BC Elections : Predictions Anyone?

Who will be in power in BC for next for years.

  • Liberals

    Votes: 49 49.0%
  • NDP

    Votes: 43 43.0%
  • Green

    Votes: 3 3.0%
  • Not Sure

    Votes: 5 5.0%

  • Total voters
    100
  • Poll closed .
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rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
2,287
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Who won the debate tonight?

The question about campaign contributions to the NDP went deafeningly silent on three occasions. Horgan tried to pivot and looked quite lame saying he would put an end to big money in BC Elections all while accepting the cash. Hammering on the unions from Pittsburgh aligned with Trump again went unanswered by Horgan.

Christy was Christy and didn't really have much to offer other than her scripted material.
I'll say this: the tactic of trying to link clearly leftist John Horgan to Donald Trump, through the steelworkers union, has got to be one of the most absurd smears I've seen in BC politics. You'd have to know nothing, really nothing, about politics to actually believe Horgan is some sort of closet Trump supporter. However, Horgan was mistaken to say nothing about it - he probably was too stunned to think it was even real, much less the basis of a new series of ads. Even an absurd lie should not go unchallenged.

As for Clark's performance, yeah you're right that she did not have much to offer. Rehearsed catchphrases, generic non-answers, and so on. A calm and confident nothing is still nothing.
I thought her worst moments were when she was asserting that the Liberals did nothing about housing prices for years because they wanted to preserve peoples' equity. A lame excuse. Property taxes go up in tandem with it, and if you have to buy new home at an inflated price too, you basically gain nothing.
 

storm rider

Banned
Dec 6, 2008
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Also pretty typical of Liberal deaf and dumb and blind supporters who go back 20 years to moan about things done by people long gone, but ignore the much worse in the way of corruption happening now, and ignore the examples I posted earlier of massive cost over-runs by the Libs in the last 10 years that make the fast ferries look like pocket change.

Then there's the testament to stupidity - Site C dam.

And Glen Clark was cleared of all the charges.
I am not a Liberal supporter.I used to vote Liberal until the sponsorship scandal when the Federal Liberals under Chretien STOLE 250 million from Canadian taxpayers to give kickbacks to cronies.As for the BC Liberals they are "Liberal" in name only and their policies are generally conservative IMO.

I noticed you did not include my second post on this thread regarding the NDP and the LEAP manifesto.Have you read the LEAP manifesto?Do you actually support and endorse the LEAP manifesto?

As for NDP governance in general they have run EVERY Province into the ground when they got elected.BC/Ontario/Saskatchewan/Manitoba and they are now doing the same thing to Alberta.

SR
 

sdw

New member
Jul 14, 2005
2,189
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0
BC Elections has the Advance Polling for April 29 on their site. They will report each of the Advance Polling numbers each morning. Going by the April 29 Advance Polling, the BC Liberals are not going to be replaced. The first day of Advance Polling for the Federal Election saw 20% of voters rush to vote. It was clear that the Conservative Government was going to be replaced. The Advance Polling for the last Provincial Election saw about 6% of people voting, the BC Liberal government was re-elected. It's looking like the Advance Polling for this Provincial Election is going to be about the same, with the same result.

BTW BC Elections has a new computerized system in place. The DRO finds you on the voter's list and prints 2 labels. 1 label goes on the card that they mailed you, 1 label goes in the register of voter's book. You sign both labels. The political parties probably love this system. They get a list of everyone who has voted each day without having to have a Candidate Representative (Scrutineer) covering each polling station.

Since the political parties know who has already voted, they should be pulling hard each of the Advance Poll days. If they can't get the number of Advance Poll votes cast above 20% - it means the BC Liberals haven't got people mad enough to go out and vote them out.
 

80watts

Well-known member
May 20, 2004
3,250
1,186
113
Victoria
The funny thing is that tax payers allowed all our past governments to get away with those scandals. Allowed them to sell off crown corporations. Got voted in by promising lower taxes, until someone fiquired out the province was broke. Taxes had to go up. Elected persons should be held accountable, or go to jail if found corrupt. I prefer the chain gang method where they can build new roads with pick axes and shovels. Gas tax should go to roads and transportation , Not general revenue. Increase pst and gst which should go to wards education. Stop the handouts to welfare whiners who can work, but don't. Eliminate waste in government. There is lots of it. Hence why Harper got voted out and Trudeau got voted in. People were scared that their empire/handouts would be raided. Now as cdns you will not see a fed balanced budget for 50 years.. he is buying votes with your money. So get rid of the welfare vote. Maybe a cdn citizen should be if you pay taxes you can vote.
 

Ray

Well-known member
Dec 21, 2005
1,235
313
83
vancouver
As for NDP governance in general they have run EVERY Province into the ground when they got elected.BC/Ontario/Saskatchewan/Manitoba and they are now doing the same thing to Alberta
Alberta's economic woes stem from the collapse in the price of oil and gas. This is due to overproduction by the Saudis flooding the market to cripple Iran, and the US ramping up production of shale gas. It had absolutely nothing to do with the government in power in Alberta.
The NDP coming to power in 2015 in Alberta was a backlash against the Conservative government who were incapable of putting money aside for a rainy day when times were good, and also being unwilling to diversify the economy.
Alberta is actually looking to have the fastest growing economy in Canada for 2017, under the NDP government. It would, regardless of who was governing.
 

rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
2,287
1,370
113
BC Elections has the Advance Polling for April 29 on their site. They will report each of the Advance Polling numbers each morning. Going by the April 29 Advance Polling, the BC Liberals are not going to be replaced. The first day of Advance Polling for the Federal Election saw 20% of voters rush to vote. It was clear that the Conservative Government was going to be replaced. The Advance Polling for the last Provincial Election saw about 6% of people voting, the BC Liberal government was re-elected. It's looking like the Advance Polling for this Provincial Election is going to be about the same, with the same result.

BTW BC Elections has a new computerized system in place. The DRO finds you on the voter's list and prints 2 labels. 1 label goes on the card that they mailed you, 1 label goes in the register of voter's book. You sign both labels. The political parties probably love this system. They get a list of everyone who has voted each day without having to have a Candidate Representative (Scrutineer) covering each polling station.

Since the political parties know who has already voted, they should be pulling hard each of the Advance Poll days. If they can't get the number of Advance Poll votes cast above 20% - it means the BC Liberals haven't got people mad enough to go out and vote them out.

In general, advance polling is relied on by parties more and more these days. If they find out they have a potential supporter, they then try to get that supporter to vote early, thus "locking in" that support - otherwise the voter might change their mind, or miss election day, or whatever. Since every voter votes only once, it is really of no consequence when they cast that vote, as long as it's in the box. Considering this, I would not be surprised if the people who vote earliest tend to be the ones that are the most committed partisans.
 
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rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
2,287
1,370
113
One thing I think is unfortunate is the way the tolls issue is being misused in this election.
The BC Liberals want to cap it; the NDP want to eliminate them. The Greens said something basically in support of tolls, but it was a lukewarm statement about making them more rational.

Speaking as someone who drives all over the place just to make a living, tolling sounds more brutal than it really is. The inadequacies of local transportation are costing everyone more than tolls would.

The BC Liberals fucked up big time by only putting tolls on 2 bridges (Port Mann and Golden Ears). People avoid those to avoid the toll, and it's wrecked New Westminster with extra traffic. Tolls are really an all-or-nothing concept - either you put it on all the major bridges, or you don't. Nobody enjoys them, but frankly, I don't see any better way to pay for all the bridge projects than this. All the other ideas are either sucking too much money from the wrong set of people, or else are foolish unworkable gimmicks. (For example: the public did not think giving Translink sales tax powers was a good idea - that is why the transit referendum failed. It was not people rejecting transit improvements, just rejecting a dumb idea.)

Anyways, the promises on this issue by the BC Liberals and NDP basically showed me that they are only short-term thinkers, telling people what they want to hear, instead of supporting what they need to have. What I want to see is realism. Realism is a harder thing to sell, but a better thing to do. I've driven for a living - and I don't mean just daily commuting - so to me, someone fucking these things up just to further their career is intolerable. :tsk:
 

Cock Throppled

Well-known member
Oct 1, 2003
4,974
888
113
Upstairs
Liberal supporters are like Trump supporters - Facts don't register past their set-in-stone beliefs. Nothing will persuade them they're supporting a corrupt party that is much more damaging to the economy than anything the NDP or any other party might do.

Beside bringing up irrelevant, and incorrect things from 20 years ago, while ignoring what the Libs are doing now, they also like to point to Alberta. But Alberta added 20,000 jobs in March and are predicted to have one of the strongest growth economies in 2017, while right wing Brad Wall next door is Sask shed 5,000 jbs in the same period.
 

Cock Throppled

Well-known member
Oct 1, 2003
4,974
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Upstairs
The problem with the tolls is they've always been unfairly applied just to those south of the Fraser River. A new highway to Whistler (what was than one, something like $6 billion when it was all finished?), a new bridge in , (ahem) Clark's fake riding, are untolled. If either party had any guts they'd lower the tolls on now, but apply them to all bridges built in the last 10 years, at least.
 

Har-Don

Member
Feb 16, 2009
259
22
18
The problem with the tolls is they've always been unfairly applied just to those south of the Fraser River. A new highway to Whistler (what was than one, something like $6 billion when it was all finished?), a new bridge in , (ahem) Clark's fake riding, are untolled. If either party had any guts they'd lower the tolls on now, but apply them to all bridges built in the last 10 years, at least.
I was wondering if anyone would bring up the Sea to Sky Hwy. There's tolls on that road too, they're just called shadow tolls because it's not coming straight from the end user, it's being funneled from government coffers. It's what should have been in place for the Golden Ears and Port Mann Bridge as well. The Sea to Sky Hwy is another of the 3P (Public Private Partnership) projects the Liberals are so fond of using. The Port Mann and Golden Ears bridges are 3P projects as well. We're locked into those contracts for the next 30+ years. It's why the NDP is so hazy on what they would do once they eliminate tolls. I don't think they can unless they move towards shadow tolls. The Liberals would need to as well if they go through with their $500 cap proposal. The fact of the matter is that the private companies made an investment in our infrastructure and they will need to get paid. They are getting paid to maintain those Hwys and bridges and they need to make a profit as well. They aren't doing it for altruistic reasons.
 

rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
2,287
1,370
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I don't know where the Golden Ears bridge it (who chose THAT name) but a toll on the Port Mann makes sense. You want speed, then use it. I just hope once the tolls pay for the bridge it's removed (like they did with tolls on the Coq).

I've lived in Toronto, Calgary and Edmonton. I am often amused at Vancouver residents who are pissed off at stuff like the Translink tax. I used to work downtown Toronto and use the TTC. It was a cluster fuck. But that's nothing compared to Calgary Transit. I lived on a major bus route that ran every 3 minutes. On super cold days good luck even getting on the bus. I just walked to work in -35C. The C Train is the epitome of worst piece of shit transit system ever. 30 year old cars, no AC, over crowded 10 stops from the core. Breakdowns happen all too frequently. I used to get on the C Train near the Stampede in Calgary to go to work. The platform was crusted in puke and piss & cleaned about once a year.

I don't like the gas tax in Vancouver. Going from 92 cents a litre to 1.37 is a bit of a shock. But, I had a serious car accident in Van and had to use the bus and skytrain system there. It's top notch. The only gripe I have with the road system is the 2 lane area Trans Canada out past Surrey. I drove home on a Friday and holy effing traffic jam to Whatcom Road. THAT needs to be widened.

The Golden Ears bridge crosses the Fraser River, and links Langley to Maple Ridge. It's actually the newest crossing - before that, the only way to get there was to cross the Port Mann and then go back across the Pitt River bridge, or go far to the east, to the Mission-Abbostford bridge.
There was also an old ferry called the Albion ferry, but it was ludicrously small, and was not a serious commuting option. Once the GEB was built, it was discontinued. (The new Port Mann bridge just replaced the old one.)

The next bridge really in need of an upgrade is the Pattullo bridge, which is too small and falling apart. After that, I would say Knight or Queensborough.
Instead, Corrupt Christy decided to replace the Massey Tunnel with a 10 lane bridge longer than the Port Mann; that was to please her donors from the coal and LNG industry, who want to berth larger ships upriver (at the N. Delta / Surrey Fraser docklands). If traffic between Steveston and Ladner (on the 99) was really the deciding issue, they could have just added another 2 or 4 lane tunnel adjacent to the old one - a cheaper and safer option. The sedimentary lowlands around that area are not ideal for a large bridge, which is why a tunnel was built on the first place. On top of this, they will have to pretty much destroy the river habitat to get this all done. Except for the mayor of Delta, all the rest oppose this project; it does not fit with any of the previous regional transportation plans.

But you know, it just proves that with this government, the wants of a half dozen carbon fuel lobbyists matter more than the needs of 1 or 2 million citizens.

https://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2017/02/...nmental-Planning-Disaster/?PageSpeed=noscript
 

rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
2,287
1,370
113
The problem with the tolls is they've always been unfairly applied just to those south of the Fraser River. A new highway to Whistler (what was than one, something like $6 billion when it was all finished?), a new bridge in , (ahem) Clark's fake riding, are untolled. If either party had any guts they'd lower the tolls on now, but apply them to all bridges built in the last 10 years, at least.
I disagree. I grew up on the north shore, where it's much less possible to live without crossing a bridge. But you know what? There used to be tolls on the Lions Gate. Look at cities like Sydney and New York - both harbour cities with big waterways to cross, and they have tolled crossings as well.

The thing that is unfair is the fact they stuck it only on two bridges, both coming out of north Surrey-Langley, and not any others. The idea - a political idea - was that only the users of the the new bridges would pay for them. It was a sop because the provincial government was gutless and wanted the revenues, but not the political flak of making people pay for something. Get something without having to pay for it? Pay for something without feeling like you're paying for something? This is thinking worthy of children, not adults - which I guess is what they think the voters are.

Well, I can tell you regardless of where these bridges are built, their indecisive decision is harming all of Metro Vancouver.

This means the tolls for those have to be higher than normal, and it squeezes the traffic towards the other bridges, instead of the new bridges that are supposed to improve things. People are suckers for a bargain - and I say suckers because it seems many of them would spend an extra $10 in fuel to save $5 in tolls. Time costs money too, and how much of that are people spending to avoid it? Truth is, if every major bridge was tolled, people would just suck it up and drive normally.

What also makes no sense to me is the fact they make cargo trucks pay 3 times more than a car - isn't that the traffic that needs to go places, as opposed to the commuters traveling alone, who have other options? (Well, if this government would provide those options !)

Anyways, like I said, the politicians in charge have been dancing around this issue for many years now, trying every scheme except what actually works. We need realism, not false promises from politicians who are afraid that voters would have a tantrum.
 

80watts

Well-known member
May 20, 2004
3,250
1,186
113
Victoria
Well all or nothing.
1. Put tolls on all bridges in lower mainland
2. Raise the PST
3 Raise the GST
4 Tax companies that deal with non renewable resources at 80%. Keep the principle and only draw off a % of the interest (Check the Norwegian Oil Fund - its over a trillion dollars)
5 Cut expenses:
a. If you can bitch and whine- you can answer a phone
b. If you can get your doctor to write you a letter explaining your disability- you have management skills
c. If you can write a letter bitching about the unfairness of policy - you have office secretarial skills
d. all the above mean you are employable, get off your lazy ass....
6 If there is a scandle involving tax money, the minister of the department, the senior civil servant of the department, the person writing the check and the company directors/CEO/President go to jail for a year plus a public whipping of 20 lashes ( this would be above and beyond whatever other punishment they recieve). Cause I'm tired of all the BS especially the "take from the poor(and middle class) and give to the rich".
7. note: Politicians only line their own pockets, not what is good for the public.
 

storm rider

Banned
Dec 6, 2008
2,543
7
0
Calgary
Alberta's economic woes stem from the collapse in the price of oil and gas. This is due to overproduction by the Saudis flooding the market to cripple Iran, and the US ramping up production of shale gas. It had absolutely nothing to do with the government in power in Alberta.
The NDP coming to power in 2015 in Alberta was a backlash against the Conservative government who were incapable of putting money aside for a rainy day when times were good, and also being unwilling to diversify the economy.
Alberta is actually looking to have the fastest growing economy in Canada for 2017, under the NDP government. It would, regardless of who was governing.
The problems in Alberta started when Ralph Klein got his nose out of joint over getting 62% on a leadership review.Under Klein the public sector unions were brought to heel and spending was cut and Alberta got out of debt.Ed Stelmach the dithering twit got the leadership nomination and it was downhill from there as the bureaucrats were then running things and the size of government jumped big time.One manager for every three provincial employees is nothing but bloated government waste.Next up was Alison "the red queen" Redford who was definatly no Conservitive,fuck she was nothing but an entitled socialist pig at the trough.Under her reign Alberta got more bureaucratic spending/waste and more debt.The poor ol Jim Prentiss got inherit the train wreck and he fucked up big time when he said "Albertans need to look in the mirror" as that lead to one thing and only one thing that got the NDP elected and that was a protest vote gone wrong.The next day Albertans collectively slapped their foreheads and said WHAT THE FUCK if the voted NDP(I voted Wild Rose) as they did not actually WANT an NDP government they wanted to send the PC's a message.In every riding the NDP won they won by the thinnest of margins and the WR and PC's split the conservative vote pretty much down the middle.At the same time in every riding the NDP's elections signs said Notley with the exception of high profile candidates such as that snaggle toothed Joe Cici and a few others.Albertans did not get to know the names of the true basket of deplorable candidates the NDP fielded...best example was the 26 year old Deb Dreaver...26 years old and in college since she was 18 and the only thing she was good at was racking up student debt.Within 24 hours after the election the NDP's webpage was wiped clear of all info on all the candidates.All it took for the NDP cronyism to start was 2 weeks when Notley hired 12 NDP party hacks from Vancouver and Toronto.People from outside of Alberta who have no interest in Alberta other than collecting their largesse and one of them is a convicted criminal and another idolizes the late Hugo Chavez whilst Notley has worn a Che Guevera watch in the legislature.Bring on the Carbon tax as well as the jacked up 20% corporate tax rate as well as the income tax increase.Throw on the newly created Oil Sands Advisory panel and the appointment to it of the nutcase Tzepporah Berman who is the founder of Forest Ethics a special interest group that has taken funding from the USA based Tides Foundation......call me Mr.Picky but I consider any Canadian that takes money from any foreign special interest group to work against the development of natural resources in Canada and thusly the economic development of Canada to be a fucking traitor.

Bit of a long rant here but I will end it with this.The NDP are a small step to the right of communism.They are fucking bleeding heart Socialists.Angry Tom the current leader of the Federal NDP lost a leadership review but he has not stepped down because he does not want to give up the extra money and with good cause as he is inept financially as he has remortgaged his home 10 times.The NDP stand for cronyism and kickbacks as well as sucking the collective dicks of public sector unions.Their mantra is "do as I say not as I do"....Joseph Stalin was of the same mindset only he had the option to send people off to the gulag or just had them executed.

I will end this rant with this........ Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery......Winston Churchill

SR
 

sdw

New member
Jul 14, 2005
2,189
0
0
In general, advance polling is relied on by parties more and more these days. If they find out they have a potential supporter, they then try to get that supporter to vote early, thus "locking in" that support - otherwise the voter might change their mind, or miss election day, or whatever. Since every voter votes only once, it is really of no consequence when they cast that vote, as long as it's in the box. Considering this, I would not be surprised if the people who vote earliest tend to be the ones that are the most committed partisans.
Exactly. Which is why it was clear that the Conservatives were going to be defeated in the last Federal Election. People vote governments out, a large Advance Poll turnout means that people want to "lock in" their vote and be free to work on the less committed voters on Election Day.

The Advance Polling was over 20% in the Federal Election. Judging from 2 days of Advance Polling in the Provincial Election - the Advance Polling for this Provincial Election is unlikely to exceed 10%.

Apathy, or "they're not that bad" is what re-elects the incumbent government.
 

storm rider

Banned
Dec 6, 2008
2,543
7
0
Calgary
Exactly. Which is why it was clear that the Conservatives were going to be defeated in the last Federal Election. People vote governments out, a large Advance Poll turnout means that people want to "lock in" their vote and be free to work on the less committed voters on Election Day.

The Advance Polling was over 20% in the Federal Election. Judging from 2 days of Advance Polling in the Provincial Election - the Advance Polling for this Provincial Election is unlikely to exceed 10%.

Apathy, or "they're not that bad" is what re-elects the incumbent government.
You Sir are an idiot....The silver spoon in his mouth dilletante Trudeau got elected because of ill-informed voters and also because the leftist media machine in Canada was pandering to him whilst at the same time crucifying Harper. Under Harper Canada came ou of the 2008 financial meltdown damn good.Sadly young idiots jumped on the Trudeau band wagon and elected an idiot who cant complete a sentence without saying "UM" at least 5 times.Justine Trudeau is a washed up substitute drama teacher that has never done a hard days work in his life.The only thing he is good for is selfies as he does not actually want to sit and answer questions in the Commons each day....though if he had to he would just show how brainless he is.

The last hustings consisted of the leftist media roasting the Conservatives over the coals over the Duffy trial but no mention was made about Mac Harb the Liberal senator whose disallowed expenses were more than Duffy/Brazeau/Wallin combined....Mac Harb got swept under the rug and the Leftist media got going.All through the hustings all Trudeau got was fluff and photo opportunities...............if a guy like me had go the chance to ask a non rhetorical question such as " If you from Government will you saddle Canadians with a carbon tax?".......cant be allowed to ask that question......nope.....just lots of rhetoric Liberal double speak and so on.

I pity BC if the NDP gets elected....and I pity Canada even more if he Shiney Poney gets re-elected.

SR
 

BaconNeggs

New member
Jan 13, 2017
267
4
0
BC Canada
This comment is pretty typical of the Trump-like Clark supporters, who just make things up and think if they say it, somebody might believe it.

Horgan never lost his temper that night, despite being goaded twice by Weaver.

The general concensus by most media, was Horgan or Weaver won the debate, but basically it was a draw.

Clark lies about almost everything, so why do people still support and believe her on any issue?
OMG thanks for the best laugh so far in my day!
 

Cock Throppled

Well-known member
Oct 1, 2003
4,974
888
113
Upstairs
OMG thanks for the best laugh so far in my day!
You're welcome, but I see not one person has come forward to explain why they believe a party, and a leader who have a history of lying, and just making things up, even when they are proven to be lies.

It defies logic, that people will put their beliefs ahead of facts. Kind of like the Trump effect, I guess, except in BC, where Clark continues to rely on gullibility to get votes.

I guess these are same people seeing Asian Sp ads and believing they're going to see the girl in the photos. Hope sprngs eternal, not matter how often you're let down.
 
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