Workout Advice

Dr.Nick

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Jan 14, 2005
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I'd appreciate some feedback from anyone out there who is an experienced trainer/weight lifter. After spending the past year doing alot of cardio and some weight lifting to lose about 30 lbs of flab I am ready to pack on some muscle. I have been working out and doing the nutrition thing but I am confused as to how best work certain smaller muscle groups and have gotten conflicting opinion from even a couple of trainers. When I work larger muscle groups like chest, lats, thighs I go quite heavy, use strict form and do 6-10 reps to exhaustion depending on the set. I'm not sure with triceps, biceps, calves, neck and shoulders. Some say to go heavy and few (6-8) reps to exhaustion, while others say to go lighter and more reps (12-15) because these smaller muscle groups respond better lots of light reps. Also how often should I work out now. One of the trainers (he is an ex-Mr. Canada) told me because I am in my 40's and my body doesn't recuperate as fast, I should take a couple of days between workouts to let my body/muscles recuperate. I guess after working out daily for over a year I feel lazy only working out 3X a week now.
Thanks for any input.
 

georgebushmoron

jus call me MR. President
Mar 25, 2003
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You should do a search for the word "workout". I posted 2 long threads on workout status and advice in the Lounge. Let me know how it goes.
 

Dr.Nick

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Jan 14, 2005
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Thanks for the reply and advice GBM. I should add, the only other limiting factor for me is that I don't have 2-3 hours in a day to work out. I have a very busy professional life plus I am a single parent. Therefore the most I can usually spare in a day is about an hour early morning or after my daughter is in bed. That's why I prefer to work out a muscle group or 2, every day rather than the 3-4 hour workouts 3 times a week some people do.
Any advice on ab work. I do crunches with an ab roller because of 2 degenerated IV discs in my lower back. Can't do the incline/decline crunches, leg lifts and other exercises so many others use.
PS: I've gotta get me a couple of assistants like yours.
 
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Dr.Nick

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Thanks ladies. I think an hour a day with either of you would just about do it.
 

Azcanuck

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In my experience, heavier weights with lower reps (to exhaustion) will build bulk. Lghter weights with higher reps will do more toning
 

westwoody

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Jun 10, 2004
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Dr.Nick said:
triceps, biceps
Superset easy-curls 2 or 3 sets of 8 for biceps and same for machine triceps pushdown.
Then superset hammer curls with tricep extensions.
Shrugs on a low pulley machine,sets of 10-12 with heavy weight, work your way up over time! It's very easy to screw up your neck. Or superset shrugs on the machine with dumbell shrugs.
and shoulders.
"Arnold" or W press with heavy dumbells, be careful with form,6-8 reps and heavy weights. Some people stand with their back against a wall or machine to prevent hyperextending their back. Superset dumbell lateral raises with front raises, low weights (only 20 or 25 pound dumbells) with 12-15 reps. The deltoids are also easy to damage so go easy and light at first.

The best book for exercises I have seen is "Strength Training Anatomy" by Frederic Delavier. And keep up the cardio as well. Six-pack abs come from diet and cardio, not from crunches. Try alternating days of weight training with days of cardio, do each three days a week and take Sunday off.
Everybody is different and has their own thing that works for them.
 
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Dr.Nick

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Cardio or No Cardio??
One of the trainers I dealt with told me at this point not to do alot (1x weekly) cardio because : #1 I want my body using the calories I intake to build muscle. You don't want to just burn them off doing cardio and leave nothing for my muscles. #2 If I work out hard with weights my muscles will burn calories while working out and resting.

OR

Do I do cardio 0n off days and just eat more? I hear some guys say that as long as they work out hard you can/should eat like a pig (even have a cheat day where you eat anything) and you'll be fine.

Thanks so far for all the helpful advice.
 

westwoody

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Get rid of him

Dr.Nick said:
One of the trainers I dealt with told me at this point not to do alot (1x weekly) cardio because : #1 I want my body using the calories I intake to build muscle. You don't want to just burn them off doing cardio and leave nothing for my muscles. #2 If I work out hard with weights my muscles will burn calories while working out and resting
That's just out and out stupid. Ask him if he knows the difference between aerobic and anaerobic excercise. Ask him to help you determine your lactate threshold and your VO2 Max.

Take Av's advice and get the Body For Life book, it's got all you need.
 
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mikes

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Nov 8, 2004
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Congrats on losing 30 lbs, that's great!

My advice would be higher reps (20+) and lower weight.

I found going too heavy too fast gave me stretch marks.

I realise everyone is different, but if I could do it over again I'd go high reps low weight.
In fact, I'd deep six the traditional weightlifting routine and concentrate on a bodyball workout.
 

Chingada

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Feb 14, 2004
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Annalise Lane said:
Anything longer then an hour work out all you are doing is cardio.

Find a trainer you can trust :eek:
Not true.

When you work out aerobically - heart rate at or slightly below 75% maximum - you burn fat as a fuel and we all have enough fat to run a couple of marathons. But when you cross that 75% threshold you go into an anerobic state where your body burns carbohydrate for fuel. We only have enough carbohydrate to last about an hour in this state before "hitting the wall."
 

Dr.Nick

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Thanks to everyone who contributed their advice. I have looked into a few of the references passed on to me and think that I've got a plan for the next few months. Going to an 8 day cycle mixing weight lifting, cardio (cycle and swimming) and rest days. Hopefully this will allow me to put on the muscle I want and keep the old body in shape for the future. Keep in touch.
 

The Real Tiger

"Magnificent Bastard"
Nov 30, 2005
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For us older guys... 225 reps (15 sets of 15)

Nick,

Here's something for us old guys that builds the muscle but protects the joints at the same time... for example bicep curls

Get together a set of dumbbells 6, 8, 10, 12, 15, 20, 25, 30 pounds, start with the 6 pounds do 15 reps, wait one minute, 15 x 8#, one minute, until you get to the 30#... do the 15 reps... if you can (took me months to do) and then back down to the 25#, 20#, 15#, etc. with one minute rests between sets. I swear you will be shaking doing the last set of 6#! If some young stud laughs at you just tell what you did and challenge him to do the same... then sit back and grin!

Amazing pump, near complete exhaustion, but no serious weight to kill form or strain the joints. These 225's can be adapted to your favorite exercises and are best done after at least 20 minutes of aerobic activity but because of the time involved (about 30 mintes per body part) you likely don't have time to do more than one or two body parts per workout. Just skip the same body part on consecutive days if you work out 5 days a week... a cycle such as biceps Monday, Tuesday triceps, Wednesday back. Thursday chest, Friday legs works well.
 

LonelyGhost

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Apr 26, 2004
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Hi Nick,

you can work out everyday ... just don't work the same muscle/groups back to back. And i would combine the cardio with your lifting, here's a sample:

Day 1: Legs
Warm up on bike ... do about 15- 20 minutes of light cycling to really get legs warmed up
Do leg presses (since you have disc problems don't do squats) ... start with X weight for 12- 15 reps; raise weight by 5 - 10% and try again; keep raising weight and the reps should come down naturally.

Do some calf raises, same as above.

Cool down with another 15 -20 minutes of cycling.

Day 2: Chest/Shoulders/Triceps

Warm-up and do your chest routine ... then shoulders ... then a bit of tricep work. Always 'stack' the weights up and the reps down ... don't do less than 6-8 reps.

Day 3: Back and Biceps

Day 4: Cycle, swim, walk, aerobics class, play squash, tennis etc. or take a day off.

back to day 1.

With your disc problems you should not do 'ab' work but do 'core training' ... this involves abdominal hollowing to develop stabilizers -- this will increase your strength and help lower back.

The 'key' to successful training is to move (after a year) to 'instinct' training -- you should know by now what works, what doesn't, how often to train and when to rest.

Just because a routine worked for someone else does NOT mean it will work for you ... we can only provide some recommendations, but you have to start learning what is really working and how to keep it working.

I like to work out a little bit everyday so the consistency is there, but will take a day off if i am just tired and will go for a long walk instead.

The other thing i like to do is 'shock' my system by never doing the same exercise twice in a row ... if I did incline press for chest, i will do bench press the next time ... sometimes I will pre-exhaust and others just jump in.

The other thing to start looking into is having light, medium and heavy routines and alternate those as well. you want to aim towards building heavier and heavier weights and then taper off to let your body heal while still providing some stimulation ... then work back up and beyond where you were before.

But the bottom line is that if it doesn't feel good or hurts, then stop doing it and do something else. If you don't listen to what your body is telling you then you will eventually have major problems.
 

LonelyGhost

Telefunkin
Apr 26, 2004
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I-robot said:
do what works for you.

and don't forget that as you workout, your body changes and what worked yesterday may not work tomorrow!

most people make about 80% of their gains in the first two years of working out ... after that they struggle for each tiny increment.

that is why most bodybuilders and martial artists etc typically 'peak' after a couple years and have to develop their own styles and routines that work best for them so they can continue to make gains.

doing the same routine for 20 years isn't going to do anything -- nor is there any secret method to success:

the people who are successful are those who learnt to listen to their own body and acted accordingly.


:)
 

Discombobbled

Banned
Mar 12, 2005
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Dr.Nick said:
I'd appreciate some feedback from anyone out there who is an experienced trainer/weight lifter. After spending the past year doing alot of cardio and some weight lifting to lose about 30 lbs of flab I am ready to pack on some muscle. I have been working out and doing the nutrition thing but I am confused as to how best work certain smaller muscle groups and have gotten conflicting opinion from even a couple of trainers. When I work larger muscle groups like chest, lats, thighs I go quite heavy, use strict form and do 6-10 reps to exhaustion depending on the set. I'm not sure with triceps, biceps, calves, neck and shoulders. Some say to go heavy and few (6-8) reps to exhaustion, while others say to go lighter and more reps (12-15) because these smaller muscle groups respond better lots of light reps. Also how often should I work out now. One of the trainers (he is an ex-Mr. Canada) told me because I am in my 40's and my body doesn't recuperate as fast, I should take a couple of days between workouts to let my body/muscles recuperate. I guess after working out daily for over a year I feel lazy only working out 3X a week now.
Thanks for any input.
If you want to build mass, I'd recommend high intensity training. Here's a couple sites:

http://www.mikementzer.com/

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/hitworkout.htm
 

Dr.Nick

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Jan 14, 2005
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Winnipeg
Once again, THANKS for all the great advice to you all. ONE LAST QUESTION.
Because of my busy schedule and the fact I am a single parent, I work out at home after the kid's bedtime. I think I mentioned this before. Therefore I do not have access to some of the machines/equipment that is found in Gyms. I do have a fairly good set of weights and a good bench but lately I've been checking out the BOWFLEX ads. On TV this sure looks good but is it really? My impression of some of these type of machines is that they are great for toning but don't give the intensity one needs for building mass. I may be totally wrong though. Does anyone out there have any first hand knowledge they can share on this subject?
 

westwoody

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Jun 10, 2004
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Try the Bowflex Canadian distributor on Dublin, someone told me they have some machines you can try out on display. A friend bought a Bowflex Extreme but I don't like it at all. It just doesn't have the right "feel", but that is a personal thing and you would have to try it yourself.
Whatever you do, DO NOT buy one without trying it out for yourself, thoroughly. No matter what anyone else says about it:you are the one using it. It's a lot of money and you could buy a nice Smith machine or multi station machine for the same money, and I would consider those a better investment.
 

westwoody

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Jun 10, 2004
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Ingrid said:
I'm attempting to add squats and lunges usng free weights into my routine
You can do light squats with dumbells but make sure your back is straight. Try doing them in a doorway with your back against the doorframe so you can feel if your back is curving too much. My sweetie (she's 5-11, about 170 pounds, and VERY strong, stronger than most guys) does five sets of fifteen on a Life Fitness Smith machine at the Y, and supersets them with light leg extensions on another machine. Then she supersets split squats with an Olympic bar-with light weights!-with leg curls on the leg curl machine. If you do the split squat you can skip the lunge, loading the knee when it is bent at an acute (greater than 90 degrees) angle really stresses the knee joint.I wouldn't worry about calf raises, they are only for bodybuilders who need huge calves to compete, nobody else needs to build their calves.
Machines are good for squats because knees are so easily ruined. I have first hand experience. Stick with machines and you can get as strong as you want.
Trainers can be good but make sure they are qualified, not just muscleheads.
 

LonelyGhost

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Apr 26, 2004
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Dr.Nick said:
lately I've been checking out the BOWFLEX ads. On TV this sure looks good but is it really? My impression of some of these type of machines is that they are great for toning but don't give the intensity one needs for building mass. I may be totally wrong though. Does anyone out there have any first hand knowledge they can share on this subject?
#1 resistence is resistence and that's what is needed to build muscle.

#2 i have a bowflex and it is weird compared to free weights, and you do still lose some of the additional stabilizer work that you get with free weights

however, if you want something for home and don't have room for the whole free weight gym stuff then it is very good to keep in shape and even gain some muscle.

the newer ones are better than the older ones because they have made some changes in how they work that is a great improvement.

the bowflex is highly recommended for people with back problems as you can train without strain!
 
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