Attawapiskat - Canadas Great Shame

Fudd

Banned
Apr 30, 2004
1,037
0
0
This children of Attawapiskat

 

Tugela

New member
Oct 26, 2010
1,919
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Maybe they should move to some place that has more resources if they can't support themselves there. Just saying.

The subtext is that all the rest of us should support them because they can't get their act together.
 

chilli

Member
Jul 25, 2005
994
12
18
Why do you call this "Canada's great shame"?

The federal gov't sent up someone to look over the books - and they were refused entry.

My guess, the village chiefs have something to hide.

Once the full story comes out, I wouldn't be surprized if you have 3 or 4 chiefs making $100k a year while their children
live day to day in poverty.
 

uncleg

Well-known member
Jul 25, 2006
5,461
591
113

storm rider

Banned
Dec 6, 2008
2,545
6
0
Calgary
The shame is that the Feds have pumped $90 million into the place since 2006 and the place is still the shit hole it is, under band management. The biggest shame is that it's all being laid on the Gov't and the taxpayers as our problem to solve..........

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j...5Ki7Bg&usg=AFQjCNFSFoZA5-nLLbManaASNGKx91_veA
The big question is......where did that 90 million go?....it is not pocket change....yes there may be a housing crisis on that reserve....but where did the 90 go?.....I think some people had their hands in the cookie jar.

SR
 

Smilf

Banned
Jun 29, 2011
392
0
0
Calgary
First of all the reason why they're in the position that they're in is because there was a diesel oil spill there over 30 years ago that nobody took responsibility in cleaning up (the company or the govt). The people on the reserve have serious health problems and some have been born with defects, the children there have no decent school, a bunch of portable buildings complete with mould etc due to that spill. So before you go accusing them of anything or being crooked and spending your hard earned tax money, bitch at your govt for not cleaning up a mess it help make and putting people's lives at risk.
 

WrongMan

New member
May 28, 2009
261
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Why do you call this "Canada's great shame"?

The federal gov't sent up someone to look over the books - and they were refused entry.

My guess, the village chiefs have something to hide.

Once the full story comes out, I wouldn't be surprized if you have 3 or 4 chiefs making $100k a year while their children
live day to day in poverty.
Let get our facts straight first.

The Feds sent an 3rd party manager at cost of $1300 per day plus expenses, billed to the community, to managed the community. They already been audited, in fact First Nations are audited all the time. More so that most governments. What the Federal new crimes bill going to cost? I don't know, but I can you what Lac Ronge Indian Band spent on housing in 2004.

There are many reasons for this crisis. But the main two are ...

1.) Lack of capacity, First Nation governments do not have the human capacity (The skills) to deal with the problem. If a person has a degree he or she is going to move to the big city for a job. So that reserve doesn't have educated talent pool to hire to run the band, what it does have is a lot of people with less than high school educations or high school education trying to deal with major problems.

The last co-management sent from the Feds said there wasn't people stealing money (2000 to 2004). There was a lot of questionable moves. For example their way to deal with 60% unemployment is hire as many people as they can and put them on band payroll.

2.) The Canadian Government doesn't give a s..... Their policy is to ignore the issue until it goes away. The Canadian government is responsible for First Nations living on reserve. The Province is responsible for First Nations living off reserve. The goal of the Feds is to ignore the issue until it becomes a Provincial issue. They haven't increased funding to match inflation since the 90s.

For example a First Nations kid who goes to a Provincial public school that school will get the same amount of funding as any other kid. If that First Nation kid goes to a INAC (feds) school that school get a lot less amount than the Provincial school. Then you ask yourself why First Nations don't finish high school.

That INAC school is a joke up there. The school was built on contaminated land. I think they found about it in 2007 and asked for a new school. De Beers the Diamond company said they provide the leadership, the work crews and most of the material to build a new school. The Federal government many years still hasn't done a thing to move that new school forward. The reason they haven't because INAC's budget is in decline and they can't afford it.

The Feds need to solve the housing crisis, get that school fixed so the kids can learn and work with De Beers on job training. Right now there is about 500 people at the Diamond mine and only 80-100 are First Nation. They don't have the skill to work there so they need job training in order to get the skill to work there.
 

Smilf

Banned
Jun 29, 2011
392
0
0
Calgary
Indian Affairs Minister Duncan says that the Federal Government is picking up the tab for the 3rd party manager and the 22 portables. http://news.nationalpost.com/2011/12/11/conservatives-sending-attawapiskat-22-modular-homes/


Yup, it's clear from their financial statements that they "employ" more people than is necessary to run a band of 1,546 people. My complaint, when I look at who is paid, is that the economic benefit of that is restricted to some "choice" families AND, more importantly, is at the cost of a reasonable maintenance budget for their housing. I DO NOT believe that bands should have to build houses - that is the responsibility of the government who has the resources to do it cost effectively. However, the band does need to maintain their housing and their current housing budget is inadequate for even minor maintenance. They also have no major maintenance reserve fund.



The sickening thing about the whole thing is that it's only an issue when the media is covering it. Their MP has been in the House of Commons since 2004 and there isn't a peep out of him on housing. He's worked to replace the school, but not a word on housing.



It seems that their MP and Indian Affairs has been working hard on building a new school. There is actually a budget and a commitment of funds for it.
See my post above and that promise of getting them a school has been going on for YEARS. The girl (Shannen) that started creating awareness about the kids not having a school has since passed away due to health complications and was nominated for youth nobel peace prize. http://www.fncfcs.com/shannensdream/ Many fund raising efforts have been made, construction companies etc were willing to donate materials, the govt refused to assist in getting the materials there.
 

vancity_cowboy

hard riding member
Jan 27, 2008
5,499
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on yer ignore list
as long as the federal government has a department known as indian and northern affairs, 'we' will have a problem with most of our 'first nations'. as long as we have reserves, most of our first nations will not be able to help themselves

if you segregate people, you will have problems with segregation
 

Tugela

New member
Oct 26, 2010
1,919
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Yeah lousy 6 year old children! get a job & pay your rent:rolleyes:
6 year old children have families. Those families are living in an environment where they can't support themselves. Rather than looking for endless handouts, maybe it would be a better idea to go somewhere where they can support themselves, like everone else.
 

Tugela

New member
Oct 26, 2010
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What has happened with the housing in Attawaspiskat is that 20 years ago they got their current housing dropped on them. Now, those houses are 20 years old and everything is worn out. The housing budget probably is insufficient for regular maintenance, replacing furnaces, stoves, fridges, etc is beyond the capability of the funds allocated. What they need is a trained property manager and a realistic housing budget.
What they need is a sustainable economy, and they pretty clearly don't have an economy at all, all of it is basically handouts. Their members that do generate income move off reservation so they don't have to contribute (but, of course, still keep all the benefits that comes with status), so it ends up that the only people contributing are the Canadian taxpayers, basically forever. Their own people don't care, so why should we? They need to get their act together and take care of this stuff themselves, like every other Canadian. Failing that, if they can't support themselves in the environement, they need to move somewhere where they can do that.

When you read this story it is all about what other people are not doing, but what is glaringly absent is what THEY are doing about it. I don't have a problem with government stepping in and helping out a community in an emergency. It is when that emergency is a permanent state of affairs and the community itself is doing nothing about it except casting doefull eyes, that is when I have a problem. I have no sympathy with these folk. They need to move, and that is that.
 

DavidMR

New member
Mar 27, 2009
872
0
0
Why do you call this "Canada's great shame"?

The federal gov't sent up someone to look over the books - and they were refused entry.

My guess, the village chiefs have something to hide.

Once the full story comes out, I wouldn't be surprized if you have 3 or 4 chiefs making $100k a year while their children
live day to day in poverty.
This is such routine Tory victim blaming it's classic.

Did you know what this auditor is going to be paid? $300K a year.

And the bands books are open to the Govt in any event.
 

DavidMR

New member
Mar 27, 2009
872
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0
What they need is a sustainable economy, and they pretty clearly don't have an economy at all, all of it is basically handouts. Their members that do generate income move off reservation so they don't have to contribute (but, of course, still keep all the benefits that comes with status), so it ends up that the only people contributing are the Canadian taxpayers, basically forever. Their own people don't care, so why should we? They need to get their act together and take care of this stuff themselves, like every other Canadian. Failing that, if they can't support themselves in the environement, they need to move somewhere where they can do that.

When you read this story it is all about what other people are not doing, but what is glaringly absent is what THEY are doing about it. I don't have a problem with government stepping in and helping out a community in an emergency. It is when that emergency is a permanent state of affairs and the community itself is doing nothing about it except casting doefull eyes, that is when I have a problem. I have no sympathy with these folk. They need to move, and that is that.
I agree they need an sustainable economy. So does the whole world for that matter!

Putting the onus on them to move is preposterous, though. Move with what? Buy homes where, and with what? Even if some of their structures were sound they would have no market value in that isolated location if they left.
 

Smilf

Banned
Jun 29, 2011
392
0
0
Calgary
What exactly are all the benefits of having status please tell me? Because I have status and have yet to see very many. I can get some tax breaks on items, IF I choose to travel to stores that offer them (which aren't floating all over the lower mainland). I don't get a free education, because my band office can't afford it - not enough people on the reserve, means less funding to my reserve (do you know the qualifications for getting a "free education"? Because I do and it's not as simple as you think it is). I paid for my college and university education via this job and my other job. I don't get a free house, because I don't live on a reserve nor do I want to, but I respect my people's rights to do so. You seem to forget how much money the govt owes my people, blame them, not my people. You're talking YEARS upon years of unpaid land claim settlements, unpaid 60's scoop settlements, residential school survivor settlements (who are getting taken to the cleaners). Where do you think that the majority of oil, gas, other minerals and flashy diamonds come from? Our reserves, that the govt SAYS they're not going to rape and pillage but still do it any way, leaving the land a complete and utter wasteland. Having your children stolen from you to "cure them from being Indian" and sent off to boarding schools where they were raped and tortured and in some instances never seen again, is hardly a handout. EDUCATE yourself on FACTS, not what you think is true, because your posts show you don't have a clue and are misinformed.

And people like this don't help the situation either http://youtu.be/w1iHT1TaiNI

What they need is a sustainable economy, and they pretty clearly don't have an economy at all, all of it is basically handouts. Their members that do generate income move off reservation so they don't have to contribute (but, of course, still keep all the benefits that comes with status), so it ends up that the only people contributing are the Canadian taxpayers, basically forever. Their own people don't care, so why should we? They need to get their act together and take care of this stuff themselves, like every other Canadian. Failing that, if they can't support themselves in the environement, they need to move somewhere where they can do that.

When you read this story it is all about what other people are not doing, but what is glaringly absent is what THEY are doing about it. I don't have a problem with government stepping in and helping out a community in an emergency. It is when that emergency is a permanent state of affairs and the community itself is doing nothing about it except casting doefull eyes, that is when I have a problem. I have no sympathy with these folk. They need to move, and that is that.
 
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DavidMR

New member
Mar 27, 2009
872
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0
Composting Toilets????? While the Liberal/Socialist anarchists may think that Composting Toilets are absolutely wonderful - I'll bet that they have never tried using one that is exposed to -20C for months. Simply put - the toilet doesn't compost. It fills up and thereafter cannot be used. They'd be better served by bringing up some bushes to hide behind while "doing their stuff".

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/p...s-housing-help/article2267544/?service=mobile
Al, I don't see anything from Charlie Angus about composting toilets. However, it looks like the Red Cross brought some in.
 

DavidMR

New member
Mar 27, 2009
872
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0
????? Where did I mention Charlie Angus in that post ??????
You didn't, but you did say something about Liberals/Socialists which I took to mean some MP from either the NDP or the Liberals.

I agree that any non-heated system would obviously have problems, not just in the far north, but in any part of Canada where you can expect temperatures below minus 10 or so. IOWs, everywhere except the BC coast.

However, we do know people who live in Prince George where they do get some severe winter weather, -20C, -30C, even some spells of -40C. And some of they are on rural lots with septics, and there is no problem if the lines are at the right depth. I don't know what geology they've got in Attawapiskat, but if it's permafrost I guess that would exclude simple buried lines.
 
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