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Uncle Sam doesn't love us after all

Makhno

Recidivist
Nov 11, 2003
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Beyond the Pale
Far from it. It seems that Canada is regarded by the modern day Romans as

"North America's attic, a mildewy recess that adds little value to the house, but serves as an excellent dead space for stashing Nazi war criminals, drawing-room socialists and hockey goons,"​
and its inhabitants are

"a docile, Zamboni-driving people who subsist on seal casserole and Molson"​
whose hobbies include

"wearing flannel, obsessing over American hegemony, exporting deadly mad cow disease and even deadlier Gordon Lightfoot and Nickelback albums."​

No neighbourly love in U.S. view of Canada
Media portrays us as 'great white waste of time'


Cristin Schmitz
CanWest News Service
March 28, 2005


OTTAWA -- Canada is a "great white waste of time" whose "docile, Zamboni-driving," Molson-sucking citizens consume seal casseroles as they export terrorism, mad cow disease, "and even deadlier Gordon Lightfoot and Nickelback albums" to the United States, American media reports suggested last week.

The unflattering composite portrait, only partly satirical, emerges from stories in influential U.S. media outlets this past week when Canuck-bashing arguably reached new lows before the summit last Wednesday of President George W. Bush, Prime Minister Paul Martin and Mexican President Vicente Fox in Crawford, Texas.

Most serious, perhaps, was the New York Times editorial a week ago in which the newspaper repeated unproven, but persistent, allegations that terrorists in Canada routinely slip into the U.S. through a porous border.

"Suspected terrorists have long been entering the country from Canada," asserted the Times, calling it "shocking ... how little progress has been made in securing our borders."

Canada's ambassador to the U.S., Frank McKenna, fired off a strong letter to the editor that was published in the Times Saturday.

"The ambassador is very keen on having these sorts of issues ... responded to within the news cycle," Bernard Etzinger, a spokesman for the Canadian Embassy in Washington said Sunday.

"He said we should answer the editorial and state the facts about the security relationship."

In his letter, McKenna pointed out that in late 2001, then-U.S. attorney general John Ashcroft acknowledged that none of the Sept. 11 hijackers entered the U.S. through Canada -- a fact acknowledged by the editorial.

"Since then, our two countries have implemented a 'smart border action plan' as well as national security policies, including almost $10 billion in security investments and the creation of a department similar to the Department of Homeland Security, that help keep North America closed to terrorists and open for business," McKenna wrote.

Concluded McKenna: "In open societies such as ours, we all know that no security arrangement can be 100 per cent effective. But between Canada and the United States, the record is clear: our co-operation has reduced the threat of terrorism in both our countries."

The New York Times also ran a story March 23 by its Canadian correspondent, Clifford Krauss, headlined "Canada May be a Close Neighbour, but it Proudly Keeps Its Distance." The story notes that "with the possible exception of France," a nation known for its anti-U.S. sentiment, "no traditional ally has been more consistently at odds with the United States than has Canada." The story recited a litany of Canada/U.S. disagreements since the Second World War.

They ran the gamut from Canada's refusal to fully back the late U.S. president John F. Kennedy during the Cuban missile crisis, to the welcome of U.S. draft dodgers during the Vietnam war, to the Liberals' present refusal to sign on to the U.S. ballistic missile defence shield and Canada's push for the International Criminal Court and the Kyoto climate control accord -- which are both opposed by the Bush administration.

Then last Monday there was an eyebrow-raising cover story on Canada in the Weekly Standard, a Washington-based conservative magazine that is considered a must-read publication for those inside America's beltway.

The magazine's contributing editors include Canadian David Frum and U.S. political commentator and humourist P.J. Rourke.

In "Welcome to Canada: The Great White Waste of Time," senior writer Matt Labash observes that most Americans -- when they think of Canada at all -- regard it "as North America's attic, a mildewy recess that adds little value to the house, but serves as an excellent dead space for stashing Nazi war criminals, drawing-room socialists and hockey goons."

Canadians delude themselves that they are a "superior race" but Americans see them as "a docile, Zamboni-driving people who subsist on seal casserole and Molson," writes Labash.

"Their hobbies include wearing flannel, obsessing over American hegemony, exporting deadly mad cow disease and even deadlier Gordon Lightfoot and Nickelback albums."

He adds: "You can tell a lot about a nation's mediocrity index by learning that they invented synchronized swimming. Even more so by the fact that they are proud of it."

Etzinger dismissed the Weekly Standard's story as "an ideological rant" that doesn't represent American mainstream views.

"I think we are great friends. What a few people say on the extremes of either side of the political spectrum don't represent what the vast majority of Americans have to say."

He acknowledged that the New York Times editorial was a serious matter for Canada.

"The bottom line is that it's important for us to dispel what myths may remain, and to reinforce Canada's image in the United States, not just as a security partner.

"Our message is that we are a country that is under threat. We are a country that has in fact responded to that threat, and we are partners in fighting that threat. And I think oftentimes that doesn't immediately come to (the American) mind."
For a first hand look at the Weekly Standard chest-thumping rant (which, by the way, was written in Vancouver) referred to above, click here.

 

LonelyGhost

Telefunkin
Apr 26, 2004
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the worst thing about all of this is that the more we have business-politicians pandering to the US in the hopes of becoming rich the worst the rantings from those butt-head yanks gets ...

here's some news for the entrepreneurs out there: fuck off! if you don't like Canada then move to the US and stop fucking with our country just so you can get rich. no one asked you to pander to those nazis so you can sell some shit you had made by communists in China.

and if they don't like our canadian talent, then ship them home: there's a long list ... and i'm sure Regis will do real good at hosting Jeopardy!
 

rickoshadows

Just another member!
May 11, 2002
902
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Vancouver Island
HankQuinlan said:
There's only one thing a good Canadian can do when faced with criticism: say "Sorry!" automatically.
It drives them nuts!

rickoshadows
 

luckydog71

Active member
Oct 26, 2003
1,117
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Texas Pete is a good example of an uneducated person taking a few facts and then arriving at ridiculous conclusions based on those facts.

From his point of view -
Some terrorists were caught entering the US from Canada in 1999.
Therefore all terrorists must enter the US through Canada.

Canada did not support the Iraq war.
Therefore Canada is no longer an ally and has the same status as France.

Canada does not support Star wars
Therefore Canada does not want the US to be able to defend itself from attack.

There are a few people just as uneducated north of 49 and they also arrive at ridiculous conclusions.

The US invaded Iraq because of WMD
No WMD were found
Therefore Bush lied to the world.

A few soldiers mistreated (or worse) some prisoners in Iraq.
Therefore Bush supports torture.

The words are heating up on both sides and they are being fueled by people who put forward their assumptions as fact.

I have no quarrel with people who have honest disagreement and support their position with logic. But there are a few people from both counties who just spew their hate and ignorance. They have no interests in a discussion.

Both countries will suffer if cooler head
 

therealrex

HUH?
May 19, 2004
929
1
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luckydog71 said:
A few soldiers mistreated (or worse) some prisoners in Iraq.
Therefore Bush supports torture.
Although I agree with your point about both sides spouting rhetoric and not interested in debating the facts but the facts are that Bush does support torture there is lots of proof that prisoners were transported to countries like Pakistan and Egypt from Guantanamo to be tortured.

It is possible that Bush believed there were WMD's in Iraq but he definitely lied to the world when he had Colin Powell give a speech at the UN saying there were links between Saddam and Al Quaida so he did lie to the world about the links to Al Quaida but its possible he is merely a fool for his beliefs in WMDs
 

rickoshadows

Just another member!
May 11, 2002
902
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65
Vancouver Island
luckydog71 said:
A few soldiers mistreated (or worse) some prisoners in Iraq.
Therefore Bush supports torture.
While the US does not support torture, they are not above using the security apparatus of regimes that do, ie. Syria. It is not just inmates of Guantanamo Bay, US agencies have deported Canadian citizens to Syria for "interrogation" Unfortunately, it appears that our much vaunted RCMP were complicit in this. Inquiries into this have been stonewalled and no one seems to care all that much. On both sides of the border, citizens are giving up to much freedom in the name of "security". Pretty soon the freedoms we have left won't be worth defending!

rickoshadows
 

timec98

Banned
Mar 5, 2005
84
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0
luckydog71 said:
The US invaded Iraq because of WMD
No WMD were found Therefore Bush lied to the world.

...fueled by people who put forward their assumptions as fact.
luckydog, Bush, as the figure head, did what? If WMD wasn't true, what was it --- not a lie? Then perhaps an assumption put forward as fact. Any old excuse will do - in the name of "American freedom".

Accountability, luckydog --- accountability.

.
 

felix29

Member
Mar 26, 2004
150
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The WMD in Iraq was basically a lie, if I recall correctly Douglas Feith an upper member of the Bush administration opened an office in the CIA that was used specifically to pick and choose only the information that the CIA had that supported any claim of WMD. They totally rejected any ( and there was plenty ) information that would negatively affect their claims of WMD
 

bobsled

Member
Sep 25, 2002
283
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Vancouver
Re: Texas Pete...

OMG...What have I done?

I started all this. The Pen is mightier than the Sword.

Looks like Makhno found Texas Pete's article that he plagorized for his own.

Through the travail of the ages,
Midst the pomp and toil of war,
Have I fought and strove and perished
Countless times upon this star.

So as through a glass, and darkly
The age long strife I see
Where I fought in many guises,
Many names, -- but always me.

This board is about the pursuit of human contact,affection,snuggling, and being friends...Not discussing War. I thought Pete's words were rather harsh and unfounded. And it bothered me. Perb is not a battle ground. I'm sorry, I think this was my fault we got off track. Forgive me. I think the girls from Houston are super duper cute. So there.

Later,
bobsled.
PS
All you need is Love.
 

Makhno

Recidivist
Nov 11, 2003
696
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Beyond the Pale
bobsled said:
OMG...What have I done?
Looks like Makhno found Texas Pete's article that he plagorized for his own.
Who the hell is Texas Pete and what exactly did I "plagorize" [sic]? :confused: :confused:

The article I posted is based largely on an article by Matt Labash in the Weekly Standard, an editorial in the New York Times and an article in the New York Times by Clifford Krauss. Is Texas Pete an editorial writer at the New York Times?? :confused:

 

Fotura

Member
Nov 29, 2003
120
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Surrey
I say let the US go as they are. At this rate the country will quickly die off and then we won't have to worry.

We already supply them with fresh water and they don't produce enough of their own oil. We can just sit back and be patient Canadians until their ranting changes to crying then we'll see what happens.
 

sirlickheralot

Gold Member
Mar 10, 2003
1,267
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Vancouver
bobsled said:
OMG...What have I done?

I started all this. The Pen is mightier than the Sword.

Looks like Makhno found Texas Pete's article that he plagorized for his own.
Actually Makhno didn't commit plagiarism since he posted the article thereby crediting the original author, perhaps he could be accused of copyright infringment.

Texas Pete is the one who committed plagiarism since he posted the North American Attic comment in his post without giving credit to the original author or without even using quotation marks thereby giving the impression that this quote was his own. Perhaps you should go give Texas Pete S**T. Not only is he an ignorant redneck but he's a thief.
 

niteowl

Member
Jun 29, 2004
913
1
18
Burnaby
So let's break this down:

When Sept 11,2001 happened they said the terrorists entered through Canada. OK. but who let them in? Who taught them to fly planes?

When the F.B.I five were caught in New York, they said they entered through Canada. Again who let them in?

When the East Coast of North America had a major black out the mayor of New York blamed it on Canada but when it was revealed that it orginated in Ohio did he apologise?

It's funny how we are labelled as Zamboni drivers when in fact the machine was originally made by the Zamboni family in California.

Did you know that bin laden's first name is really spelled USama and not OSama?
 

Gruss-ly

Up standing member
Jul 15, 2004
140
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YVR
www.awpi.com
!

Fotura said:
I say let the US go as they are. At this rate the country will quickly die off and then we won't have to worry.

We already supply them with fresh water and they don't produce enough of their own oil. We can just sit back and be patient Canadians until their ranting changes to crying then we'll see what happens.

As the U.S.A goes so go we.... believe it! Our future and fortune as sovereign Canadians is tied inexorably to the U.S.A. and her fortunes. That is the current political/economic relationship between our two countries. So you and I had better be "worried" about the US "dying off" and hoping to bloody HE double hockey sticks that it doesn't happen.
 

luckydog71

Active member
Oct 26, 2003
1,117
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Washington State
Frisky_uke there are a growing number of Canadians who feel the same way you do about the US and there are a growing number of Americans who feel like Texas Pete (or who ever it was that said it). I sure hope your small group of Americans and Canadians does not grow beyond the radicals. The more rational thinkers have differences of opinion and this even evolves into the occasional flare up. But we work it out and move on. If the hatred your group has works its way into the general population of Canada and the US both countries suffer.

You are right the US relies heavily on Canada for its supply of natural resources. The US also benefits from having a politically stable country as a neighbor.

On the other side of the coin, Canada is 100 miles wide and 5000 miles long.

Your main channel of distribution comes from the US. The cost of your goods would be much higher if you did not utilize the US distribution channels.

The defense of a country that shape is enormous and that is only if you don't bother to defend the territory that lies north of the 100 mile swath.

Canada without the US as an ally would have the same chance of economic survival that Quebec would have if it was on its own.

The US without Canada would have serious economic problems and would like trigger a global recession.

But the Alliance of American/Canadian who wants to foster hate would rejoice as both countries sink into recessions that would make the 1930’s look like boom years.
 

The Lizard King

New member
Jul 8, 2003
1,272
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Fuck 'em. Canada's an independent country and we should be trading more with the rest of the world but our politicians, and of course our unavoidable close proximity to the U.S., are major reasons why we've become too reliant on America economically. I don't blame, though I dislike and resent, the U.S. for their attitude towards Canada. Canadians should back up what they say if they want to make a difference. Attend meetings in your constituency and demand that your local MLA supports more diverse trading policies which would leave us less vulnerable to the U.S. Though realistically they will always be our largest trading partners, there’s a gap that must be filled. Also make sure you buy Canadian made products from Canadian retailers such as Save-On Foods, Rona, The Brick and London Drugs and don't shop at Safeway, Future Shop/Best Buy, Sears, Wallmart, and Home Depot. If you play the market, only invest in Canadian companies. Canadians, as I do as a consumer, should put up or shut the fuck up.
 

luckydog71

Active member
Oct 26, 2003
1,117
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Frisky_uke – thanks for explaining your position, I did read it differently than you intended.

You have every reason to be a proud Canadian. Canada is a strong independent country with an elephant for a neighbor. The US has a huge influence on your culture, and your economy. In spite of our very close ties, Canada is favorably viewed by the world and has great potential as peace makers and peace keepers. It is my opinion that this potential is under utilized by Canadians.

I am glad to learn that you are not one of the small but growing group of Canadians and Americans whose heated statements towards each other is hurting both countries.

It is my opinion we do not have to agree to be good neighbors. What is required is that we respect the opinion of each other, even when we have such opposing views. I do not mind being told I am wrong. I don’t mind when I hear very adamant arguments pointing out the errors we have made. Often I have a different opinion and will fire back my position.

So feel free to stand up and take your best shot, you should expect return fire. In the end it is highly unlikely that anyone will have a different opinion, but if we leave a discussion at least having a better understanding as to why the other person was as wrong as they were, then we have had a good exchange.

BTW, there is nothing wrong with being a zamboni driver. As a teenager I made my spending money pushing a scraper around the rink and flooding it with a water barrel on bicycle wheels. It was hard work and low pay, but it was honorable and I was proud of the way the rink looked when I was finished each night.
 

luckydog71

Active member
Oct 26, 2003
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The Lizard King said:
Also make sure you buy Canadian made products from Canadian retailers such as Save-On Foods, Rona, The Brick and London Drugs and don't shop at Safeway, Future Shop/Best Buy, Sears, Wallmart, and Home Depot. If you play the market, only invest in Canadian companies. Canadians, as I do as a consumer, should put up or shut the fuck up.
LK – you need to learn to live in a global economy

Companies do not deserve your business because of where their head office is located. They deserve your business because they are the best at what they do; the best service; the best price; the best quality. Your approach will make those companies fat and lazy. They will not be able to compete in the outside world and you are the one who will be subsidizing their poor performance.

The NA automakers (GM / Ford / Chrysler) are perfect examples of an industry that was protected from foreign competition under the banner Buy American or Buy Canadian. They are now getting their asses kicked. It is likely with a few years GM will no longer be the biggest auto maker. What a blow to the ego that will be.
 
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