Q for Sybian WTF wrong with trout fishing on ranchlands?

[Sporting]

http://thetyee.ca/News/2015/12/07/N...e=weekly&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=071215
Came across this article. Our resident rancher should be able to shed light on this nobleman denies peasants controversy

 

[westwoody]

The "activist" argues that everyone should have access to natural resources that are on private land. That would go over well with owners of gold mines or oil deposits.

The fish are on private property, the lake is stocked by the owner. The fish are not natural resources, they were put there by someone as a cash crop. By the activist's logic, he should be able to harvest cattle that are on private property.

Just because the owner is rich doesn't mean everyone can help themselves to his property.

 

[sybian]

I'm on the fence about this subject...I'm a Rancher first, and Sportsman second. I understand both points of view.
Most old Homesteads where built next too water, and what most don't realize is that most lakes in the interior did not have fish in them.
Kamloops trout where introduced slowly by ranch families as a food source over the last 120 years or so. This has been proven up here in Indian Land and Fishing claims with the investigations of old diaries ,being introduced into evidence.
The private property around a body of water, is just that..It's private. Unlike the U.S., you cannot own a body or course of water, and even some creeks have setbacks, like my place, that you cannot touch, or alter...You also cannot stop anyone from walking up that watercourse...If they are a Canadian citizen.
I am familiar with this Court Case, and the Douglas Lake Ranch has used barriers to expand the lake for profit, which legally alters their property lines..Remember , the owners are American.
They have blocked in a natural species, with an unatural device, and altered a natural water course...Which I believe is illegal.
If a business owner enhances wildlife habitat on his private property..In Canada you DO NOT own the wildlife. The laws are very clear.The animals you choose to corral, and rear ,must be Domestic or Feral...In other words introduced into that environment.
Their arguement may be..the kamloops trout where introduced as a food source for the Ranch.
But that is a very grey area.
On the otherhand, the Anglers must cross private property to fish..That is against the law...Unless they walk up a creekbed, that all British Columbians own.
I've had anglers in my watercourse here a few times..And I know there is nothing I can do about it.
I think in this case there is a pissing contest between locals who are organized...And multi-millionares that are just showing everyone "Who They Are"
If they are real Ranchers and not billionares...they would know the unwritten laws of the land.

Don't mess with my Animals.
Don't mess with my Fence.
Don't ever.. mess with my Family.

 

[sybian]

Westwoody......Unless you own the mineral rights under your property...You only own the first foot of ground.
This gives private and Government industry the loophole to develop mineral claims on private property....Or start legal proceedings to expropriate.
It's a bullshit law BTW!

 

[Lo-ki]

Don't mess with my Animals.
Don't mess with my Fence.
Don't ever.. mess with my Family.

And don't mess with SYBIAN....

 

[MissingOne]

Westwoody......Unless you own the mineral rights under your property...You only own the first foot of ground.
This gives private and Government industry the loophole to develop mineral claims on private property....Or start legal proceedings to expropriate.
It's a bullshit law BTW!

Sybian is basically correct, but it isn't quite that cut-and-dried. I won't burden the good readers of PERB with a bunch of legal text, but if anyone actually cares, or is concerned that a prospector is about to start tromping around in their garden, they can find the applicable law by going to the link below and reading Section 19.

http://www.bclaws.ca/EPLibraries/bclaws_new/document/ID/freeside/00_96292_01#section19

There are very few places in B.C. where mineral rights are privately owned. Even the companies mining the minerals don't own the rights; they just lease them from the crown; that is to say from the public, you and me.

What mining companies, or any other resource users, including Sybian, can and can't do is changing pretty rapidly though. I doubt that anyone in government cares much about Sybian's rights, but everybody in government cares, or makes a great effort to appear to care, about aboriginal rights these days, now that the supreme court has said that they (we) must care.

 

[sybian]

....^...Yep!
I just lost a huge area to Mule Deer habitat, and Indian Hunting grounds....I am fortunate that Cows have a mind of their own ,and go too the good grasslands.
Min. of Environment , and their pencil pushers can move them out themselves.
When you own and lease massive tracts of land, and the natives have an interest in that land, it becomes a matter of negotiations and sometimes massive amounts of money.
I've always found it interesting that they[The Government and Indians] have a lot of interest in private and Crown Leased lands..Yet when forestry moves into an area to clearcut for logs, it's just ramrodded through.
Yet if I want to do anything with my private land, even move an imaginary property line...The Government red tape, and negotiations with Indian Affairs is measured in years...On my bankroll, veiling it behind "Archeological Significance"

 

[sybian]

You know...I've been thinking on this all damn day.
Why doesn't Douglas Lake just get a Fish Farming Permit, because they probably have a water licsence for that lake already.
If they can prove that the Kamloops trout where planted there a 100 years ago...I happen to know they where BTW...They become livestock in a managed area.
Again it's a grey area but it could give them grounds in a legal battle.

I'd also like too add......Douglas Lake ranch rents cabins out next too that lake, and charges big bucks for "Private Clients" to catch trophy trout, out of their "Private Lake".

 

[sybian]

Hatrick your right.....I know when "Hunters and Sportsmen" leave their mess on my private Ranchlands, they spoil it for everyone else.
Some are good and decent people with respect, others are just assholes.
You can almost tell how the conversation is going too go when I ride up too their camp by how tidy it is.
I'm very proud of my place, and it's clean ,organized, and well kept. I'd like nothing better than to share it, as long as it doesn't create a mess or work for me.
The only solution is to point out that it's mine, and nobody is welcome...Most large land owners are mentally labeled assholes by some...But it is the very few, ruining it for the many.

 

[vancity_cowboy]

i was persistent and eventually got permission to use the old roads to cross that ranch to get at country up behind it towards the okanagan

in the process i had to meet the ranch foreman who told me that a cow was basically something that turned grass into money. the less grass there was, the less money the ranch made

so the rules were simple:
1) leave all gates the same way i found them and respect the fences
2) see rule 1
3) leave no litter behind
4) stick to the roads and use proper turnarounds instead of driving over the grass
5) leave the cattle alone
6) no fires

out of courtesy, i always drove to the ranch and left a message when i was using the roads. i followed the rules, and even went out of my way to report to the ranch about a roaming grizzly bear that i saw. when i was finished i let them know and i was told that i would always be welcomed back. this was not the current owners, although possibly the same hands are running the ranch operations

 

[sybian]

I will tell Ace ,you said Hello...

I have a few people that cruise through here that I have the same agreement with, just don't tell anyone.
I wouldn't want to ruin my perfect asshole reputation.

 

[Ray]

I was invited to spend a weekend there a few years ago, but I had a previous commitment that weekend. Should have taken him up on it.