Would like some opinions/advice from those with girfriends/wives

[rubytuesday]

So, first off, I apologize for entering your community and just want to say that I'm not trying to intrude or judge and you can troll me as much as you want, or give me your honest feedback. Hopefully, it'll be the latter.

My husband (who I have children with) has been seeing SPs about once a month in the middle of the night, usually after a night of drinking with friends.

When I found out, obviously, I was devastated (still am) and I just tried to be a better wife. And I know people probably may think that I must be fat, ugly, dumb and prude, but I'm not. I'm 30 but look 25 and I know that men check me out when I go out. From reading the reviews and real photos, I'd guess that physically, I definitely measure up to the standard SP or possibly the better-than-standard SP (I tend to have low self esteem), and I also offer greek and would be willing to rim/cof as those are the only things we haven't done in bed together. (I'm not sure rimming is his thing, but I'm very open.) I cook, I clean, I work, I give him the gfe and pse as much as I know how to. I can still make him laugh and we still have good conversations and hang out a lot together. I know he loves me. I don't think it's possible to fake the connection that we have. Please feel free to take my word for it or laugh in my face and refute any of this.. at this point, I can't tell if I'm totally deluded about the generally good state of our relationship or that he's really good at compartmentalizing.

So my questions...
1. Have any of you been in this situation? (ie. not busted or busted by a wife/girlfriend) Did you ever feel guilty?
2. What's the least uncomfortable way to confront him about this? I've tried to have the conversation very indirectly, but it hasn't produced any results.
3. Would you ever stop pooning for someone you love? See a couples counselor?

Thanks in advance. You are all gentlemen and scholars.

 

[the old maxx50]

I not married and no Gf so cant give to much on the topic other then . my own short
comings and some observations

But first i would like to ask some questions

How did you end up finding this site and thinking it a place to post.
And i wonder what problem you two have .. or what ones he has that makes him go off and see a escort one a month

It might be he just needs some one to talk to or he just not happy.. I know he not concidering you .

Yousually confronting them with it wont be the solution .unless you know why and he will really stop.

I have heard of a few instances where the wife has gone and become zn escort to just get even .
and others where the wife is ok with it and pick escorts fof thefe husbsn to see

Other thing is relationships get boged down in a rut of the everyday stuff . and makkng time for each other is not there.. If you can find that like what you had when you were dating maybe there is hope

It funny that i would allways beleave the couples i new were faith full .and then i here they are geting a
devorce after 10 or 20 yrs.. It is onlt since i have been involved with escorts that i think mlre about
how faith full guys are

 

[rubytuesday]

@lost-in-japan: Thank you very much. No, I'm not a troll, but what I meant was, feel free to troll me for being the pathetic weeping wife who does everything she can but leave. =P rubytuesday is not my nickname anywhere else, but he'd probably be able to guess it was me by the "way I write". As for reasons, it definitely can't be infrequent sex. If it's some kinky thing, I know I need to make him comfortable enough to share with me what it is and I try, but I don't really know what else to do.

@death or glory: lol.

@the old maxx50: To answer your questions, I have the phone numbers of the SPs (sidenote: I'm not the breed of psycho to call them) and so I ended up reading plenty of the perb-reviews of the services being offered and to be honest, it seemed pretty vanilla to me. I would never become an SP, because I think it would probably cause me to feel crappier about myself and I don't think I could choose SPs for him as I'd just be thinking "why not me".. so cliche. Hah. I understand what you mean about a rut and actually, I think both of us do and we make good successful efforts to maintain a strong connection. Infidelity happens between every single good (and bad) couple I know, so it aint a thang, but just gotta find a way to work it out!!

 

[deathreborn]

i'm old school, in that i view a married man seeing an sp as cheating. if as a guy you have a devoted, loving wife as you seem to be, then that guy should be 100% committed to that wife, not out banging some sp. trust me as a single guy i'd rather have the wife option, but my life does not lend itself to being able to have one, so sp's are my only option for any sort of female companionship.

 

[rubytuesday]

@Missy Mariposa: Thank you for your input. I appreciate it. Following up on what you said, would you still say it could be emotional if it's with different SPs? (I totally accept YES as an answer, but love insight on how it's possible if it is with different SPs and happens only after some drinks..)

@lost-in-japan: You're right, I do spend too much time thinking about what I can do when the issue probably isn't me. Thanks for the well wishes -the conversation will happen soon when I find the strength.

@deathreborn: I also see it as cheating. Really, anything that isn't consensual in the couple's agreement is cheating as far as I'm concerned. Thanks for your honesty.

 

[vancity_cowboy]

...or that he's really good at compartmentalizing.

actually you touched on a really good point there

generally, a guy can have affairs with escorts (or other women too) but not fall 'in love' with them. not the way they love their wife and family. they would never DREAM of wanting to spend the rest of their life having children with one of them

most women on the other hand, find it repugnant that their mate could have sex with another woman with whom he had NO emotional connection (women are from venus, men are from mars)

such is life

'couples counsellors' are rarely effective because they generally 'take sides' and the other partner can sense that in a second. emnities develop that scuttle the counselling process. don't get me wrong, there are very good counsellors out there, but they are as scarce as hen's teeth and you will burn up a lot of money before you find one, if ever

your husband will lie to you, plain and simple... deny, deny, deny... everybody does that when caught red-handed. get used to that fact and get over it if you want to proceed with him

he will also back-slide (see escorts after promising never to do so again), so get used to that too

if you want to keep him you are going to have to become like that person living with an alcoholic - picking them up, picking up after them, and constantly providing support no matter how many times they fall off the wagon

you are going to have to find the way of bringing up the subject. if you don't, and his habit gets out of control, he could easily make your lives a financial hell. get used to becoming involved in the family finances as well. make sure YOUR future, and the future of your children is looked after just in case things do go to hell in a handbasket

i don't know what will come of your particular situation, as every situation is different, but you seem by your posts to be an intelligent, forgiving, loving individual, and those three attributes are the most important in saving a relationship

as for sex, again i can't advise you there as i don't know how monogamous you are. alternatives could be swinging with him, seeing escorts with him, or just plain exploring some really kinky stuff with him. and possibly none of those will work

good luck

 

[sevenofnine]

You know,
I assume your still with him and love him now that you know.


So just ask him.

I am and old guy, and over the years women have told me they have performed every kind of sex for their husband and he still feels the need to look else where. So don't assume its you or your fault.
I mean its not even if you were fat and ugly, you shouldn't assume its your fault.

There is no right or wrong or blame to go around,
your choice I think is to stay or go, give him the ultimatim stop or I will leave or put up with it.
And I think there is no right or wrong, just some men never have enough or need to wander, it most likely will never change, even if he says he will i wouldn't trust him, he lied to you he will again, so don't believe him if he tells you he will stop,

I am married, i see and sp, have for ten years, one of the things i told her is don't trust me.
i lie every time i see her to my wife and kid, so assume i can lie to you.

my wife and me don't have sex haven't for like fifteen years or so. that is why i see an sp.
i don't think i would see an sp if my wife would have sex with me, but well she isn't.

i see an sp but always come home to my wife, even though the two women i have seen have told me i don't have to leave.
so i would assume your man will always come home to you as well, but its only an assumption.

would i stop pooning yes.
but my wife pretty much decided for the both of us we were never going to have sex again, that sort of pissed me off,
if she would have talked to me and gave me the option and said she loved me but would understand if i needed to go outside my married, you know i might not have seen an sp,
but she didn't.

would i see a marriage or couples councillar no,
because im not the one that stopped having sex.

be honest and sincere speak from your heart,
and tell him, if your going to leave if he continues. tell him how much your hurt,
honestly open up and pour your heart out to him, and see how he responds, does he respond in kindness or is hurtful to you, does he blame you,
judge him is he kind and gentle to you, or just blames you,

and again, don't assume or don't look at his words. try to see into his heart.
that is where you will find the answer, in his heart and soul not in the words that come out of his mouth.

 

[Alix Turner]

why are you using the handle of a vancouver based youtube guru that doesnt have any kids and isn't married?

 

[rubytuesday]

Creepy psycho stalker question for anyone: Are 2 phonecalls, a few minutes apart, each lasting 1 minute seem like protocol SP booking? Again, thanks in advance for any PMs and replies.

@vancity_cowboy: You're right. I'm a pretty intelligent person, and forgiving and loving to a fault. I hope that he knows this too, that any shame or embarrassment or problems he's got with me, I'm a stand up person who will take responsibility for what I can and be there, not to judge, but to love unconditionally. Sounds lame, but it's true. I wish there were a way for him to truly know this with all his heart so that he wouldn't feel like he needs to do this.

@PeaceGuy and Alix Turner: Lol, kind of amusing that I chose such a handle. There's no rhyme or reason to it.

@sevenofnine: Thank you. I'm going to PM you.

@Hatrick: Thank you. A part of me knows it's not my fault, but I try and deny it because I just wish so badly that there were something -ANYTHING- I could do to make this situation better for both of us.

 

[Tugela]

So, first off, I apologize for entering your community and just want to say that I'm not trying to intrude or judge and you can troll me as much as you want, or give me your honest feedback. Hopefully, it'll be the latter.

My husband (who I have children with) has been seeing SPs about once a month in the middle of the night, usually after a night of drinking with friends.

When I found out, obviously, I was devastated (still am) and I just tried to be a better wife. And I know people probably may think that I must be fat, ugly, dumb and prude, but I'm not. I'm 30 but look 25 and I know that men check me out when I go out. From reading the reviews and real photos, I'd guess that physically, I definitely measure up to the standard SP or possibly the better-than-standard SP (I tend to have low self esteem), and I also offer greek and would be willing to rim/cof as those are the only things we haven't done in bed together. (I'm not sure rimming is his thing, but I'm very open.) I cook, I clean, I work, I give him the gfe and pse as much as I know how to. I can still make him laugh and we still have good conversations and hang out a lot together. I know he loves me. I don't think it's possible to fake the connection that we have. Please feel free to take my word for it or laugh in my face and refute any of this.. at this point, I can't tell if I'm totally deluded about the generally good state of our relationship or that he's really good at compartmentalizing.

So my questions...
1. Have any of you been in this situation? (ie. not busted or busted by a wife/girlfriend) Did you ever feel guilty?
2. What's the least uncomfortable way to confront him about this? I've tried to have the conversation very indirectly, but it hasn't produced any results.
3. Would you ever stop pooning for someone you love? See a couples counselor?

Thanks in advance. You are all gentlemen and scholars.

It is pretty simple, he doesn't love you. Maybe he did once, but not any more and now it is too inconvienent to split for whatever reason. That doesn't mean he doesn't get along with you, or isn't friends, he just doesn't love you.

If he did, he would not do those things. And if he felt the urge to, he would make the sacrifice and not give in to those urges because you and your feelings would take priority. It is an element of self sacrifice. In a sound relationship both parties would be doing this for each other. But, in your case, it sounds like you are but he is not.

He knows what the rules are, he knew them when he got married to you, but now he doesn't care any more. There is a message in there.

If it continues then it will result in you becoming very unhappy and eventually bitter. Once that happens whatever remains of the relationship will be poisoned and things will become ugly and unpleasant. That is something to think about if you have children. It is better to deal with this amicably now than to invoke the nuclear option 10 years down the road, because it is not going to stop or get better.

You need to remember that marriage is not about you satisfying him, it is about the two of you satisfying each other, and it sounds like he has lost sight of that.

 

[PlayfulAlex]

@Hatrick: Thank you. A part of me knows it`s not my fault, but I try and deny it because I just wish so badly that there were something -ANYTHING- I could do to make this situation better for both of us.

As the guys have been saying, chances are very good that your husband`s choice of activity has nothing to do with his feelings of love for you, or his commitment to you and the family you`ve created together. You pegged it when you mentioned the ability to `compartmentalize`...

Having said that, I would venture to say that your thread isn`t really about that. What it`s about has everything to do with your feelings about this activity taking place within the confines of the relationship you thought you had. In other words, you thought you had a committed monogamous relationship, and have come to find out that that`s not the case. Although it`s very possible to have a committed non-monogamous relationship, and this thread may evolve to that over time.

Anyway, back to my point. It sounds like your concerns should be about you, your feelings, your reactions to this news. Does this new information shatter your notions of what you thought the two of you had? Because you`re never going to get to the bottom of it, if you don`t discuss it with him.

Probably the best thread going right now is the thread about honesty between the sexes. https://perb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?181707-Honesty-between-the-sexes-how-much-of-it-is-feasible It is very difficult for most couples to have the honest discussion about what each of them wants the relationship to look like. Add to that, the fact that things can change, and what you thought you wanted at one point, maybe you realize you no longer want, or it just never turned out the way you were thinking it was going to.

In other words, you`re clearly thinking really deeply about this and, in all fairness, you are doing a great job of compartmentalizing yourself. How do we know this? Because, when hubby walks in the door, you say `Hi dear, how was your day, the kids were this, the school was that...blah blah blah`. When, what you`re screaming inside is, `OMFG I need to talk to you about the ladies you`ve been fucking when you`re out with the guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!`

So, what to do?

Can you stand the honest discussion that will ensue, once you broach the subject? Never mind the divorce talk, that is a long way off, if ever. Do you need to know what`s going on with him, can you see yourself engaging in the long conversation ahead? It may be deep, it may be long, there may be tears, there may be yelling.

It sounds like you expected monogamy, and it sounds like you were offered that. But think about this really carefully before you do any accusing. Were you really promised monogamy, or can you think back to the initial discussions...did you really make your needs and expectations clear, or did you make a lot of assumptions? Such as, well, if he loves me, that must mean he`s only going to fuck me...and did you, like most couples, NOT actually have `the talk` at all? Did you really discuss your (both of your) sexual preferences, your sexual expectations, your sexual limits, or your sexual needs?

Now that you`ve got this information, however it was gleaned, it might be best for you to have a serious talk with yourself first. What are you prepared to do, what are you prepared to offer, what are you prepared to ask for (insist on)? And, if your requests are not complied with, what actions are you prepared to take?

If you threaten to leave, will he comply? Or will he comply for a while? Or will he pretend to comply to appease you?

Or can you accept his dalliances and not leave, if you receive the assurance you need that sex is not love, and that his having sex with other women has nothing to do with his love for you? After all, they are not emotional love-affairs, they`re sex dates with paid sexual companions...

Or do you absolutely, positively require monogamy? After all, you deserve to be happy in your life, as does he, so you should also go for what you want in your life and in your closest relationship.

P.S. You must know by now (since you seem to know a thing or two about perb) that you are gonna get a hundred different opinions here, and they`ll likely be quite contradictory!

 

[PlayfulAlex]

It is pretty simple, he doesn't love you. Maybe he did once, but not any more and now it is too inconvienent to split for whatever reason. That doesn't mean he doesn't get along with you, or isn't friends, he just doesn't love you.

If he did, he would not do those things. And if he felt the urge to, he would make the sacrifice and not give in to those urges because you and your feelings would take priority. It is an element of self sacrifice. In a sound relationship both parties would be doing this for each other. But, in your case, it sounds like you are but he is not.

He knows what the rules are, he knew them when he got married to you, but now he doesn't care any more. There is a message in there.

If it continues then it will result in you becoming very unhappy and eventually bitter. Once that happens whatever remains of the relationship will be poisoned and things will become ugly and unpleasant. That is something to think about if you have children. It is better to deal with this amicably now than to invoke the nuclear option 10 years down the road, because it is not going to stop or get better.

You need to remember that marriage is not about you satisfying him, it is about the two of you satisfying each other, and it sounds like he has lost sight of that.

Wow wow wow...you must be practically the only guy that thinks like this. Or you're a single guy, with starry-eyed notions of someday meeting the perfect, wonderful, soul-mate of a gorgeous woman, whom you'll marry and live happily ever after with.

Do I sound jaded? :nod:

Do you wanna get married?

 

[chilli]

It is pretty simple, he doesn't love you. Maybe he did once, but not any more and now it is too inconvienent to split for whatever reason. That doesn't mean he doesn't get along with you, or isn't friends, he just doesn't love you.

If he did, he would not do those things. And if he felt the urge to, he would make the sacrifice and not give in to those urges because you and your feelings would take priority. It is an element of self sacrifice. In a sound relationship both parties would be doing this for each other. But, in your case, it sounds like you are but he is not.

He knows what the rules are, he knew them when he got married to you, but now he doesn't care any more. There is a message in there.

If it continues then it will result in you becoming very unhappy and eventually bitter. Once that happens whatever remains of the relationship will be poisoned and things will become ugly and unpleasant. That is something to think about if you have children. It is better to deal with this amicably now than to invoke the nuclear option 10 years down the road, because it is not going to stop or get better.

You need to remember that marriage is not about you satisfying him, it is about the two of you satisfying each other, and it sounds like he has lost sight of that.

This.

You're married to a guy who weighed the risks and decided that losing you is acceptable. Every man who cheats knows that if they get caught there's a chance they will lose their SO. He's thought about it, he's weighed the risks and he's doing it anyway.

That's all you need to know; everything else is bullshit.

Sex for me has always been a hundred times better with someone I share a deep bond with.

Don't let anyone kid you on this board that sex is better with an escort.

Maybe it's "different"; maybe they like the variety, but it's rarely "better".... or maybe I just have impossibly high standards.

 

[PlayfulAlex]

This.

You're married to a guy who weighed the risks and decided that losing you is acceptable. Every man who cheats knows that if they get caught there's a chance they will lose their SO. He's thought about it, he's weighed the risks and he's doing it anyway.

That's all you need to know; everything else is bullshit.

Sex for me has always been a hundred times better with someone I share a deep bond with.

Don't let anyone kid you on this board that sex is better with an escort.

Maybe it's "different"; maybe they like the variety, but it's rarely "better".... or maybe I just have impossibly high standards.

OMG...this is awesome. I'm just about ready to make another marriage proposal..

 

[rubytuesday]

This.

You're married to a guy who weighed the risks and decided that losing you is acceptable. Every man who cheats knows that if they get caught there's a chance they will lose their SO. He's thought about it, he's weighed the risks and he's doing it anyway.

That's all you need to know; everything else is bullshit.

Sex for me has always been a hundred times better with someone I share a deep bond with.

Don't let anyone kid you on this board that sex is better with an escort.

Maybe it's "different"; maybe they like the variety, but it's rarely "better".... or maybe I just have impossibly high standards.

Chilli, it's funny how hearing things from strangers with no obligation towards my feelings can make me feel better and confirm what I believe (about good sex) is true.

..sorry for the long strange grammar of that sentence..

 

[visiting]

Dam I love being single.....

 

[rubytuesday]

@cuteangie

Thanks so much for your reply. It's crossed my mind but I'm just not that breed of crazy. I have been tempted to offer different SPs $$$ to identify my husband in a row of pictures just to confirm that he wasn't simply making phone calls, that he was actually seeing them, but felt that was too crazy and likely that I wouldn't get a reply. But mainly because I agree with you, talk to my husband.

I've never really felt that there was anything wrong with what SPs are doing, as long as they are doing it willingly. I guess it just sucks for me not having any control over the situation and being unfairly left in the dark. (Someone cry me a river!)

 

[diamondd5243]

I do feel for you rubytuesday.. it definitely wouldn't feel good if I was in your shoes.

As a man, I personally lean on the compartmentalizing side. I do believe it is possible to love someone and fuck others (sucks I know), and yes it is definitely better to make love to a loved one, but us guys are hardwired to spread our seed with many women. Ask any man and they when given the choice, he will choose variety over one-itis.

I commend any man that stays faithful especially those who have access to other women, as pooners do. But doesn't mean I'm not in love with my partner.

 

[Sucre]

Its long and convoluted but this happened when I was much younger and naïve; After this girl flirted with me, she was not an escort. I was flattered and took her out and made love that night. I then thinking she was sort of nice without thinking, asked her the question that should never be asked. How many guy have you had sex with before me, prefacing it with the answer does not matter. Her answer was I stopped counting at age 21 when I reached 60 guys. She was 27 and I never saw her again. (yes men care too) Proper etiquette is do not ask, proper answer if asked is lie, lie, lie with a vague or low number. (unless it is true that he/she is your first) I refuse to tell you or how dare you ask me is defensive and indicates a large number and also ends the relationship.

Being married or having a committed relationship and confronting him as some have advised has no good solution. If he cares about you and he wants to keep you, he will lies to you about it. He knows that even if you corner him with the fact know he has been seeing a SP, even if caught red handed he must lie to keep, you so he will lie. And a just be honest speech from you, that you don’t care the answer you just want to understand speech, will also require a lie from him. The exception will be if he does not give a dam about you and wants the relationship to end. So in fact best not to confront him at all if you want a relationship. And he has run this scenario in his head so many times that he himself cannot honestly tell you why he does it.

Looking at the noble families of the world in the past, a good mistress kept the family together rather than the other way. One man and one wife is biblical in origin, but even king David from the old testament had many wives. So it is not new and not unique that a man would cheat on his wife. There are many books and many theories on why and if it healthy or catastrophic

For me it started because we stopped having sex and I was amazed that young woman still found me attractive as I aged and became twice the age of the girls (remember the lie lie lie works on me too) and for such a little amount of money would share intamacy –they gave me a confidence in myself that I began to lack as I aged. I however largely preferred massage girls as they could be seduced so easy at very little cost and they did all the work and my sexual ability as I aged would not be called into question and I am afraid 60 is a low number for a SP. Far better a paid encounter if you can afford it, than an unpaid affair which leads to the end of relationships. I suspect he loves you and appreciates you and it is his shortcomings he needs stroked and sometimes fresh lies from a paid SP, work better than alternatives.

Solutions
1 ignore it, look other way; it only happens once a month when drunk so he has no intention of running off; most likely variety – as you have heard before – even a man who is served steak everyday, sometimes wants hamburger for a change of pace –

2.; say honey I am getting bored with our sex life, (even I f you are not) is there anything you would like to spice it up; followed by asking him if he would like to experiment with different positions, different holes, spankings, threesomes etc. if he would like to see a SP for a change of pace – he will be confused and may even confess that her has already tried one or tell you what sexual adventures he wants to try (thus the reason for his trysts) / this may even allow an opportunity to lay out groundrules for future encounters
3 hang out with him more, more diners out, make sure you are is best friend as well as his wife and lover; maybe you can even attend his drinking parties, as hanging out with too often with groups of all men at pubs excluding you leads to separate friendships weakening your bonds and men alone talk of sex and sometimes that leads further – if his friends are your friends that you invite to diner occasionally they less likely to lead him astray

 

[HankQuinlan]

Dan Savage has dealt with this and similar issues many times in his column, and is likely the best advice columnist out there today. He believes honesty is the only way to live in relationships; he also believes in compromise and forgiveness. I would google his columns and read through them. This is an article about his views that covers some basics:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/03/magazine/infidelity-will-keep-us-together.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0