeda link, no Saddam-9/11 connection, no WMD, no nukes, no imminent threat. You were also fooled about the dollar costs of the war – those initial claims of 50-to-60 billion dollars to finance the war have now exceeded $300 billion. You were fooled when it was trumpeted that Iraqi oil would help finance the reconstruction… how’s that working out for you now? You were fooled by Cheney’s statements about being welcomed/embraced by the Iraqi people… as liberators – that the war would be over in weeks.

Most of all you’ve been fooled and manipulated into viewing that Bush has made you safer by the Iraq debacle… fooled that the Democrats are “soft on terror” … don’t click this link luckydog, don’t do it! Oh luckydog, you clicked it… timely, wouldn’t you say, given the shameless Republican politicking of 9/11

 

smackyo

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OTBn said:
luckydog, thankfully you do not speak for all Americans – not all Americans favour your isolationist mindset that abrogates treaties or multinational agreements. There are Americans that see the value of working within the global community rather than as a rogue nation.

Your Saddam/toy analogy is so trite – every lame ass claim for invading Iraq has been proven false… as lies and manipulations. But you’re correct - you were fooled by your own war architects and profiteers… no Saddam-Al Qaeda link, no Saddam-9/11 connection, no WMD, no nukes, no imminent threat. You were also fooled about the dollar costs of the war – those initial claims of 50-to-60 billion dollars to finance the war have now exceeded $300 billion. You were fooled when it was trumpeted that Iraqi oil would help finance the reconstruction… how’s that working out for you now? You were fooled by Cheney’s statements about being welcomed/embraced by the Iraqi people… as liberators – that the war would be over in weeks.

Most of all you’ve been fooled and manipulated into viewing that Bush has made you safer by the Iraq debacle… fooled that the Democrats are “soft on terror” … don’t click this link luckydog, don’t do it! Oh luckydog, you clicked it… timely, wouldn’t you say, given the shameless Republican politicking of 9/11

hahahahahahaha, oh shit dude. awesome link man. clinton pleading for the gop controlled house to do their jobs and make the country safe and instead of doing that they were all worried about and putting money, time and resources into finding out weather or not it was legal for the prez to get a blowjob.

lol, fucking great link man. but i mean really who could be bothered to get it done in the last three days, they were all thinking about their vacations.
 

luckydog71

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threepeat said:
LD, with all due respect, if you don't care what Canadians think, why are you on a Canadian message board educating us about the American perspective?
Good point 3P.

Each year as we approach 9/11 I get angry. My views or values don't change but when I am angry I do express them differently.

In hindsight, I could have expressed my views in less antagonistic words.

Sorry
 

hornyitalian06

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We should remember and respect the innocent people who lost their lives on September 11, 2001. It is still hard for me to believe it is 5 years ago this happened.
 

dirtydan

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luckydog71 said:
Let the Canadians sit around the camp fire singing cumbya and being all concerned about what others think.
Are you suggesting the use of US military power has been a good way to solve the world's problems?

luckydog71 said:
Sadam pulled out a toy gun. At the time we had no way of knowing he had a toy gun. So the US reaction was kill the bastard and then go over and check out the gun he said he had. Guess what he lied. He acted like he had a gun he did not. Boy did he ever fool us. Good one Sadam.
And how many people have died or been maimed because the Cowboy-in-Chief wanted to finish the job his daddy didn't? How many more terrorists, insurgents, militants or whatever one want to call them because the US invaded Afghanistan and Iraq? Is the world safer because US, coalition and NATO forces are in those respective countries? Remember 5 years ago when getting Osama bin Laden was the paramount priority of the Bush administration?
 
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