WPS to be arranging meets?

JoeyD_01

Active member
Mar 11, 2014
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"Some of the tactics we use there is to put out our own ads and arrange some of these meets."

Is new WPS Chief Danny Smythe saying that there have been WPS stings in the city? Odd...I don't recall anything like that. This is from The Sun, so, who knows how much is fiction & how much is actually true.
Maybe the "ladies" who are "New to the city" are the undercover officers, or the ladies being used as bait?

http://m.winnipegsun.com/2016/12/06/winnipegs-sex-trade-increasingly-online
 

schneider

Member
Sep 17, 2004
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From the Free Press story:

"Smyth said police will likely be placing their own ads on one of the popular Internet sites that hosts most of the sex-trade activity — a modern twist on the traditional undercover operation.

"That’s not a new technique. We’ve done that on the street for years and years, but now we’re having to adapt and respond to the Internet."
 

JoeyD_01

Active member
Mar 11, 2014
416
39
28
From the Free Press story:

"Smyth said police will likely be placing their own ads on one of the popular Internet sites that hosts most of the sex-trade activity — a modern twist on the traditional undercover operation.

"That’s not a new technique. We’ve done that on the street for years and years, but now we’re having to adapt and respond to the Internet."
Wonder if they will use a known lady, in exchange for helping her out of the industry, to set up stings?
 

JoeyD_01

Active member
Mar 11, 2014
416
39
28
You don't think WPS knows about the websites? They know, you can be rest assured of it.
This is nothing new to them, they are just downplaying their having to get caught up with things online.
 

newman78

Member
Mar 13, 2008
30
1
8
its stand to reason that this could possibly happen. That being said with civic government cutting the money allocated to the WPS. With that being said to effectively run the department they have had to cut from their budget. I personally can't see it happening to soon. And it was mentioned above you might just have to stick with the reputable travelling and local SP's.
 

Jethro Bodine

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2009
4,441
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Beverly Hills. In the Kitchen eatin' vittles.
How can they even justify this.
Its not about doing good police work. It is about politics and optics.
It is a much more attractive story to portray themselves to the masses as the saviours of the exploited and downtrodden by busting some "Johns" rather than doing real police work. Notice they don't do stories on how it takes 3 days for a cop to show up when you've had a B&E. That story isn't "sexy" enough.
It is also a way to get more money from the politicians. One of the articles recently quoted a high ranking officer as saying their equipment is outdated and they can't keep up with the technology currently being used. So some street gal with a Grade 9 education and an I-phone can post an ad on BP but the WPS computers can't get on to BP? I call Bullshit!

Cheers
 

jgg

In the air again.
Apr 14, 2015
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The new WPS chief was on CBC The Current this morning. He does not use the terms sex trade workers and johns...they are exploited women/girls and and predators.
 

westwoody

Well-known member
Jun 10, 2004
7,392
6,437
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Westwood
WPS is robbing taxpayers.
The last administration bought them off with four new bunker style fortresses to replace the perfectly functional old stations. Four percent raises back to back. Nee cars, helicopter, 230 million on new HQ....they even got new wallet badges.

But no progress on any investigations into fire hall over runs, houses sold for ten dollars, taxpayer funded lunches at restaurants owned by elected officials.

Just keep looking the other way Danny, you are the biggest prostitute in Winnipeg.
 

DB Cooper57

commercial tourist
Aug 12, 2004
436
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On The Road
WPS is robbing taxpayers.
The last administration bought them off with four new bunker style fortresses to replace the perfectly functional old stations. Four percent raises back to back. Nee cars, helicopter, 230 million on new HQ....they even got new wallet badges.

But no progress on any investigations into fire hall over runs, houses sold for ten dollars, taxpayer funded lunches at restaurants owned by elected officials.

Just keep looking the other way Danny, you are the biggest prostitute in Winnipeg.
Let's not forget 300 grand for a fully armoured tactical vehicle which they use for.........
 

Jethro Bodine

Well-known member
Feb 17, 2009
4,441
1,799
113
Beverly Hills. In the Kitchen eatin' vittles.
Just keep looking the other way Danny, you are the biggest prostitute in Winnipeg.
The Chief of Police is not a cop but a politician. Everything they say is about optics and politics, not about crime prevention.

Years ago I knew a guy who was a Sargent in the Traffic Division when they were bringing in Photo Enforcement.
He adamantly argued against the Red Light/Speed Cameras at intersections becasue there was absolutely no data supporting the theory that they made these intersections safer. As well, he argued they were putting them not at high risk intersections but at high volume intersections (more cars = more violations = more money).
Lets just say that a short time later he was transferred out of the Traffic Division.

Cheers
 

jgg

In the air again.
Apr 14, 2015
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Nov 12, 2013
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The new WPS chief was on CBC The Current this morning. He does not use the terms sex trade workers and johns...they are exploited women/girls and and predators.
To be fair, the context of that programme was about missing and murdered indigenous women and girls, so in that sense, yes, he is looking for predators. I think we can take all these statements a couple of different ways, and assess how that statement helps him do his job, or not.

First, regardless of what they actually do, what they say they are doing has an impact on people's behaviour for good or ill. Under the current legal framework, in theory, yes, virtually every type of buyer is now a criminal, someone exploiting a person who, in theory, cannot be considered to have made a free choice. It's illogical, but leaving that aside, it's also impractical for them to prosecute every john they come across even when they do catch them "just after" or "just before" (it always was), but they're definitely out there stopping anyone that looks suspicious and making it known what can happen to them in the long run--and letting them go, generally. We only ever hear about anything when it involves minors or other "real" crimes. The more they remind people that they're out there, though, the more they patrol the streets, the more some people got the intended message and left the streets alone. A result, from the point of view that the streets may be a bit safer. So far so good, to the extent that I think the street can be a dangerous place for both sides. So then what?

Because the law is what it is, if they find they have succeeded in having a lot fewer workers on the streets, then unsurprisingly these workers must find another way to get that income. A lot of people expected they'd put themselves into even greater danger by going to more dangerous, isolated locations, but they still have to be able to find the buyer to get there and that's the point of interference, so, no, the most obvious way is to join the ranks of those who are already on the internet, thus muddying the waters: ten or fifteen years ago, if you were sophisticated enough to advertise on the internet, there was no way you could be confused with someone driven there by necessity (drugs, etc.) or exploited. Now anyone can do it, and does (hence all the complaining about Backpage). You have to have a website with all the bells and whistles to be considered a free agent or at least not a scam or con artist, though under the law, you never will be anything but exploited or a pimp--unless of course you're filming everything you do, in which case you're an artist and that is covered under freedom of expression, even in the USA (I'm surprised this has never come up as a glaring oversight in the law: if paying someone else to have sex with someone is illegal, why isn't porn illegal? Isn't profiting from the avails more or less the same as sale of the video?). If you're openly advertising 300 to 500 an hour on your site, they probably figure you are not someone who needs to be saved by them.

So much for theory. Do the police have the resources they need to set up their own ads? Yes. That's easy. They probably have been doing that for ages. But how many johns do they actually want to arrest and charge? I'm inclined to think what they really want is a big fish in the criminal sense, someone who is likely to intend harm on the worker, or at least someone who's been convicted of something before, even has a warrant for their arrest, possibly from another jurisdiction. So they're probably the ones asking for a picture, comparing it to mug shots and other known photos. More than likely they will string you along for a bit, find you are not interesting (especially if you refuse to send a photo, which, yeah, you should not), leave you alone and move on, unless they really have nothing else better to do. It's not practical to go after everyone online just as it's not on the street--but if you say you are doing that, it still has a chilling effect and fewer people will engage in the activity, which itself is a result from their point of view. Such are the times we live in. Speaking of sting operations, that's supposedly how they got the guy who is accused of Tina Fontaine's murder (in that case it's a Mr Big sting operation, which have been under fire for a while now as a form of entrapment, so it may be that case will fall apart in court).

There was something else talked about in that Current programme. The families don't like to hear about how their daughter or sister was in the sex trade, which is fair enough. But to the extent that this was an element of the missing lady's way of getting by, she came into contact with a lot of these so-called predators, and may have told them things that could be very useful in the pursuit of an investigation into the lady's whereabouts or indeed to finding her killer if such is the case. Some people, knowing how the law is, and hearing themselves described as predators, may not come forward even when they know something useful, because of statements like this. So while it saddens me on a personal level to hear us all described as predators, too, what concerns me even more is the knock on effect this has: cases going cold because someone is afraid to go to the police. I'm for sensitivity, but I'm also for solving cases and bringing real predators to justice. In the current climate, that's less likely to happen both because johns are afraid of being labelled predators and surviving family do not like labelling one of their own a sex worker. Why must it always come down to prejudicial labels getting in the way of justice, or progress?
 
Last edited:
Aug 10, 2015
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All this makes me nervous. If they're going to plan meets, posting reviews in other cities written by handles we don't recognize... I'm a nervous guy. Oh wait. I said that already
 

IBwell

Member
Jul 21, 2016
83
1
8
I'm not sure about the setting of meets, but the WPS is definitely checking on SPs to make sure they aren't being abused or are underage.

I saw a very well know SP a couple weeks ago that I have become pretty friendly with. She told me a few days previous she had an unannounced knock at her door. Two cops. They knew what she was doing and had no problem with it (the SP didn't deny anything). They showed her a few pictures to make sure she wasn't a suspected missing person, asked some general questions about her life in the business and went on their way.
 
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