The doom of all sports cars is coming

rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
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Cue the dramatic headline, hehe.
Europe (UK included) will now make speed-limiting systems mandatory in all cars, in the next several years.

https://driving.ca/auto-news/news/gps-linked-speed-limiters-mandatory-in-every-new-car-sold-in-europe

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47715415


And if its coming there, you can expect it everywhere soon enough. Combine that with self-driving car tech, and you can see how the ability to control your own vehicle, with your own skill and on your own terms, is going to be chipped away - until we're all just passengers.

It's already quite hard to justify buying a sports car with performance characteristics which you can never actually use (without either being stuck in dense traffic or breaking the law). So, what would be the point of buying any sports car at all, after something like mandatory speed limiting is installed and neuters it at all times? Goodbye to Porsche, Ferrari, Lotus, etc. - why manufacture vehicles that nobody will buy because they don't even have the potential to perform?
 

westcoastrider1982

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Jul 16, 2011
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Not quite as dramatic but I don’t like the fact that manual transmission cars are becoming more and more rare these days!
Yes as a daily driver I prefer automatic, especially driving a full size work truck.
I don’t consider a car “sporty” if it has an automatic. Sports car or even “sports” sedan.
I’d love to get myself an Audi S4 for example.....can’t fucking get it in manual anymore!!

Yeah yeah I know the new DSG autos that are in high end cars shift incredibly fast but it’s all about the driving experience too! Nothing beats racking through the gears on the sea to sky highway!
 

rlock

Well-known member
May 20, 2015
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Did you check out the International Auto Show this past week. Wish I could've been there. Toyota brought back the Supra after decades. Looks good from the photos. Also a McLaren Senna was suppose to have been there. That's a car I would like to take for a spin.

https://vancouverinternationalautoshow.com/experience/concepts-and-debuts/


I did. In fact there was more than one McLaren Senna in attendance.
Not to mention a lot of other pretty hot cars. Lots of hybrid and e-vehicles too; I test drove a couple of them.
 

wetnose

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Mar 23, 2003
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Not just speed limiters, but some countries are aiming to ban sales of vehicles with internal combustion engines by 2030. Not that far away, all things considered.
 

badbadboy

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Nov 2, 2006
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Not quite as dramatic but I don’t like the fact that manual transmission cars are becoming more and more rare these days!
Yes as a daily driver I prefer automatic, especially driving a full size work truck.
I don’t consider a car “sporty” if it has an automatic. Sports car or even “sports” sedan.
I’d love to get myself an Audi S4 for example.....can’t fucking get it in manual anymore!!

Yeah yeah I know the new DSG autos that are in high end cars shift incredibly fast but it’s all about the driving experience too! Nothing beats racking through the gears on the sea to sky highway!
Sea to Sky on a day like today can't be beat. Pity the cops are around literally every turn these days.

When Porsche announced their GT 3 trackable car was only coming in auto, their fans went nuts. Lots are going away from the stick. Props to Ford for coming out (again) last year with a Mustang Bullitt in 6 speed MT and auto wasn't even an option. I would have bought one but local dealers wanted $20k over MSRP. I was thinking of flying to Regina to get one at list price and driving it back.

Personally I don't mind a MT in traffic but I rarely commute these days. Day in day out, I'd go auto for sure.

Pass the 6 speed with some 94 octane please :thumb:
 

Deguire

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Aug 23, 2018
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I did see a report that even the legislators may be backing off a bit. Speed would not be limited mechanically but a warning system woould blare at a driver if he exceeded the local limit. It's all nonsense, of course, and doesn't save lives. You can't legislate against stupidity. I've been stuck on a U.S. highway behind two semis, one passing the other. Both governed, of course, but as luck would have it, one of them could do 1mph more than the other. Mile after mile after mile.....until there was a huge tail-back of very frustrated drivers, all devoutly blessing their politicians for introducing these essential safety measures and celebrating all the lives not lost. Yeah, right! Sorry, doesn't work.
 

johnnydepth

Average Sized Member
Nov 14, 2015
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Now this would be an even better idea than a speed limiter. Have a build in speed detector system that automatically issues a ticket every time the car goes over the speed limit. Its going to solve the problem for 99% of the cars out there.
 

80watts

Well-known member
May 20, 2004
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Victoria
The ICE getting banned by 2030. Well if it could burn hydrogen gas (by product of combustion is water), it won't be. But burning carbon fuels, yeah I can see that, but alot of infrastructure has to be made in order to eliminate carbon fuels.

Every country should be madly producing solar cells but they aren't.... and put them towards a central grid for power. limits are battery storage means.

Chances are in the future it will either be a fuel cell car or a ICE burning hydrogen.

A fuel cell car can have a battery as the floor, making any type of interior space limitless.

Storage of hydrogen is problematic, as a liquid and even as a compressed gas. A car travelling at over 80 km/h getting into an accident could turn into a fireball.

I don't like the idea of speed limiting, it taking away something that has been there when driving a car fast.... I also think as speeding as a form of freedom....
 

loopy69

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Oct 14, 2009
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All of these new infrastructures and vehicles are expensive for Government and the general public , so just cannot happen very fast . I doubt they can speed limit my 1963 Mercury 4x4 , well its not to fast anyway :)
 

rlock

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May 20, 2015
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I did see a report that even the legislators may be backing off a bit. Speed would not be limited mechanically but a warning system woould blare at a driver if he exceeded the local limit. It's all nonsense, of course, and doesn't save lives. You can't legislate against stupidity. I've been stuck on a U.S. highway behind two semis, one passing the other. Both governed, of course, but as luck would have it, one of them could do 1mph more than the other. Mile after mile after mile.....until there was a huge tail-back of very frustrated drivers, all devoutly blessing their politicians for introducing these essential safety measures and celebrating all the lives not lost. Yeah, right! Sorry, doesn't work.

I imagine that they are getting huge pushback already, from every auto manufacturer in Europe. The negative impact on engineering innovation alone would be immense. In fact, I expect the legislators in Europe are going to get their heads bitten off on this one.

It's one thing to try and eliminate carbon emissions, and even with the obvious survival motive quite hard enough. But to go after performance, like speed is now a negative, that just strikes at the heart of why people have cars at all. If people wanted to get somewhere slowly, they could take a bus or a bicycle... or walk.

This sounds like something the Soviet Bloc would do. "No Ferrari to dream about for you, not even a VW Golf. But you can have a Trabant. It goes exactly as fast as every other car or truck or tractor out there."



Now this would be an even better idea than a speed limiter. Have a build in speed detector system that automatically issues a ticket every time the car goes over the speed limit. Its going to solve the problem for 99% of the cars out there.
Oh, god it would be like Demolition Man or something. "John Spartan, you have been fined 20 credits for a violation of the drivers' morality statute...."

Recently, I rented a car while I was back east, and every time I hit 130 km/h, it would sound some ominous warning, like it was going to snitch on me or something.


The ICE getting banned by 2030. Well if it could burn hydrogen gas (by product of combustion is water), it won't be. But burning carbon fuels, yeah I can see that, but alot of infrastructure has to be made in order to eliminate carbon fuels.

Every country should be madly producing solar cells but they aren't.... and put them towards a central grid for power. limits are battery storage means.

Chances are in the future it will either be a fuel cell car or a ICE burning hydrogen.

A fuel cell car can have a battery as the floor, making any type of interior space limitless.

Storage of hydrogen is problematic, as a liquid and even as a compressed gas. A car travelling at over 80 km/h getting into an accident could turn into a fireball.

Hydrogen is no worse than gasoline or propane for being explosive / flammable, but as you say, it is harder (in general) to store. Still, the tanks they store them in are pretty tough.
I can't see it powering direct combustion engines though - at least not for road travel. More likely it will be used to power a combo of fuel cells + electric motors. As such, the hybrid vehicles of tomorrow would not be using carbon-emitting engines, but likely would be a combo of plug-in electric with hydrogen fuel cells to extend range or boost power when needed.

The availability of hydrogen as an element is of course, massive. But the useful availability of hydrogen as a fuel - replacing carbon fuels - depends entirely on what source of energy is being used to extract it. It takes a lot of energy.
Burning any carbon fuel (coal, natural gas, etc.) to create "clean" hydrogen would put society no further ahead. The energy input for cracking would have to depend on either renewables (solar, tidal, wind), or nuclear (expending uranium or thorium as fuel).

Same principle goes for BC's LNG project. The energy used by LNG for cooling and storage is massive. If they are burning gas to cool and store gas, the GHG emissions will be massive also, so it's hardly a solution to curb carbon emissions. To have any prospect of improving the emissions situation at all, the whole plant has to be electrified - drawing power from the BC hydroelectric grid. (Makes the purpose of the Site C project clearer now, huh?)
 

jgg

In the air again.
Apr 14, 2015
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Interestingly enough, most of today's safety factors are a result of cars going fast. Indy, Formula, GrandPrix, NASCAR, NHRA.
 

Forthedevil

Banned
Jan 18, 2019
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Cue the dramatic headline, hehe.
Europe (UK included) will now make speed-limiting systems mandatory in all cars, in the next several years.

https://driving.ca/auto-news/news/gps-linked-speed-limiters-mandatory-in-every-new-car-sold-in-europe

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47715415


And if its coming there, you can expect it everywhere soon enough. Combine that with self-driving car tech, and you can see how the ability to control your own vehicle, with your own skill and on your own terms, is going to be chipped away - until we're all just passengers.

It's already quite hard to justify buying a sports car with performance characteristics which you can never actually use (without either being stuck in dense traffic or breaking the law). So, what would be the point of buying any sports car at all, after something like mandatory speed limiting is installed and neuters it at all times? Goodbye to Porsche, Ferrari, Lotus, etc. - why manufacture vehicles that nobody will buy because they don't even have the potential to perform?
As the pilot, I hope I always have a way to override the computer to drive myself or go as fast as I care to. Remember the Boeing 737 Max?
 

JimDandy

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May 17, 2004
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As suggested in the original post in this thread, autonomous vehicles will, I agree, bring on the eventual death knell of driver enjoyment through the driving experience.

When autonomous vehicles eventually become the norm, it will become almost impossible to insure a human driven vehicle. Think about it. If you choose to take control of a vehicle and then injure someone through your driving mistake, you will be liable for an incredibly large lawsuit. You chose to take control when a computer could have done it safely and avoided the accident?!?! How dare you!!! You are clearly a selfish bastard and deserve to pay the huge amount of $$$ awarded to the other injured party. Even minor accidents will likely have major payouts for the unnecessary anguish suffered by the injured party.

The only option you will have if you want to self-drive (did I just invent a new phrase?) is to join some kind of private track club where you race around a track with other selfish bastards like yourself and you sign a hundred wavers stating that if you are injured in an accident, you will have no legal recourse. Btw, this does suggest a good investment possibility. The value of private tracks will probably increase astronomically as all of us selfish bastards that want to self-drive join these private track clubs.

JD
 

westcoastrider1982

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Jul 16, 2011
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Also as much as I’m fascinated by the prospect of more vehicles going electric I’d never be happy with an electric sports car! Something about the rumble of a V8 under the hood really gets my heart going!
Having said that if a company comes out with a plug in style hybrid pick up that has the same capabilities as my current truck and it’s affordable I’d be first in line to buy it!
 

dickdoes

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Feb 1, 2011
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I have a Lexus LC500, V8 480HP and I love it. Probably won’t be able to get one in a few years so I will keep this baby alive as long as I am. But that is my toy. Might go electric on my next non-toy car.
 

Amerix

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May 7, 2004
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Not quite as dramatic but I don’t like the fact that manual transmission cars are becoming more and more rare these days!
Yeah. I've only owned manuals. Apparently CVT's get better mileage though. And under 4% of North American sales go to manuals. So away they go. You can still buy some these days, I'll probably get one more before they are completely gone. Those CVT's have terrible maintenance records so far :/ I'll give them another 10 years to make one that doesn't fall apart after 100K.
 

storm rider

Banned
Dec 6, 2008
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Calgary
Not quite as dramatic but I don’t like the fact that manual transmission cars are becoming more and more rare these days!
Yes as a daily driver I prefer automatic, especially driving a full size work truck.
I don’t consider a car “sporty” if it has an automatic. Sports car or even “sports” sedan.
I’d love to get myself an Audi S4 for example.....can’t fucking get it in manual anymore!!

Yeah yeah I know the new DSG autos that are in high end cars shift incredibly fast but it’s all about the driving experience too! Nothing beats racking through the gears on the sea to sky highway!
Last brand new truck I bought and it cost me $35,000 I bought it because it had a manual transmission. Six on the floor with a 260 HP V-6.Nothing finer than a stick shift for the control and performance of a vehicle.From being able to ladder shift from 1st to 4th and to 6th by running the revs high is pure enjoyment.Being able to drop shift to slow down whilst not stomping on the brake pedal is nice as well.

SR
 

westcoastrider1982

Well-known member
Jul 16, 2011
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Last brand new truck I bought and it cost me $35,000 I bought it because it had a manual transmission. Six on the floor with a 260 HP V-6.Nothing finer than a stick shift for the control and performance of a vehicle.From being able to ladder shift from 1st to 4th and to 6th by running the revs high is pure enjoyment.Being able to drop shift to slow down whilst not stomping on the brake pedal is nice as well.

SR
I worked briefly at a couple car dealers years ago. VW and Toyota.
Seemed like at VW it was 60% auto, 40% stick, with the Golf, GTI(mostly manual) and Jetta. Passat was hardly ever manual.
People liked their VW cars in manual
Toyota it was like 99.9% auto in their cars, think I saw like 2 manual Corolla’s out of the 100’s I drove.
The Tacoma truck it was about 60% auto 40% manual.
This was like 14 years ago so who knows about today.
I drive a full size work truck and can’t be bothered with manual.
If I had the cashto buy, or the space to park a second “fun” car, it would be manual for sure. I reminisce about the old days when I had my ‘89 Mustang GT...fun car!!
Hopefully today’s Sport’s cars, Mustang, Camaro etc come available in manual for years to come.
Unfortunately I heard it has to do with emissions and fuel economy standards that is forcing manufacturers to go away from manuals. Computer controlled automatic transmissions have become much more efficient etc!
This is why you’re starting to see 10 speed automatics coming out. Keeps the engines at the most efficient rpm’s throughout different driving speeds!
 
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